Your Opinion on TW 'No confirmed information on up-coming patch content' Policy

[LyonExodus]

We're talking about multiplayer

my bad then

 

[Goyyyio]

sometimes there are reasons we get ignored. and sometimes we either can't or don't want to comprehend said reasons.

I am a customer too, and maybe a little more as a content creator but if my answers or suggestions get ignored i don't feel frustration towards the devs, TW or the game. i know very well they do their job, like any worker, and might not have time to reply.
Some of the things i have suggested were added or addressed some didn't. but as a customer i don't pretend that anything i say as to be answered, addressed or taken into consideration.

I am just grateful when it is, cause that is not a given not the other way around.
And as this post suggests, the hatred towards the messanger is high in here, makes for an hostile environment and might end up triggering even the nicest of devs. I have been triggered a few times, not great for you mental health.

This last part is not directed to anyone in particular but to anyone who falls in this category:

Rememebr. if you feel like the job you do is not appreciated and you feel disrespected when someone insults your performance. why do you do the same to others?
Doesn't matter if it's hypocrisy, frustration or hatred. you should just be respectful especially TW devs on this forum deserves a crap ton of it. They have no obligation other than a moral one to respond to any of our questions using their free hard earned time.
Obviously this doesn't imply the game should not be criticized, i do my fair share of it too.

Bannerlord will age like wine, just give it time. it even rhymes like a game that will give you good times.
4K Hours and still counting... i don't think it will stop anytime soon.

Sorry bro, but if a company promised you servers 2 years ago, you made countless threads asking where those servers are, and then you get a half arsed answer "considering the option of giving you servers" and then a straight up "no" without an apologize even, you would be quite frustrated, so I see you're clearly missing the context and you're speaking because you can. Nice, kind words! I wouldn't have bought this half baked game 2 years ago if they hadn't lied to us in the first place, so yeah I dont care about the "fine wine" which means modders fixing the game

 

[LyonExodus]

Sorry bro, but if a company promised you servers 2 years ago, you made countless threads asking where those servers are, and then you get a half arsed answer "considering the option of giving you servers" and then a straight up "no" without an apologize even, you would be quite frustrated, so I see you're clearly missing the context and you're speaking because you can.

i don't think i am missing the context.
this is what the title of this thread is about: The fact that TW doesn't give players more info on patches.
then the conversation proceeds with one of TW devs stating that the "policy" has to be used in order to not make people frustrated over not kept "promises" and coming features that get delayed or scrapped. Also the justification and proof of this is the second post in the thread.

And as your comment stated : "you may not know what it feels as a costumer to be ignored completely, which is very frustrating"
so to me it feels like it's in line with the thread.
then you proceed to state that servers have been promised over 2 years ago. so that promise is still an issue to this day.

Am i missing something? to me it feels in line with the conversation.
TW has understood that being too open in the past lead to people complaining and TW is learning now that giving limited information leads to people becoming frustrated. so you see the issue? there is nothing TW can do do please "frustrated customers". that leads to a demanding attitude towards devs and community menagers who engage with us customers.

And why this happens? because people can't get over it... and humans love complaining.

Anyway let me know the fallacies in my logic

 

[Goyyyio]

i don't think i am missing the context.
this is what the title of this thread is about: The fact that TW doesn't give players more info on patches.
then the conversation proceeds with one of TW devs stating that the "policy" has to be used in order to not make people frustrated over not kept "promises" and coming features that get delayed or scrapped. Also the justification and proof of this is the second post in the thread.

And as your comment stated : "you may not know what it feels as a costumer to be ignored completely, which is very frustrating"
so to me it feels like it's in line with the thread.
then you proceed to state that servers have been promised over 2 years ago. so that promise is still an issue to this day.

Am i missing something? to me it feels in line with the conversation.
TW has understood that being too open in the past lead to people complaining and TW is learning now that giving limited information leads to people becoming frustrated. so you see the issue? there is nothing TW can do do please "frustrated customers". that leads to a demanding attitude towards devs and community menagers who engage with us customers.

And why this happens? because people can't get over it... and humans love complaining.

Anyway let me know the fallacies in my logic

There is no fallacy, you just think that being frustrated and stating it means you're "just not over it bro" while actually a word with your customers, an official word with them with an actual decision taken is not too much to ask. Frustrated customers exist not because their own fault but because a game failing to give what it's due. I mean yeah, you can call not receiving what you asked for "complaining" for me it's the fair thing to do. If you go to mcdonalds, ask for a hamburger, get charged for it, and then recieve a lesser product what do you do? Shut up and go home and just eat the lesser product? Yeah sure you can do that, it's not like you won't have a meal, maybe a forgettable one but not the one you were promised lol. Me personally I would ask why was I delivered something else. Now what you're doing is: recieve a lesser product, and then when someone else complains you come at them for wording their complsints. What is the point exactly? I have no idea.

 

[LyonExodus]

@Goyyyio
I agree with your points. I can definitely see what you mean. Bannerlord is definitely not a full price game right now, will probably be one day but both me and you payed the same for the product.
I like your analogy about the Hamburger and i understand it. guess i am just one of those guys that bought the game cause i was intrigued by it and not because of pre-release promises.
If i was i might have a different approach to all of this.

Obviously writing is not the best form to get to understand somebody's view point, so i apologize if i sounded like a douche to you.

Now what you're doing is: recieve a lesser product, and then when someone else complains you come at them for wording their complsints.

i guess what i am doing is realizing oftentimes plans don't go as planned. happens in life, and as a careful planner i can tell you that you can think of 10 different ways you can get over an inconvenience and then number 11 pops up, ruining everything.

I am sure TW have a good reason to not being able to deliver on many aspects as they are self run and don't rely on outside imposed deadlines. That just means that they are extremely slow at bringing features but the positive is that they aren't rushing updates just for the shake of shutting us up. i mean i played the 1.5.8 patch back in the day and that one was close to unplayable.

I understand some people want thing to move faster and that's where our lines of thoughts collide

I am also not blaming people for complaining. like stated in my first post people should criticize, just not in any aggressive manner. We have plenty of evidence that some people just like to upset devs or are straight up toxic to them
i am not talking to you specifically. it just feels disrespectful and counter productive to me and it's something i personally wouldn't do.

Anyway, i should stop bothering you now.

 

[Lesbosisles]

Funny how one dev is communicating and we're getting 4 pages of ****storm, essentially proving Duh right about communicating carelessly being a bad idea.

If there was any communication from the very beginning, we wouldn't have a bunch of angry fans (me included) thinking the devs are ignoring them. You reap what you sow.

 

[Grank]

If there was any communication from the very beginning

If you're talking about the actual "very beginning", there was. They announced the game waaay early and later realized they couldn't do a lot of what they already promised. People naturally got mad that they were lied to, and TW responded with a little bit of cheek here and there causing further outrage. Then they realized that talking too much was a bad idea and stopped talking. Then development was going kinda well, and they started talking again. Then development went to crap again and here we are.

 

[froggyluv]

and TW responded with a little bit of cheek here and there causing further outrage

Remember when Callum said it was an action game with a "sprinkle of strategy/rpg"...that was foretelling

 

[Roy1012]

“Some form in 2016”

 

[Duh_TaleWorlds]

Very amusing. That was in reference to the atrocious moderating in the forum. Now about responding to my comments?

Benefit of doubt it is.

The fact of the matter is that unless you have ridiculously low expectations, the developers being more more "transparent" with the truth isn't going to do much to alleviate concerns. Sure it's the honest way, but it's hardly favourable when we all know how pitiful the truth actually is. They couldn't make it much clearer with their own words and deeds how little they care for the community's concerns at this point.
So what do you genuinely expect them to do? Tell the truth of how inconsequential the changes and additions will be in the future and destroy the last hope some naive dimwits still hold onto and turn even more people against them? They won't tell the truth, and any communication is and will be half-arsed and unexplained, because the truth is inexcusable and embarrassing and no lines of pretend-goody honesty padding is going to soften the tone. Recall the dreaded WHY?™

You have the truth. We listed our larger priorities in the future plans post.

There isn't much substance to respond here other than that. (Aka what "truth" are you missing?)

Instead of arguing over nothing with "yes it is!" and "no it isn't!", you could elaborate on how you think I falsely interpreted your statements.

So to start with...

Not that it really surprises me at this point but if you can't say with a reasonable amount of confidence what you'll be working on next month, that is rough indeed.

Let's look at the actual interaction that you are commenting on...

We all do not gonna blame or hate you for that... but I would like at least a roadmap of features you know are 100% going to make it, even if it's not this patch or next it would be nice to see what is to come

The future plans post contains that information https://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php?threads/future-plans.445840/

Nothing ever is 100%, but the items listed here are all still being pursued (if they haven't already been released).

This is a user asking about features that I know are 100% going to make it. I am referring him to the future plans as it holds the items that were deemed certain enough to be shared. My comment is only an expression of my usual level of caution (aka nothing is ever 100%). Who knows, maybe we will be nuked by next week?

Whatever the case... nothing in what I said concerned my work for the next month. Hence my interpretation that you were misquoting me.

Next up...

To me, the reasoning is more along the lines of "less careful communication has caused frustration and disappointment, so let's communicate more carefully". I also personally don't like making promises on things that I'm not very sure on / don't have a high degree of control over.

"We were too on the nose in the cockeyedness of our development process, let's shut it and leave the muppets to make up excuses for us."

It feels silly to say it, but since it was requested - Clearly, these are different statements. Hence my interpretation that you were putting words in my mouth.

To engage with your statement... I don't think the company or many developers spent a lot of time or text on explaining our internal processes. So I guess what you are actually referring to is that features and content were discussed in the past and were then, at times, changed, delayed or cancelled. Which you seem to criticize with "cockeyedness". Which, to me, seems to encourage an approach that communicates primarily information that is reasonably certain not to be changed, delayed or cancelled. I'm going to skip the last part as it seems to be just throwing insults/flame bait at users that disagree with you.

Back to the more regular bits...

Yes, meme-ing, like the 4k sheep texture running gag. Sure there might be 2-3 idiots around here but that´s not the huge majority.

I find most of those posts discouraging / draining.

I say this in the kindest manner but do you now? It doesn't occur to you that the reactions stem from an understandable anger over the failure of a monetary and emotional investment in a product - the failure you doggedly avoid to mention and refuse to acknowledge. If you're as enthused about keeping up the notoriously tone-deaf HR shtick as you appear to be, maybe you should consider changing desks.

It doesn't really matter what the underlying motivation of the behavior is for how it affects me as an individual. Anyone who has worked in customer service will know what that is like. Just that I'm not actually tasked with customer service And that in this case, it's 2 people having a conversation about the discourse and how it affects them. And a third person coming in and seemingly explaining to one of them that they really have no right to feel how they feel. Which is why I didn't see much point to go beyond...

I say this in the kindest manner but do you now?

Yes.

It is simply how I feel.

Finally...

Do you want me to recite TW's self-proclaimed approach to EA or does that also not mean anything?

That is a different line of argument and one that I have discussed at length before. You are welcome to recite, but I know it and it's unrelated to the core of the argument that you are responding to. Of course, you can open up a new line of argument, but if it's literally just going to be a quote... I don't think it will go anywhere.

I feel like the other parts were already sufficiently addressed in my previous posts, though, you are welcome to point me to what you feel needs further clarifying in that regard. Overall, though, I don't have the impression that you are really looking for a conversation with me personally but more to air grievances - which is fine... it just doesn't require me.