Your Opinion on TW 'No confirmed information on up-coming patch content' Policy

[stevepine]

My personal view is that the negative effect of this policy on the community far outweighs the need for a 'limiting of expectations' - or whatever.

If patch content shifts and changes and things are delayed / taken out of a coming patch - people would absolutely be able to handle that.

But the "almost no info at all " policy, in combination with long waiting times just leads to toxicity and frustration.

What do you think?

 

[MostBlunted]

That´s by far the most stupid thing I´ve ever seen from a company that released an EA game.

Even ****ty companies that released a full game are often able to release a real roadmap.

TWs EA description was and is full of lies. I´ve already said it back then when people noticed that it was just a placeholder game. TWs communication is also on the lowest level I´ve ever seen across different game companies.

At the beginning the white knights always played the "indie company" card, meanwhile this "indie company" made millions of dollars with the EA release. And the communication just got worse since the beginning.

I will never support (buy) any EA game from TW ever again. I just hope that some game magazines will start covering this EA ****show. I mean if they would have sold like 50-100k copies that would be a little bit different...

TW is also only able to behave like this because of their monopol in the genre. Their space game will fail miserably with this incompetence, because it will be compared to other good space games and companies that don´t give a **** about their community.

TW is the opposite of HelloGames.

One of the saddest thing is that TW really thinks they are actually doing a good job when they consider patches like 1.7.1. / 1.7.2 real content updates. And that they think that their communication style is pretty good. They are living on a different planet I guess.

Keep in mind that this "indie game" with all of it´s placeholders, missing features and broken stuff (till today in some cases) back then is/was sold for 40/50€ euros. TW literally sold an alpha version close to the price of a finished tripple A game.

From their POV it´s us that are wrong and not them.

I just hope they´ll license their engine in the future to companies that do care or will just get bought by whoever, can´t get worse anyway. Or that any other company notices the success of Bannerlord (even in it´s state) and start making a similar game but in good.

And of course nobody would start revolting if TW would say:

"Expect feature X in the next patch"
and
"Sorry, but feature X won´t make in the next patch because..."

They had the perfect situation after the EA release:

- sold a truckload of copies
- hype / positive coverage / reviews
- a dedicated community loving Warband/Bannerlord, just check out all those mods
- they received (and still receive) tons of good feedback/suggestions

It´s hard to **** up that hard under this circumstances...but that´s the way they choosed

 

[Duh_TaleWorlds]

If patch content shifts and changes and things are delayed / taken out of a coming patch - people would absolutely be able to handle that.

3 lines into the second post you have

TWs EA description was and is full of lies.

While MostBlunted leans more towards one side of the spectrum, my personal impression is that people in general do expect that discussed / shown content that they want / care about makes it into the game asap or certainly on time (and in the way that they envisioned it) regardless of how many WIP or demo disclaimers, mights, woulds and coulds are added. Indeed, there will even be rather passionate arguments that there is a right to content that was not explicitly promised ("This was in a previous title!").

In a similar vein, even the much smaller scope of "what will be in the patch" has had its episodes of rather passionate reactions when some things didn't go as intended.

Regardless of how justified any of these positions are - they do exist and must imo be taken into account. From my perspective, the communication was less careful before and is more careful now. Both approaches have their benefits and drawbacks.

 

[Roy1012]

Whether Bannerlord was intended to be a grift is up for debate (and pretty irrelevant imo), the fact of the matter is TW knows its finished. The only reason bannerlord sold so many copies was because of the mass amounts of hype and hysteria spread by the hardcore fans/youtubers. After the astronomical failure of Bannerlord to keep anyone entertained for longer than a goldfishes attention span, there is absolutely zero confidence and hope within the community for anything TW will produce. Like @MostBlunted said, the space game will crash and burn because there is actual competition in that sector of gaming. The only reason this game is even popular is because Taleworlds has a monopoly and felt they can put out a terrible product because of that. Problem is nobody trusts you after that, and if they dare to put out another Mount & Blade game (at Bannerlord's development rate, that will be long after we've died and turned to dust) it will be a failure too due to the fact nobody actually cares outside of the hype that's been jinned up by fans. When you alienate those fans, they don't tend to hype your game. Tbh, I wouldn't be surprised if TW is just a company on paper at this point -- the owner(s) cut everyone loose after they made it big with the 2020 "release", took their cash and ran, and are just hiring freelance modders to **** out "updates" every month or so in their free time.

 

[e222143]

Whether Bannerlord was intended to be a grift is up for debate (and pretty irrelevant imo), the fact of the matter is TW knows its finished. The only reason bannerlord sold so many copies was because of the mass amounts of hype and hysteria spread by the hardcore fans/youtubers. After the astronomical failure of Bannerlord to keep anyone entertained for longer than a goldfishes attention span, there is absolutely zero confidence and hope within the community for anything TW will produce. Like @MostBlunted said, the space game will crash and burn because there is actual competition in that sector of gaming. The only reason this game is even popular is because Taleworlds has a monopoly and felt they can put out a terrible product because of that. Problem is nobody trusts you after that, and if they dare to put out another Mount & Blade game (at Bannerlord's development rate, that will be long after we've died and turned to dust) it will be a failure too due to the fact nobody actually cares outside of the hype that's been jinned up by fans. When you alienate those fans, they don't tend to hype your game. Tbh, I wouldn't be surprised if TW is just a company on paper at this point -- the owner(s) cut everyone loose after they made it big with the 2020 "release", took their cash and ran, and are just hiring freelance modders to **** out "updates" every month or so in their free time.

In my opinion, it is only a failure among hardcore fans. Most of the casual players did not consider it a failure.

 

[Younes]

In my opinion, it is only a failure among hardcore fans. Most of the casual players did not consider it a failure.

That's it pretty much. Warband was relatively unknown to most people and for most people who never played warband it's a good game.

You have to be insane to say bannerlord was a finanicial failure.

 

[MostBlunted]

3 lines into the second post you have

And that has nothing to do with TWs policy to not talk about anything related to the upcoming patch but delays of the upcoming patch. Also it´s true...

In a similar vein, even the much smaller scope of "what will be in the patch" has had its episodes of rather passionate reactions when some things didn't go as intended.

Have you one example? Seems like I´ve missed/forgot them all.

 

[Rungsted93]

I think it's an odd case with Bannerlord, pretty much all long time fans (myself included) are disapointed with Bannerlord. But I understand if you've never played any of the previous installments it can be a quite cool game.
Taleworlds decided to cater to the casual crowd alienating their own hardcore fans but earning a ton of money.

 

[MostBlunted]

Taleworlds decided to cater to the casual crowd alienating their own hardcore fans but earning a ton of money.

Which makes sense and is fine. But I´ve not seen any complaints on steam/reddit/here from "casuals" claiming Bannerlord is complex, only that it´s dull, the AI sucks, diplomancy is lacking and so on....it doesn´t make sense in any way to dumb down the game.

 

[Duh_TaleWorlds]

And that has nothing to do with TWs policy to not talk about anything related to the upcoming patch but delays of the upcoming patch. Also it´s true...

It is a response to this

If patch content shifts and changes and things are delayed / taken out of a coming patch - people would absolutely be able to handle that.

Aka the general ability of people to handle content shifts and delays.

Which I presume your statement was - in general - criticizing.

 

[Bjorn The Dead]

We would not talk about this, if at least patches comes at regular time intervals with deadlines but as most of you know it, ZeroDeadline™.

 

[MostBlunted]

Aka the general ability of people to handle content shifts and delays.

This community even says "thanks" for the third delay information post after the last update was released 3 months ago.

Do you really think this community here will start a hate train if you announce feature X for the next update and then have to delay it shortly before the release? Really?

I bet there is not a single person here who prefers no information about the next update over information that may be revoked because of reasons about the next update.

You should check out other game forums about other EA games that have similar "issues" as Bannerlord...

 

[Bjorn The Dead]

only that it´s dull, the AI sucks, diplomancy is lacking and so on

This^.
Reddit is booming with new threads like "Is it worth coming back to play", "How do you deal with late game boredom". And textbook opinion of most of casuals are "this game has a lot of potential but TW should add new things to the game".

 

[Duh_TaleWorlds]

This community even says "thanks" for the third delay information post after the last update was released 3 months ago.

Do you really think this community here will start a hate train if you announce feature X for the next update and then have to delay it shortly before the release? Really?

Some people say thanks, others will attack me for taking holidays Some will defend most development decisions, others will take delays or shifts in content as lies, grifts, etc.

As all communities - it is diverse.

 

[Spinozart1]

I choosed "Other" because I have a mixed feeling.
What's the point to get information about features that are not finished?
We know what to expect here
On the other hand, I feel like TW could probably show more empathy in their approach...
For example, 1.7.2 and e1.8.0(?) are a long awaited patches and just leaving a comment such as "not this week folks" early in the week would avoid unnecessary tension.

 

[stevepine]

Some people say thanks, others will attack me for taking holidays Some will defend most development decisions, others will take delays or shifts in content as lies, grifts, etc.

As all communities - it is diverse.

Come on man. How many people actually attacked you for taking a holiday? They are a tiny, tiny minority ...

I mean I saw one post like that... and I thought to myself " Wow, what a stupid thing to say to Duh".

No fair minded person cares if one dev takes a few days off.

Anyway, back on topic... most people would handle the disappointment of some patch content changes WAY, WAY better than they would handle the silence... and not having any idea what is coming in the next patch.

I would happily bet you real life money on that ! Lol

 

[Grank]

We've known for a long time that the development is going badly and their lack of communication is just a result of that. Still, I prefer this over their previous way of communication, which was horrible. Promising this and that way too early, getting everyone's hopes up, and then cancelling or straight up failing to deliver. However the damage is already done, and no change in communication will fix whatever problems they're having up there. I'm only saying this because I only care about the end product though. If I cared about knowing how the development was going, then I'd be mad too.

 

[Duh_TaleWorlds]

Come on man. How many people actually attacked you for taking a holiday? They are a tiny, tiny minority ...

Plenty of people are meme-ing on "turkish holidays", most in jest, others not so much. But that's besides the point - I was simply stating that there are diverse characters and opinions in this community.

and not having any idea what is coming

They do have an idea of what's coming though. It is detailed in the future plans post. Patches are progressing towards those goals. Certainly, there are some other additions here and there but it's hard to sell that you don't have any idea of where we are going.

 

[stevepine]

They do have an idea of what's coming though. It is detailed in the future plans post. Patches are progressing towards those goals. Certainly, there are some other additions here and there but it's hard to sell that you don't have any idea of where we are going.

I was talking about specific patch content.

And not really knowing what will make it into the next patch... and then having to kind of guess what might be included, if we are lucky.

Not just the more general list of 'future desired / planned features'.

Your'e far from dumb...You know this. Lol ?

 

[Roy1012]

I remember when we’d go months or almost a year without a dev blog. I think they did that so that now when they are doing their lackluster effort, they can say it is an improvement on the 2016 way of doing things.