Betrayal at Calradia 0.2 - a Midkemia Mod for 1.x - Released July 15, 2009

[peppy]

Yay, finally a midkemia mod. WOOHOO!!  This actually made me sign up on the forum!  Ever since I started playing this game (.751) I've always been thinking of how cool it would be if there was a mod like this. Although, I actually thought that Novindus would be the perfect place to set the map. Seeing as they are many different mercenary bands and the such. I though it'd be cool if it was set when the emerald queens army was taking over the whole place and u could either fight on her side or the defending side. The only thing there wouldn't really be much variation between the two sides as they are pretty much just two armies of mercanaries. Unless you got the jeshandi or whatever involved.

Anyway, I think both options would work well. You could also consider doing the invasion of the emerald queen's army. Like after they've taken over Yilth(or ylith i forgot) and general fadawah makes himself king of the bitter sea. And the kingdom forces need to reclaim the land and whatnot. And then if that was happening you could also put how kesh was trying to take over krondor and stuff. Well, yeah. I can't wait. 

Toodles. 

 

[Gaz-1]

Hi! I'm a big fan of the series, and I'll just throw some random ideas and see if I can get them coherent enough.

I had a list of unit types that I had planned out for a Medieval 2: Total War:

Midkemia (Humans)

Yabon Heavy Foot (Heavy infantry)
Krondorian Lancers (Heavy Cavalry)
Shamata Redshirts (Heavy infantry)
Keshian Dog Soldiers (Heavy infantry)
Valeman Mercenaries (Heavy infantry)
Valeman Skirmishers (Light infantry)
Keshian Charioteers (Cavalry)
Hadati Mountain Fighters (Light Infantry)
	Can hide in grass
	Bonus in snow or rock
Izmali Shadow Warriors (Light Infantry)
	Can hide anywhere
Kingdom Archers (Archers)
Kingdom Crossbowmen (Archers)
Dog Soldier Archers (Archers)
Roldem Marines (Light Infantry)
LaMutian Infantry (Heavy Infantry)
Knights of St. Gabalt (Heavy Cavalry)
Armengarian Mounted Infantry (Light Cavalry)
Keshian Inner Guard (Heavy Infantry)
Ashuntai Horsemen (Light Cavalry)
Ashuntai Mounted Archers (Light Cavalry/Archers)
Jal-pur fighters (Light Infantry)
	Can hide in sand
	Bonus on sand
Krondorian Royal Guard (Heavy Infantry)
Natalese Rangers (Archers)
	Can hide in grass
	Bonus in trees
Krondorian "Desperate Men" (Light Infantry)
	Can hide in grass
	Can disguise unit
Kingdom Lancers (Heavy Cavalry)
Armengarian Heavy Foot (Heavy Infantry)
Kingdom Spearmen (Spearmen)
Quegan Pirates (Light Infantry)
Kingdom Footmen (Heavy Infantry)
Imperial Tracksmen (Archers)
	Can hide in grass
	Bonus in trees
Trueblood Inner Guard (Spearmen)
Yabonese Mounted Infantry (Light Cavalry)
Thunderhome Nomads (Light Cavalry)

Heavy Infantry
8
Light Infantry
9
Spearmen
2
Heavy Cavalry
3
Light Cavalry
5
Archers
6
Other
1

As for the factions, I think splitting the Kingdom in two has it's merits, for one, it gives more faction choice.
So the factions I can see are: Kingdom Western Realm, Kingdom East, Kesh, Free Cites and Tsurani
Bandits would consist of Woodland\Mountain Moredhel, Quegan Pirates, Durbin Slavers, Goblin bands.
Mercenaries would be various Humans, Elves or Dwarves. Perhaps an occaisional Moredhel?

Western Realm: Led by The Prince of Krondor. Mix of Kingdom soldiers and Yabonese Levies. Higher tier units include Krondorian Lancers, Guides and Hadati Fighters
Kingdom East: Led by the King of Isles. Mainly Kingdom Soldiers, as well as auxiliaries from the East and South. Higher Tier units include Royal Knights.
Kesh: Led by a Keshian General (since I'm assuming it's only a little bit of Kesh). Has access to Dog Troops, Desertmen. Higher Tier units include Truebloods, Izmalis.
Free Cities: Led by a Councilman. Mainly militias, with some trained troops. Higher Tier units include Natalese Rangers.
Tsurani: Led by the Supreme Commander (on this side of the rift, at least). Access to heavy infantry, with some rudimentary calvalry. Higher tier units include Death Oath Warriors, plus the high ranks of the Tsurani army.

I was thinking of cho-ja, but it seemed wrong for a human to "promote" into cho-ja.

The best time for this should be the ending years of the Riftwar. Mad King in the East, Tsurani pushing all over the place, Kesh boldly raiding up the borders, slavers raiding seaside communities, the West taking the brunt of the Tsurani invasion. Ditto for the Free Cities.

Edit: Rudimentary troop trees

Kingdom West 12

Kingdom Citizen	->Kingdom Skirmisher	->Kingdom Soldier	->Kingdom Seargent
								->Kingdom Rider		->Kingdom Lancer	->Krondorian Lancer
			
					->Kingdom Bowman	->Krondorian Guide

		->Yabonese Levyman	->Yabon Heavy Footman	->Haditi Mountainfighter

Kingdom East 10

Kingdom Recruit ->Kingdom Militia	->Kingdom Man-At-Arms	->Knight-Lieutenant	->Knight Captain -> Knight Marshall
								->Kingdom Captain
					->Kingdom Archer	->Kingdom Marksman
								->Auxillary Skirmisher

Kesh 11

Keshian Conscript	->Keshian Auxillariy 	->Dog Soldier		->Dog Soldier Captain	->Trueblood Guard
									->Dog Soldier Archer	->Imperial Tracksman
						->Jal-Pur Desertman	->Izmali		->Izmali Honour Guard
									->Ashanti Horseman	->Ashanti Warchief

Free Cities of Natal 11

Natalese Peasant	->Natalese Militia 		->Natalese Levyman	->Natalese Regulars	->Natalese Veterans
										->Natalese Horseman	->Natalese Cavalry
			->Natalese Peasant Archer	->Natalese Archer	->Natalese Marksmen	->Natalese Rangers

Tsurani 12

Tsurani Freeman		->Tsurani Recruit	->Tsurani Regular	->Patrol Leader		->Strike Leader		->Force Commander
												->Death Oath Warrior
									->Tsurani Horseman
						->Tsurani Archer

			        ->White Robe		->Grey Robe		->Black Robe

 

[sepa]

Hello,

Gaz-1:

Great work.

Creating the 4 factions as:

• Kingdom West
• Kingdom East
• Tsurani
• Kesh

is a good idea IMO.
However, I would have traded Free Cities for Moredhel and their goblin, troll and giant friends.
Lets set relations as Kingdom is at war Tsurani, allied with West/East.
Moredhel are at war with everybody.
Kesh is neutral and on the border only - lets trigger their attack at set day/event.

I do not know much about what troop trees are possible, but maybe you can do it for moredhel like:

Dark Elf -> ...
Goblin -> ...
Troll -> ...
Giant -> ...

Where all of them are actually Tier 2 troops, and Tier 1 is a 'Moredhel Trooper' which is not recruitable - you can just get one of the Tier 2 troops.
I know that player can recruit higher level troops at villages sometimes, so it must be possible to do.
That way u an fit the Cho-Ja, too.

One more thing though:
Gaz-1, can you find out the exact gear the troops were using? I do not agree for some of them as for 'Heavy' - i.e. people of Armengar were using only leather armour IIRC. The same for Dog Soldiers, I do think they were not heavy troops.
It would be nice if some1 can go through the books and provide us with some citations.

Ok, I got a free moment now so I'll try to do some mapping

sepa

 

[HokieBT]

Gaz-1 - thanks very much, thats some great idea's and information!  I do agree with sepa that Moredhel (with goblins, trolls, etc) would make it more interesting than the Free Cities, so I think I will start coding for 5 faction:  Kingdom West, Kingdom East, Tsurani, Kesh, and Moredhel.  Sepa's working on the map, but I bet we can have it primarily be the kingdom, with some a partial north for the Mordhel, and a partial South for Kesh.    anyway, thanks again guys, I'll continue on the code with these troops, etc.

 

[Gaz-1]

Awww. I really wanted to have Natalese Rangers in the game. Maybe make them mercenaries?

I've never seen higher tier units recruited at a village before, so I'll take your word for it. Ok, this is my idea for the Northlands troop tree.

Morehdel Recruit -> Morehdel Moss Trooper -> Morehdel Captain -> Morehdel Chieftain -> Black Slayer
                        -> Morehdel Scout          -> Morehdel Bowman

Goblin -> Goblin Raider -> Goblin Berserker -> Goblin Fanatic

Troll  -> Mountain Troll

Giant

Weapons Runner -> Renegade -> Renegade Captain
                                          -> Nighthawk

Moss troopers and everything else first are '2nd tier' units.

From the books:
Dog Soldiers: Helm ending with spike, Chain neck guard, Metal Cuirass, Ballooning trousers tucked in knee-high black boots. Round Shield and Long Scimitar. Any archers would be using recurve bows.

Hadati: Tartan Plaid and leather breeches. Slender and long sword (sabre?) and half-sword.

Black Slayers: Black heavy chain with plates, black full helm "fashioned with a dragon carved in bas relief on top, it's downswept wings covering the sides. Two narrow slits provided vision for the wearer, and four small holes allowed him to breathe."

I made a small test mod last yesterday where I tried to implement the Kingdom West Troop Tree. The Yabonese levy were fair foot soldiers, although only in leather at best, and the Heavy Foot were athletic, chainmail or better but below coat of plates. Mainly I don't think the books ever had descriptions for Yabonese Troops. Otherwise, most troops would just be an amalgamation of chain, leather and weapons seen in Mount&Blade.

Notes:
Jal-Pur Desertmen and Izmalis will always wear light armour or worse (robes and light clothing). This is offset by a high foot speed and using massively damaging weapons like large falchions or scimitars.
Tsurani wear their laminated hide armour. But their athletics should be through the roof to make up for shoddy cavalry.
Great Ones and the apprentices wear robes.
Imperial Tracksmen and Krondorian Guides wear light chain at best. This is offset by their skill in bows and foot speed.
Cho-ja at best wear the Tsurani Helmets denoting rank.
Ashuntai would be the closest to Kerghits. Although I believe they should have ranged weapons in addition to whatever they have.
Morehdel should only be chain and below, because they favour speed and ferocity to protection.

And if Northlands are a faction, should Morehdel and goblins still be part of the bandits? Otherwise there's still Durbin Slavers, Quegan Pirates, Sunset Island Raiders, Highwaymen, normal bandits...

 

[sepa]

Nice.

Moredhel of coz will not be bandits any more, so u can put something else in And if you will ask HokieBT very, very nicely he may add more factions in future releases

Well, if you can go through my previous post about troops and correct / add details that are wrong / missing and provide it with citations everybody reading this thread will be great full for sure. Citations are needed to select the closest possible gear for troops, or to create one if needed, as you surely know (but some of the readers may not).

I'm working on the map in every free moment I have, yet there are not many of them, as I have a lot on my head lately, let me mention moving only...
I'll post the map as soon as it will be usable (right now I got 70% of landscape ok and about 30% of height map done, still no rivers, cities and parties). This means in a few days hopefully, when the height map will be ready.

Well, one of the main thing which slows me down is my wife - think twice before u decide to get one

Have fun,
sepa

 

[HokieBT]

hehe.  I updated the description in the first post and included a screen shot of the progress sepa's making on the map, it is looking great so far!  I also need to update in the code what lords owns each town? There are 18 in the native game, so its probably easiest to code 18 towns or less.  I figure we can say the Tsurani have captured like 2-3 towns around the rift, Moredhel have 2-3 towns in the north, and then the rest will be split between the East & West Kingdom and Kesh?  I figure if we can get the town names finalized then we can start to place them on the map and update the code, etc.

 

[Raithe]

Hokie did you get my Pm? haven't heard back from you.

 

[Gaz-1]

These are my suggestion for what towns are towns or castles. I'll try to spread the towns out as best as possible.

Kingdom West:
Towns:Krondor, Crydee, Ylith, Yabon
Castles: Tyr-Sog, Landreth, Darkmoor, Loriel, Land's End

Kingdom East:
Towns: Rillanon, Salador, Romney, Bas-Tyra (dunno about this one since it's so close to Rillanon),
Castles: Dorgin, Timons, Highcastle, Sethanon, Northwarden

Kesh
Towns: Shamata(hotly contested), Durbin, Kampari, LiMeth
Castles:

Tsurani
Towns: LaMut, Zun, Hawks Hollow
Castles:

Northlands
Towns: Sar-Sargoth, Harlech, Wyke
Castles: Moraelin, Caern, Raglam

Tsurani would only have enclaves around their territory rather than castles, and I'm not sure about Keshian castles apart from disused ruins (aka Nighthawk hideout)

 

[HokieBT]

Gaz-1 - that looks good to me, thanks!  I'll try to add those and then send sepa an updated parties.txt file so he can use it when he is working on the map, and if we need to make minor changes then we can.

 

[sepa]

Ello,

Guys, we have Roldem on the map also... and I can move the map a bit to the left (by taking out the sea) and fit in the whole Eastern Kingdoms...

I'll do it soon, if I only figure how to do it easily...

Thanks for help, Gaz-1.

Have fun
sepa

 

[Gaz-1]

Ok, assuming the timeline is still during the peak of the riftwar, these are the Lords by Town and castle(where possible)

Kingdom West
Krondor: Prince Erland
Crydee: Duke Borric
Yabon: Duke Brucal
Darkmoor: Baron von Darkmoor

Duke of the Southern Marches

Kindom East
Rillanon: King Rodric III
Bas-Tyra: Duke Guy du Bas-Tyra
Salador: Duke Kerus
Romney: Duke Romney
Highcaste: Baron Highcastle
Northwarden: Baron Northwarden
(some of the naming conventions are pretty simple )

Kesh
Shamata: Lord Hazara-Khan

Tsurani
Force Commander
Force Subcommander

I don't know about the Eastern Kingdoms. Roldem's power comes from it's navy, and the other nations are too fractured to be considered a faction. Maybe having neutral cities to represent the Eastern Kingdoms and Free Cities.

And the map is brilliant! It's huge, but the locations and features fit pretty well, unfortunately it does seem a bit empty with all the space and the handful of neutral factions running about. Great work, sepa!

 

[Tachyon]

Wow, a mod based off the Betrayal at Krondor! One of the best RPG games ever.

Are you planning to include characters from the game such as Locklear, Owyn, Pug, James, Gorath e.t.c in your mod?

 

[milamber]

Wow, a mod based off the Betrayal at Krondor! One of the best RPG games ever.

Are you planning to include characters from the game such as Locklear, Owyn, Pug, James, Gorath e.t.c in your mod?

as far as i know this mod is based more on feists books than games
\

 

[HokieBT]

as far as i know this mod is based more on feists books than games

yeah, originally my thought was to do a Betrayal at Krondor theme and thats why I named the mod Betrayal at Calradia, etc.  But in recent discussion it has evolved into 5 factions around the time of the riftwar, so maybe I should consider changing the name to this mod?  What do people think, any opinions/suggestions/etc.

 

[sepa]

Hey,

HokieBT:
I would stick to the name for now, because more people know the game than the books. Or eventually rename it, but leave something like 'Betrayal at Krondor / Midkemia series based mod' so people will recognize it easily. But no suggestions for the name from me this time... maybe later

Gaz-1:
What about Rodez etc? I thought it may be fitted as the 'Zendar' neutral town, similar with others.

Tachyon
Well, I would also love to see some characters from game, as well as from books in the mod, and I think it is pretty possible, or even sure

As for the map, I'll reduce the 'walkable' area a bit, and leave the rest as far boundaries, maybe to open them later... who knows 
Anyhow, my idea of the mod is to make the travel distances vast, travel time very long (as close to the original book travel time as possible) while making game time run much faster to compensate, fill the map with small parties patrolling around towns/castles (this will need to use parties such as rescued prisoners and similar instead of lords) and focus on the storyline and missions, possibly adding the pigeons for communications, so the player can command other armies remotely...
In future releases, that is 
I think it would be more fun if one can just wonder around the map doing some other stuff than constant fighting... maybe we can go closer to the Betrayal at Krondor form? Small party going around on various missions, ambushes, big battles with allies only, sometimes patrols with soldiers from one of the factions, or maybe the 'duty' in the border castle as the sergeant etc... But this is all the far future...

Have fun

 

[Tachyon]

HokieBT,

Here's a suggestion, why don't you include temples in the mod? In the Betrayal at Krondor game, you could visit these temples and get your weapons blessed. It'd be cool if you could implement something like that in the mod.

For e.g : Donate <xxx> amount of coins to a temple to gain a bonus unique to that temple (like increased agility for x no. of days> or increased weapon damage e.t.c

 

[HokieBT]

Here's a suggestion, why don't you include temples in the mod? In the Betrayal at Krondor game, you could visit these temples and get your weapons blessed. It'd be cool if you could implement something like that in the mod.

hmm, that is a cool idea, I did add a bunch of armor and other items into my star wars mod that give +1 to various skills, so this is definitely possible.  Probably not for a first release, since I want to keep it fairly simple, but maybe after that.

 

[HokieBT]

ok, looking for more feedback from people about races since there will be a few of them in this mod.

+ Elves (moredhel & eledhel)
+ Humans (kingdom, kesh, tsurani, etc)
+ Dwarf (may not be added right away)
+ Other (trolls, goblins, orcs, giants, etc)

I got permission from Highelf to use some of the model/textures from his Fantasy Mod so was going to start with those.  He has 3 sets of textures that basically re-texture the native face model.

Elf = light & dark skinned, some with warpaint
Orc - greyish skinned
Troll = greenish skinned

So if you can only pick two races from the other group, what should we use the Orc and Troll texture for? I don't think we can do giants, and I think goblins were more common in Midkemia so should we use the green troll texture for that?  Should we include a greyish Orc?  Also, any general comments about these races and if they should have beards, what color their hair was, etc....

 

[sepa]

There were no orc's - use them as goblins.

Elves seems ok.
Giants are just higher than people.

As for the rest I do not remember details.