Users who are viewing this thread

iSailor

Recruit
Warband was also guilty of this, but let me elaborate.
I spent most of my Warband gameplay in multiplayer at The Deluge mod, the one I find being the most realistic (no weird things like jumping attacks, shields crumble after 2 hits and bows are pretty inaccurate) and balanced incarnation of M&B up to this day and I think Bannerlord needs to improve.

Current class system in itself isn't that bad (it was in Warband too) but the lack of choosing equipment options is. I never use shields because I deem them unfun for killing the pace and skill of melee combat. However, now with many classes I have no way of skipping them, I have to respawn with all that gear and drop it manually. I always use one melee weapon and one ranged like javelins to be effective at close-mid ranges, but in Bannerlord you usally spawn with 3 items that not only obstruct your vision (like big shield or spear on the back) but also make it impossible to switch weapons quick enough in case you are ambushed. Also, what was wrong with choosing your armor pieces like in Warband? If somebody wants to play as a nude guy with giant sword, let him play like that because it gives him the most fun and is the most effective for him. You also had to be considerate with purchasing your gear - usually buying either better armor or better weapons.

Balance is also really bad right now. Bows were annoying in Warband, but now they are full-blown sniper rifles. It's extremely unfun as the whole gameplay revolves around two teams of archers sniping each other (and occasional troops being randomly trampled by horsemen in between). Inequalities between classes are also staggering. These starting classes are usually being taken out with one hit and archers/better warriors take all the good gear, there's no benefit to choosing the worse ones. Not only their equipment is bad but also their stats are much lower than of better soldiers and thus it is very difficult even for skilled player to outplay higher rank troop at comparable skill level. It is not about skill or tactics anymore, only mindless KDA grind.

And lastly, the biggest culprit that kills the game for me: class progression. In Warband, you would choose the class you feel most comfortable with (is most fun for you) and play it as long as you fit in the quota. If you did well you had better loadout, if you did worse you had worse loadout. You could be the richest or the poorest horseman on the battlefield. But with the current state of the game, you cannot play as the class you like. It is balanced in a way so that the class above has better equipment and stats. I would like to play as a javelin warrior but it is simply much better for me to get high armored archer, pick weapon from the ground and go melee.

Why would you implement all of these fancy handling and physics-based combat if in reality you don't get even a single chance of testing them out? You either are sniped by a bowman or trampled by horses. And even if you reach your destination, you are swarmed by a group of guys with shields who abuse the fact there's no friendly fire and spam attacks till you drop to get these sweet kill points.
 
Last edited:
savage is still a naked 2h guy, with more movement speed (free bonus for naked players)
if you play ****tier units you can spawn in more often
warband was always heavy shieldbased, but the whole community asks for a accuracy nerf (to prevent foot shooting) and to increase the skill ceiling. It always was heavy on teamplay focus aswell, if you wanna be a solo warrior play mordhau
 
savage is still a naked 2h guy, with more movement speed (free bonus for naked players)
if you play ****tier units you can spawn in more often
warband was always heavy shieldbased
I know Warband was heavily shield-based but that doesn't change the fact Bannerlord could've been done differently. With current state of affairs you can't experience the systems we saw in devblogs and the whole game changes into crude button masher.
As for spawning more frequently, it's not really a tradeoff, you are creating fake crowd on the battlefield. These classes weren't intended to be played to win the games but to drop on one hit to give an impression of big battlefield. And even if we take this as an advantage, it doesn't justify taking customization away.
 
I know Warband was heavily shield-based but that doesn't change the fact Bannerlord could've been done differently. With current state of affairs you can't experience the systems we saw in devblogs and the whole game changes into crude button masher.
As for spawning more frequently, it's not really a tradeoff, you are creating fake crowd on the battlefield. These classes weren't intended to be played to win the games but to drop on one hit to give an impression of big battlefield. And even if we take this as an advantage, it doesn't justify taking customization away.
Its simply how archers work. Archers are the ones who add most of the teamfight tactics into the game. So its kinda impossible to change it.

I doubt the accuracy of them will get nerfed since it makes them accesible for newer players.
 
Its simply how archers work. Archers are the ones who add most of the teamfight tactics into the game. So its kinda impossible to change it.

I doubt the accuracy of them will get nerfed since it makes them accesible for newer players.
As I stated in my original post, archery in The Deluge was handled amazingly. Basically in The Deluge crossair is as big when standing as it is in Bannerlord/Warband when moving. However, in the native game the crossair is so tight it provides pin-point accuracy. This is not fun to go up against and certainly not fair as you can't even juke your way around if you play against an experienced archer. He will just noscope 360 you at any time. The only reason why it doesn't happen all the time now is that there are many new/bad players who can't abuse the ridiculous accuracy.

Archers should lay suppressing fire to protect their melee units. However, native meta works in a way so that it's archers vs archers and all other units play role of a mere cannon fodder. Have you played the siege? It's literally unplayable as a melee character right now. Even if you climb the wall without getting shot, you will get overwhelmed.

Anyways we are getting off-topic. Even though we have different opinions on how gameplay should look like, you don't address the core of my post, that is complete lack of actual equipment customization and character progression that clearly favors archers and cavalry. Due to kill rewards you will always gravitate towards either of these two classes because you can't spend money on equipment. And this is regardless the fact horsemen in PVP are utterly useless as always.
 
Last edited:
While I disagree that your naked unshielded guy should stand a chance against archers, those same arrows should just bounce off when hitting metal armor. Bows are OP against armor in this game, arrows should not be able to penetrate top tier armor.
 
A single dude running with a javelin and a one-handed sword is the definition of Bow fodder in this era. While I do agree Bows could use a slight nerf they should stay extremely lethal against troops without shields.
 
I support friendly fire (I die often because ***** teammates blocking my swing) and a better class system with customization.
I would even say friendly fire and customization is the most important thing the multiplayer needs right now.
The rest of your post...hell no.

Shields definitely should not break after 2 swings, what a nonsense.
Maybe you think shields are unfun, others do not, I find the currrent 2h spam unfun.
In Warband I always liked to play infantry shield + sword or axe, sometimes I even use a 2h axe myself.
In Bannerlord currently I play mostly archer, these 2h weapon people are so annoying but easy too kill and its actually funny if they complain in chat.
I know in warband many had 2h weapons too, but it seems in bannerlord this nonsense is getting out of hand and in its actual state, archers are the best solution to this mindless 2h spam.
In Warband I remember some people who were good without shield, this is nothing which everyone should be capable of.
Nobody is stopping you to not choose a shield, but this is solely your decision and you have to deal with the consequences which are archers and people with shields.

There is no need to nerf shields or archers, please do not let bannerlord become a brainless 2h swing simulator like this ***** mordhau game.
This is not a edgy duel game, Siege was always the main and most fun mode in Warband.
Weak shields and inaccurate archers, just because some people can have a mindless melee brawl, would just ruin this game.
 
Personally I always thought siege is just a ****fest of defenders winning vs attackers unless you are heavily organised but I respect anyone who enjoys siege, just not for me. I want battle back, that's what brought me to the multiplayer in the first place.
 
Go play on the duel server. It's funny that you don't like shields, and drop it after spawning just to run around swinging, and you are annoyed by archers and want them to be nerfed, I wonder why. lol
 
I support friendly fire (I die often because ***** teammates blocking my swing) and a better class system with customization.
I would even say friendly fire and customization is the most important thing the multiplayer needs right now.
The rest of your post...hell no.

Shields definitely should not break after 2 swings, what a nonsense.
Maybe you think shields are unfun, others do not, I find the currrent 2h spam unfun.
In Warband I always liked to play infantry shield + sword or axe, sometimes I even use a 2h axe myself.
In Bannerlord currently I play mostly archer, these 2h weapon people are so annoying but easy too kill and its actually funny if they complain in chat.
I know in warband many had 2h weapons too, but it seems in bannerlord this nonsense is getting out of hand and in its actual state, archers are the best solution to this mindless 2h spam.
In Warband I remember some people who were good without shield, this is nothing which everyone should be capable of.
Nobody is stopping you to not choose a shield, but this is solely your decision and you have to deal with the consequences which are archers and people with shields.

There is no need to nerf shields or archers, please do not let bannerlord become a brainless 2h swing simulator like this ***** mordhau game.
This is not a edgy duel game, Siege was always the main and most fun mode in Warband.
Weak shields and inaccurate archers, just because some people can have a mindless melee brawl, would just ruin this game.

This post is a lot of oof.

2h spam is not a thing, and block delay currently makes 2h more difficult to handle. Also, dueling is an important aspect in providing depth to the combat system in the game. Dueling is currently skill capped by the restrictions of the combat system, but it is definitely NOT a brainless simulator.

People don't like shields right now because they take a ridiculously long time to break, and it promotes turtling or 1 dimensional hit block game play, which many people find to be unfun.

Archers should be a bit more inaccurate, because in their current state they deal incredible amounts of damage, have a very fast draw, and have an incredibly long hold time before they lose accuracy. They are also not as easy to bump as they were in warband, allowing them to make easy kill shots from very close.

You can have your opinions about siege, but not everyone agrees. Your post makes me think that you do not have a lot of experience with the combat system.
 
I support friendly fire (I die often because ***** teammates blocking my swing) and a better class system with customization.
I would even say friendly fire and customization is the most important thing the multiplayer needs right now.
The rest of your post...hell no.

Shields definitely should not break after 2 swings, what a nonsense.
Maybe you think shields are unfun, others do not, I find the currrent 2h spam unfun.
In Warband I always liked to play infantry shield + sword or axe, sometimes I even use a 2h axe myself.
In Bannerlord currently I play mostly archer, these 2h weapon people are so annoying but easy too kill and its actually funny if they complain in chat.
I know in warband many had 2h weapons too, but it seems in bannerlord this nonsense is getting out of hand and in its actual state, archers are the best solution to this mindless 2h spam.
In Warband I remember some people who were good without shield, this is nothing which everyone should be capable of.
Nobody is stopping you to not choose a shield, but this is solely your decision and you have to deal with the consequences which are archers and people with shields.

There is no need to nerf shields or archers, please do not let bannerlord become a brainless 2h swing simulator like this ***** mordhau game.
This is not a edgy duel game, Siege was always the main and most fun mode in Warband.
Weak shields and inaccurate archers, just because some people can have a mindless melee brawl, would just ruin this game.

+1 on everything you wrote.
 
@Smug_Alpaca

I disagree with all you wrote.
My experience with the combat system is here not the point and its not your concern either, cheap try to dismiss my statement.
2h spam is not a thing, and block delay currently makes 2h more difficult to handle. Also, dueling is an important aspect in providing depth to the combat system in the game. Dueling is currently skill capped by the restrictions of the combat system, but it is definitely NOT a brainless simulator.
The 2h spam is there thats a fact, and most of them swing their weapon mindless around until they hit something, they prove it every match.
Maybe you are one of them, who knows.
Most of them arent that good, If you block them once you can kill them easy, they just hope to make a lucky kill.
But, I saw today more archers than usual, so probably more peope are annoyed by it.
People don't like shields right now because they take a ridiculously long time to break, and it promotes turtling or 1 dimensional hit block game play, which many people find to be unfun.
Well I doubt all players share this view.
In my opinion they even break too fast, so they are probably fine as they are hm?
Archers should be a bit more inaccurate, because in their current state they deal incredible amounts of damage, have a very fast draw, and have an incredibly long hold time before they lose accuracy.
In comparison with Warband the archers are already a bit nerfed and bows really dont draw fast, the strong bow always needs some time.
Serious, bows were faster and more accurate in Warband.
But do you know what really helps against archers...a shield.
 
Well I doubt all players share this view.
In my opinion they even break too fast, so they are probably fine as they are hm?

I think javelins/throwing weapons should brake shields with at least 3-4 hits, simulating those throwing weapons stuck in there, rendering the shield unusable, because it makes no sense that people use shields with 4 javelins sticking out of them.
 
I think javelins/throwing weapons should brake shields with at least 3-4 hits, simulating those throwing weapons stuck in there, rendering the shield unusable, because it makes no sense that people use shields with 4 javelins sticking out of them.
Shields should protect you from missile fire, they shouldnt get countered by throwing weapons (Game > Reality) It will have a negative impact on big linebattles aswell, if you cant join the fight because you get shot down just because your shield broke before the fight even happens.

The problem with 2h is their insane fast movement speed compared to other classes. Those two traits together dont really enforce a good gameplay. Mercs balanced it far better, where 2h wielders were generally slower on foot.
 
Shields should protect you from missile fire, they shouldnt get countered by throwing weapons (Game > Reality) It will have a negative impact on big linebattles aswell, if you cant join the fight because you get shot down just because your shield broke before the fight even happens.

So then why the hell do we have skirmisher class in multiplayer if they serve no purpose? Just so new and noob players have something to pick to be cannon fodder and throw **** at each other? Javelins are a great way to render shields useless, shields can't be the ultimate defensive weapon, not realistic and not fun gameplaywise either.
 
As someone wrote, the problem with archers is that their damage pierces through armour. Chainmail was already hard enough to penetrate at all and required specialized arrowheads or a longbow to do so at all. A person outfitted in proper plate armour would basically be impervious to arrows. What would have been the point historically to outfit yourself in ridiculously expensive steel if any Joe with strong arms could just gun you down with their hunting bow?

So right now, the game versus reality:
Vlandian sergeant gets shot in the head by an Aserai archer:
- Game: the arrow does 70 damage and the Vlandian sergeant is almost dead.
- Reality: the arrow bounces off the Vlandian Sergeant's helmet and he is practically unharmed.

This is why almost every knight carried a blunt weapon. The armour was almost indestructible, so they had to resort to beating the person up through his armour.

Accuracy and speed are not the problems, and bows can honestly be both more accurate and faster to reload. Note that in the historical period Bannerlord tries to emulate, crossbows were actually significantly less powerful than the bows used in that period. The argument thus applies to crossbows as well.

tl;dr arrows should not be armour piercing, and damage reduction from armour to arrows should be increased dramatically.
 
So then why the hell do we have skirmisher class in multiplayer if they serve no purpose? Just so new and noob players have something to pick to be cannon fodder and throw **** at each other? Javelins are a great way to render shields useless, shields can't be the ultimate defensive weapon, not realistic and not fun gameplaywise either.
They are good against archers. They are good in general with low costs.

Armor isnt well designed in this game.
 
Last edited:
Back
Top Bottom