Catalan Independence

[Lord Brutus]

If that's what it takes.  He orchestrated all this from inside a South African prison, if any of that is true.  He did not flee to Belgium.

 

[Vermillion_Hawk]

That was all before he was arrested. There's a reason why he was arrested.

 

[rebelknight]

What he did, actually and with significant documentation, do, was found a Communist rebel group that operated in cells and planned acts of sabotage.

and that is wrong?
Every rebellions are wrong for you?
Which mean that corrupt government need to be preserved?
Are you that naive to think everything can be fixed peacefully with rainbow and candy?

 

[Lord Brutus]

That was all before he was arrested. There's a reason why he was arrested.

If you believe the propaganda, fine by me.  I prefer it with a little salt.

 

[Vermillion_Hawk]

What he did, actually and with significant documentation, do, was found a Communist rebel group that operated in cells and planned acts of sabotage.

and that is wrong?
Every rebellions are wrong for you?
Which mean that corrupt government need to be preserved?
Are you that naive to think everything can be fixed peacefully with rainbow and candy?

This is why people get annoyed with you and why you will never solve any of your life's problems.

That was all before he was arrested. There's a reason why he was arrested.

If you believe the propaganda, fine by me.  I prefer it with a little salt.

There's an equal amount of propaganda portraying Mandela as some sort of saint. Truth is he was a guy devoted to his cause, and towards the end of his career as a Communist guerrilla he was not afraid to kill people and blow **** up to advance it. Make of that what you will, but don't deny that it was part of the man's life.

 

[Lord Brutus]

I detect no hint of Communism in South Africa's government today.  Nor did he discriminate against white people.

 

[Calradianın bilgesi]

mandela was a good terrorist
he was leader of a non-state organisation that killed civilians with political motivation.

 

[Vermillion_Hawk]

I detect no hint of Communism in South Africa's government today.  Nor did he discriminate against white people.

His time in prison led to a certain amount of reflection on the beliefs of his youth, I would hazard. Not to mention it wouldn't have been as politically expedient by the time he had a shot at political power.

 

[rebelknight]

What he did, actually and with significant documentation, do, was found a Communist rebel group that operated in cells and planned acts of sabotage.

and that is wrong?
Every rebellions are wrong for you?
Which mean that corrupt government need to be preserved?
Are you that naive to think everything can be fixed peacefully with rainbow and candy?

This is why people get annoyed with you and why you will never solve any of your life's pproblems

care to elaborate instead of hitting me in the nuts?
I don't remember insulting you.

 

[Lord Brutus]

I detect no hint of Communism in South Africa's government today.  Nor did he discriminate against white people.

His time in prison led to a certain amount of reflection on the beliefs of his youth, I would hazard. Not to mention it wouldn't have been as politically expedient by the time he had a shot at political power.

Are your eyes brown?

I figure they must be brown.  Your facts are sketchy at best.  Your inferences from them are dubious so your conclusions are flawed.

 

[Dansk viking]

So, instead of flying off to Belgium, Puigdemont should've started an armed rebel group? (That turned out really well for the Basques...) Or should he just have accepted the likely 30 year sentence and become a martyr for his cause? The fact that the Belgian court did not immediately send him back kind of shows how wonky the Spanish rebellion charges are. I sure as hell wouldn't put my last thirty years of good life in the hands of a Spanish court.

 

[Lord Brutus]

So, instead of flying off to Belgium, Puigdemont should've started an armed rebel group? (That turned out really well for the Basques...) Or should he just have accepted the likely 30 year sentence and become a martyr for his cause? The fact that the Belgian court did not immediately send him back kind of shows how wonky the Spanish rebellion charges are. I sure as hell wouldn't put my last thirty years of good life in the hands of a Spanish court.

Without a leader similar to Nelson Mandela, your cause has no chance.  Your leadership lacks conviction and worse, they lack balls.

 

[Dansk viking]

Without a leader similar to Nelson Mandela, your cause has no chance.  Your leadership lacks conviction and worse, they lack balls.

Not really my cause, though I have sympathy for it.

I'll take that as a yes: he needs to become an armed rebel.

 

[Lord Brutus]

Without risk, there is no reward.

 

[Antoine de Saint-Exupéry]

Uh, Brutus, are you really trying to say Mandela wasn't part of a guerilla group? Which he literally admitted himself?

At the beginning of June 1961, after a long and anxious assessment of the South African situation, I, and some colleagues, came to the conclusion that as violence in this country was inevitable, it would be unrealistic and wrong for African leaders to continue preaching peace and non-violence at a time when the Government met our peaceful demands with force.

This conclusion, My Lord, was not easily arrived at. It was when all, only when all else had failed, when all channels of peaceful protest had been barred to us, that the decision was made to embark on violent forms of struggle, and to form Umkhonto we Sizwe. We did so not because we desired such a course, but solely because the Government had left us with no other choice.

 

[Arriguy]

So, instead of flying off to Belgium, Puigdemont should've started an armed rebel group? (That turned out really well for the Basques...) Or should he just have accepted the likely 30 year sentence and become a martyr for his cause?

Yes.

/fin

 

[Lord Brutus]

Uh, Brutus, are you really trying to say Mandela wasn't part of a guerilla group? Which he literally admitted himself?

At the beginning of June 1961, after a long and anxious assessment of the South African situation, I, and some colleagues, came to the conclusion that as violence in this country was inevitable, it would be unrealistic and wrong for African leaders to continue preaching peace and non-violence at a time when the Government met our peaceful demands with force.

This conclusion, My Lord, was not easily arrived at. It was when all, only when all else had failed, when all channels of peaceful protest had been barred to us, that the decision was made to embark on violent forms of struggle, and to form Umkhonto we Sizwe. We did so not because we desired such a course, but solely because the Government had left us with no other choice.

No, I am not saying that, I am advocating that for the supposed leadership in Barcelona.

 

[Dystopian]

So, instead of flying off to Belgium, Puigdemont should've started an armed rebel group? (That turned out really well for the Basques...) Or should he just have accepted the likely 30 year sentence and become a martyr for his cause?

Yes.

/fin

They should do exactly what Basques (ETA) did, give up and live in peace. It's better for everyone.

 

[Arriguy]

While although I agree and think Catalan independence is stupid and counterproductive, I just think if you legitimately believe in something, you should fight for it. I realize peace is better and all that jazz, the breathtaking hypocrisy/spinelessness of Puigdemont disgusts me s'all.

Viva España and all that tho

 

[Antoine de Saint-Exupéry]

It did sound a lot like you were saying that here -

If you believe the propaganda, fine by me.  I prefer it with a little salt.

But alright then. No comment on what you say you meant.