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We didn't reintroduce "block delay". There were no combat related changes in this regard recently.
To avoid confusion "block delay" is always there (it was in warband and it is in Bannerlord), but in Bannerlord the weight of a weapon makes your block be slower and the blending between the animation also has an affect. We are working on ways to make this better right now, but I can't share any details yet.
In any case there wasn't a reintroduction of block delay and we have no interest in making shadow changes to combat and not telling you guys.
What might have happened is that some other change is causing it. If that's so, we will investigate and fix it. It would be great if you could help us out about it.
Since which patch do you feel it?
(for the beta veterans) Can you share any details of how comparable it is to the older Beta versions?
To avoid confusion "block delay" is always there (it was in warband and it is in Bannerlord), but in Bannerlord the weight of a weapon makes your block be slower and the blending between the animation also has an affect. We are working on ways to make this better right now, but I can't share any details yet.
In any case there wasn't a reintroduction of block delay and we have no interest in making shadow changes to combat and not telling you guys.
What might have happened is that some other change is causing it. If that's so, we will investigate and fix it. It would be great if you could help us out about it.
Since which patch do you feel it?
(for the beta veterans) Can you share any details of how comparable it is to the older Beta versions?
I think it is most similiar to B0.8.1 before the hotfix.
+1, remove this thing or fix it (if it's an unintended effect to some other system you tried to tweak).
+1
I have dueled on both NA (with 113 ping) and EU servers and for me the block delay was really annoying on NA because you couldnt react in time. Mostly of the delay and partially the high ping. When I was on EU I did way better while the delay was being less annyoing. I would like to see it removed because for people that want to play as a *insert region* on *insert other region* servers it is very difficult for them to be "good". The block delay function just does not work for this game at all. It is more of an annoyance than a feature.
I have dueled on both NA (with 113 ping) and EU servers and for me the block delay was really annoying on NA because you couldnt react in time. Mostly of the delay and partially the high ping. When I was on EU I did way better while the delay was being less annyoing. I would like to see it removed because for people that want to play as a *insert region* on *insert other region* servers it is very difficult for them to be "good". The block delay function just does not work for this game at all. It is more of an annoyance than a feature.
At the moment its just 50/50 gambling. Either you spam feints and get a free hit, because the enemy cant block that fast or you bet that the enemy will feint and spam, its too fast aswell so enemy probably wont be able to react. I dont think there needs to be a big change or everything will be too reactable.
The blocking could be networking related aswell, or it could add to making it unreactable?
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NIN3 made a response to the same thread that was posted in the feedback and suggestions section. Should probably check it out for clarification. Here's the quote.
There was no block delay in Warband, because you could tap block. While holding a swing, tap right click: In Warband, the block animation happens instantly. In Bannerlord, you don't block unless you hold right click for .5 seconds, and then it can block. To return the Warband responsiveness feel, you'd have to make the blending between swing and block animation much faster, or instant like Warband, OR keep the blending but add blocking frames instantly so tap blocking is possible once again (tap blocking in fast-paced fights is a lot more intuitive than holding right click for .5 seconds before blocking and I'm sure it's the reason so many people complain about blocking)
Bring back tap blocking please!
@NIN3 It feels quite similar to blocking early on in the beta process, in that individual blocks mostly work fine but transitioning from attacks or other blocks feels unresponsive. Particularly for 2 handers.
@baca When the devs refer to block delay they are talking about the short (like 50ms) lag compensation delay added to blocks which is the same as Warband. What we're referring to is the culmination of animation blending and handling stats that make different weapons all have different blocking speeds, which makes blocks feel delayed.
FYI you can block much quicker if you release the attack button and tap RMB. I agree tap blocking should return though, especially for multiple blocks as right now it feels like you can't block more than 1 or 2 incoming attacks regardless of reaction speed and skill.
@baca When the devs refer to block delay they are talking about the short (like 50ms) lag compensation delay added to blocks which is the same as Warband. What we're referring to is the culmination of animation blending and handling stats that make different weapons all have different blocking speeds, which makes blocks feel delayed.
FYI you can block much quicker if you release the attack button and tap RMB. I agree tap blocking should return though, especially for multiple blocks as right now it feels like you can't block more than 1 or 2 incoming attacks regardless of reaction speed and skill.
The feints should be fixed in order to stop the glitched animations. Also I believe block animation should be faster because rn some weapons can swing 4/5 (if using the glitched feints) times before your block animation is over. The difference between Warband is that attacks and blocks were much more responsive. Rn I feel like I’m trying to block with 200 ping but attacking with 0 ping cuz of the glitch
I don't feel that anything has been reintroduced, I just think that we've never progressed enough in terms of optimising that block delay or reduce the blending animation time that it takes for you to transitionate to block. We just insist and realise more melee flaws as we we were able to test further by the long requested duels, that finally came.
In that video Arni shared, we could barely block any feint(in that video we did block a few because we were aware that we would try them as we were abusing them to record the clips. But in normal conditions, block delay was bigger, and feints were quicker. Taleworlds progressed slightly in both aspects so good job on that. But we need it optimised, right not we can block a few feints, maybe 1 out of 2 or 3, but people spam them because they're extremely quick, hard to read and unpredictable. We need block to be more responsive either by reducing further block delay or making this blend animation time quicker.
I might do some melee feedback new thread(if devs plan on focusing this specific melee topic soon), after the 6-7 hours I spent on duel since it came out yesterday, everyone is now spamming feints on duels on high level, here's my thoughts summed up so far @NIN3
-Either Optimise block delay or Optimise blend animation time when transitioning from idle/moving to block anim.
-Feints are way too quick, specially when Using 2 handed sword. We need to slow them down slightly.
-Need Feints sound effect to detect each time we perform one(specially necesary against rapid/quick feinting)
-Chambers should be harder to block, not sure how to do this but the risk involved executing them right now(which is not low overall, but specially for overhead and stab) doesn't compensate enough to try and be rewarded for doing them well(Quick chamber + Footwork).
Note: [Overhead and Stab Chambers should be easier to execute, all chambers rely now on the weapons straight collision and not body position, but when moving from side to side and with those rapid feints it's almost impossible to chamber those directions, as it relies on the weapon and not entirely your body position. Even standing still they're challenging compared to the difficulty from left and right chamber directions while not feinting.]
-Increase player capsule size, or whatever causes players to be able to 'clip through' eachother when standing too close.
-Damage inconsistencies or Armor absorbtion needs rework(It takes too many hits to kill people, as it's been said since Arcs of swings were fixed):
[Note: It's far more satisfying to play with and vs Voulgier with extra armor(19 armor rating in total) than seargents with 40 to 47 armor. Just experiment yourselves and you'll see, it takes a few two-handed hits or from 2 to 5 one-handed ones to kill someone with 19 armor rating, yet it gets ridiculous once again with the 40-47 armor value, tanking up to 7 hits(hard to make every hit on head/neck and on good area when clip throughs and random rapid feints are constantly done by one or both players)]
I don't think it's really any different from before, only that the duel server allowed to accentuate it. Requoting this from another thread:
I remember that the difference due to the animations/weight was dismissed as negligible in the past, but it really isn't and the inconsistency in timing is very much noticeable, especially when most players hardly remain idle waiting for the opponent's attack to land, and instead try to feint or prepare an attack in the meanwhile which makes blocking significantly slower. Often the time-frame to react and block before receiving an attack is very small, and if you're feinting or readying an attack the animation simply doesn't allow enough time to block it, that's why tap blocking is important. Essentially it's safer to play passive and take turns since that's the only way to block reliably, especially with heavier weapons.
This. I don't understand the logic. Aside from the glitch feints, why can't/shouldn't RMB click speed/actions be as responsive and LMB click speed? Shouldn't they both be affected by the same physics/inhibitors and be executed in equal times? Eg; If a weapon can only block so fast- why can it be swung faster multiple times within the same timeframe? Blocking for all intents is a much more acute move than a slash or thrust- and theoretically in a realistic environment could/needs to be executed in less time than attacks (but for balance, at least equal?)
Input delay of any kind (within the reasonable limitations of an online environment) in a game that prides on the ability to react will always drive the end-user insane when the mind and body react but the virtual extension cannot. It's a tease. I understand network constraints, latency and prediction algorithms will always blur things- but at a client level the TTE (Time-To-Execute) of both LMB and RMB should by synonymous
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