Voting Poll:What's Your Favorite Type Of Firearm To Use?

[MorrisB]

Volley pistols were not meant to be accurate... they were used against mobs of enemies, hence accuracy was not a concern. The handling of area-of-effect damage in-game is a considerable balance question, however.

 

[Lord Beach]

Those guns look pretty cool.I cant wait to see some of them if they are put in.

 

[MorrisB]

Yet again I apologise for resurrecting this topic, but I don't really want to start another topic for image spam regarding weapons that could be included in the mod 

Have some crossbows, rockets and whatnot.

Gastraphetes
(Antique greek heavy crossbow)

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It might seem crude, but it's actually effective even against heavy armor.

I linked the pictures below for size demonstration:

Cheirobllistra
(Roman re-design of the Gastraphetes)

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Hatchet Guns
(Just because. At a time, they were used by German/Asutrian mercenaries.)

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Chinese Rocket
(The mother of rocket artillery. I don't really expect to see this in-game, I just put it here so you may comprehend the "nest of bees" concept better, which you can find directly beneath.)

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"Nest of Bees"
(Antique Chinese multi-rocket launcher. SERIOUSLY.)

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Essentially, it's multiple "fire-arrows" (arrows with rockets tied to them) in a bamboo quiver from which they were launched:

Depicted usage:

I Also have two links for you guys:

A video demonstrating the use of the "nest of bees" (from 4:50 onwards): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vO6I5OZpRDI
And an article about its historical background: http://www.grandhistorian.com/chinesesiegewarfare/siegeweapons-handheldrocketlaunchers.html

Bo-hiya
(Antique Japanese rocket launcher. SERIOUSLY.)

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Note: the rocket itself was called "bo hiya". The actual gun from which it was launched was named "hiya taihou"

A closer view on the rocket and its fuse:

Depicted usage:

COMPUTICA, WHY U NO WRITE AREA-OF-EFFECT CODE ALREADY ?!?

Jokes aside, I think it would be neat to see at least one rocket-based weapon in the mod. It could be a hidden gadget, like the "Strange Armor" was in native Mount and Blade.

The Crossbows and the hatchet-guns wouldn't be impossible to model either IMO.

 

[LibSpit]

it may be that area affect is already taken care of if it was one of the fire and sword toys that was added to the warband code. (Grenade!!!)

with things like multi-barrel musket 'shotgun' type fire that would be more like a really inaccurate gun that has an almost instant fire speed, by that i mean you combine the throwing and gun concept, so you have a 'shotgun' (insert suitable medieval mega barreled death cannon name here) that is gun and ammo in one, like a javelin, then when it fires it fires all it's shots within a second of each other, so you end up with 4-8 musket balls flying all over the shop at the enemy and then it is empty, one shot, many bullets

Blood and steel already had a kind of grenade-launcher/rocket soldier........they were fun to line up and watch SOOO many baddies die! It was fun seeing how many skeletons I could kill with a small group of them

I don't know if you have found any yet MB but they also had gun shields.....hiding has never been so lethal!

 

[MorrisB]

I know that several other mods out there already have area-of-effect weapons, but most of them are not Open-Source mods. Dunno about the Fire and Sword addon, though, but if that doesn't work then either a modders' exchange or a SOD Warlords AoE code is in order...

Computica told me he had a type of volley gun planned for the mod anyway, and some double-barrel weapons are included already. The path towards AoE implementation is getting paved.

And I concur, grenade/rocket launchers are definetly fun    but for game balance purposes, if there were any rocket/grenade-based weapons included in SOD Warlords in the future they should be hidden items and/or lootable from very specific NPCs.

I also came across some gun shield pictures, but I don't really want to involve them in Warlords, that's why I didn't post them 

 

[Computica]

Someone just posted a much better shotgun effect code using the new features of the 1.15x release. At the moment I'll have to be on standby by for the next two weeks. My life is currently going through some changes.

 

[Daedelus_McGee]

Someone just posted a much better shotgun effect code using the new features of the 1.15x release. At the moment I'll have to be on standby by for the next two weeks. My life is currently going through some changes.

Please keep in mind that ballistics is not well comprehended at the timeframe of the game. Although many people venerate the shotgun to extreme levels, it was not commonly used in battles for a reason. There are some exceptions, but shotguns make more sense as coach guns and trench brooms than they do as open field weapons against armed opponents.  Keep in mind that many shotgun rounds won't penetrate a cuirass, and a lot of the people you most want to fall down will be wearing heavy armor.

I like shotguns a lot. During the Rodney King Riots, I had one by my front door, although thankfully the disturbance refused to get anywhere near Camp Pendleton. I've carried them on military duty, and always welcomed their weight. I also know their limitations and know what they can't do.

Here's an example of one shotgun limitations: http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot43.htm

 

[MorrisB]

Please keep in mind that ballistics is not well comprehended at the timeframe of the game.

Given the fictional nature of SOD, the timeframe does not mean all that much. Some factions are stuck on relatively low technical level (Elephant Guard) while others are "renaissance" (Conquistadors), and some mercs run around with 16th-17th century firearms, all the while the mod's starting year is about 1300. The timeframe isn't the best way to measure technical advancement in real life either, especially outside Europe. When Colombus went to America, most European powers had plenty of muskets and cannons, while much of Asia was stuck in a "late medieval" stage, and most American civilizations barely had metalworks to speak of. The issue is more about who has the knowledge in the given setting and who doesn't, but given the policy of firearms in SOD, we can safely say that out of the over a dozen large factions, maybe a couple or so possess any reliable knowledge about firearms. 

But you do make a good point about the overhype of shotguns. The only place where they are fully efficient is at truly close quarters, where they are respectable for their stopping power. I don't think SOD will have too many blunderbuss-type weapons, though. More like multi-barreled duckfoot pistols and the like (at least until later releases), but the gameplay mechanism could be the same for both. Obviosuly they should be the bane of lightly armored opponents at close distances, but do fairly little harm to heavier foes.

 

[Computica]

If I remember correctly I have 2 B-Buss meshes ready for implementation. A long one and a shorter one. Thanks for the realism info Daedelus. I'm going to have to have a talk with the team together though. Somehow we need to have some type of audio chat together to discuss a few things about the mod.

 

[Daedelus_McGee]

Please keep in mind that ballistics is not well comprehended at the timeframe of the game.

Given the fictional nature of SOD, the timeframe does not mean all that much. Some factions are stuck on relatively low technical level (Elephant Guard) while others are "renaissance" (Conquistadors), and some mercs run around with 16th-17th century firearms, all the while the mod's starting year is about 1300. The timeframe isn't the best way to measure technical advancement in real life either, especially outside Europe. When Colombus went to America, most European powers had plenty of muskets and cannons, while much of Asia was stuck in a "late medieval" stage, and most American civilizations barely had metalworks to speak of. The issue is more about who has the knowledge in the given setting and who doesn't, but given the policy of firearms in SOD, we can safely say that out of the over a dozen large factions, maybe a couple or so possess any reliable knowledge about firearms. 

But you do make a good point about the overhype of shotguns. The only place where they are fully efficient is at truly close quarters, where they are respectable for their stopping power. I don't think SOD will have too many blunderbuss-type weapons, though. More like multi-barreled duckfoot pistols and the like (at least until later releases), but the gameplay mechanism could be the same for both. Obviosuly they should be the bane of lightly armored opponents at close distances, but do fairly little harm to heavier foes.

I should also mention that wound ballistics are also not well understood in modern times as well. We've never been as clear about the nature of firearm stopping power as we are today, and in fact there was better understanding in the 1930s than was commonly understood in the 1960s in forensics and trauma surgery.

The most important single event inspiring the understanding of human limitations and wound ballistics was the 1986 FBI Miami Shootout: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1986_FBI_Miami_shootout W. French Anderson, a tremendously dedicated mountain climber doctor with a fascination for the limits of human endurance compiled a forensics report that literally set the standard for post-mortem investigations. http://www.amazon.com/Forensic-Analysis-April-1986-Firefight/dp/1581604904/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1336111339&sr=8-2 I have a copy of this book, it is not a "good" read, but understanding it is worth the nightmares. FBI agents were dying from single and double shots of .223 rounds, while the criminals took 6 and 12 shots of pistol ammunition to put down. Shortly afterwards, the FBI changed to the .40 pistol round and started serious testing for wound ballistics for their ammunition purposes.

The thing to take home from all this is that even extremely professional and serious people are subject to institutional bias, especially over matters of life and death.

Part of the problem with any game is that a transparent account of weapon speed and effectiveness is not realistic. People like what they like, and frequently will not listen to reason. I really have no problem nerfing the hell out of anything you want to, because you can explain that the numbers listed are only the weapon's reputation, not it's actual effectiveness. Also, there are many who will be more deadly with a substandard weapon that they are skilled with than an excellent weapon they are not the master of. Musashi Miyamoto killed a man in a battle with a wooden sword he'd carved on the boat ride to the duel. His opponent carried the finest steel.

 

[Computica]

You know, I could see someone winning in a fight using a wooden sword against someone with a steel one.

 

[Daedelus_McGee]

You know, I could see someone winning in a fight using a wooden sword against someone with a steel one.

There's this whole thing in really advanced Japanese fencing where you reveal yourself with what amounts to a "tell" in gambling terms. Musashi Miyamoto got so skilled at reading the "tell" that he could predict a sequence of action based on it, and counteract the sequence with his own. It's very easy to get lost in the philosophy of the sword and quite hard to get found with it. That was Musashi Miyamoto's last duel, and he probably used the wooden sword so he wouldn't have to keep killing other sword masters, not just for flash.

 

[MorrisB]

I'm doing a lil' picture dump again, in the hopes of inspiring Computica to include some of these beauties later on...

Multi-barrel revolver carbines
(barrels must be rotated manually)

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Three-barreled:

Four-barreled:

Three-barrel carbine
(7-barreled, actually; 4 are hidden in the stock)

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Double-barrel blunderbuss
(over and under style)

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Flintlock revolver
(5-shot)

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Long muskets
(flintlocks)

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Hand mortars
(Area-of-effect ? Yes please.)

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Revolver pistol-dagger
(I have yet to find how many shots it had...)

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Pistol-saber
(just because)

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Morningstar/hand cannon hybrid
(4 barrels)

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Appearence:

A close-up on the barrels:

Obviously, the last one is my personal favourite. 

 

[scott slod]

I use a double master work carbine, the reload speed 21 sucks but it makes good with it with 2 deadly shots (if i hit them)

 

[dantedarkstar]

I use pistol, but given that I play commander-type character now I prefer "light" equipment suiting a commander. Thus a pistol suits the role ideally - it allows for medium-range self-defense while on horseback and has added quality of being very commander-ish as opposed to regular trooper equipment.
I never increased strength or agility beyond original 6 I started out with and aside from pistol I use foil for style and ability to actually deal damage without Power Strike (except starting value 1).