So how is version 1.2?

[Bluko88]

So I seem to once again be hearing the siren call of Bannerlord. I know 1.2 has some worth while additions, but I also still see it's in beta LOL, which honestly makes me wonder if Bannerlord will still be getting updates into the 2030s. IIRC there's weather, formation targeting, kingdom destruction, and individual agents supposedly fights better in personal combat? Something tells me if I just jump into the arena I won't notice a difference at all. (Yeah I know there's a stickied beta thread, but I'm lazy and I don't want read messages from months ago.)

Haven't touched the game since January and even then looks like I was sticking with version 1.0.2 for reasons I can't remember (probably mods?)


But what do the members of the forum think these days?

Jump in again? Wait another year see what happens? To be honest I'm quite fed up with rolling new characters to QA the game I paid for 3 years ago, only to discover that long standing issues are very much present. Are there still scenes (siege maps) missing trees during select seasons? I'm also loathe to load old saves since I feel like compatibility is always less than ideal, especially when companions and fog of war are being mettled with.

Don't suppose there's any undocumented features like skill books or trainers to level up clan member skills? Anything to lessen the grind? Also I'm quite certain the end game is just tedious as ever? And that the optimal conquest strategy is to take fiefs one-by-one as an independent clan?

 

[saittam]

Don't suppose there's any undocumented features like skill books or trainers to level up clan member skills? Anything to lessen the grind? Also I'm quite certain the end game is just tedious as ever? And that the optimal conquest strategy is to take fiefs one-by-one as an independent clan?

The grind has actually been more. Now with workshops you can place raw materials in them. So more collecting
The rest is the same.
I would wait until beta becomes stable. And a week or two more for mods to catch up.

 

[Bluko88]

The grind has actually been more. Now with workshops you can place raw materials in them. So more collecting
The rest is the same.
I would wait until beta becomes stable. And a week or two more for mods to catch up.

Great... I take it the only way to get Trade XP is by buying and selling goods yourself? For example you still don't get XP from Caravans or Workshops you own yet?

 

[saittam]

Great... I take it the only way to get Trade XP is by buying and selling goods yourself? For example you still don't get XP from Caravans or Workshops you own yet?

Luckily there is a mod for exactly that

 

[Totalgarbage]

I've heard that you get trade xp from workshops but haven't tested it myself. The workshop changes are nice (better than warband in terms of interactivity) but workshops themselves suck at profitability due to their increased purchasing price added a few patches back & the deflation of the game economy until day 200-ish where they become somewhat profitable (but less needed).

Combat AI actually feels really different, though you may or may not like them being better at blocking (they're not as good as RBM but there's also no posture system either). Many people used to hate it until TW tweaked it a bit in 1.2.4. I do like these AI changes for field battles; Ranged units and Skirmishers actually skirmish when infantry gets close to them, shield wall formation feels like a good defensive formation, cavalry is much better at fighting other mounted troops, etc. Formation targeting also makes the battles a bit more tactical (and lets the player actually meaningfully command units for siege defences). Also, now you can build siege engines in siege defences.

The late game grind is a bit more bearable now that factions actually die out, but I imagine a full conquest is still painful and boring. I don't have the patience to try to conquer the map again until significant changes to the late game which enables the player faction to snowball after they get strong enough.

Weather feels very atmospheric and actually affects combat, so I really like it overall (and I also would like to see sand/dust storms added).

There's been a few changes to smithing, but I haven't tested it out myself. From what I've seen though, it makes the weapon difficulty and smithing skill actually matter, so if you try to smith a sword with 100 difficulty when you have 50 skill, you will get a negative modifier, but smithing the same thing with 125 will give you a positive modifier (might be RNG i dunno), and from what I know if you smith it with 150 or 200 skill you will get an even better modifier than you would with 125 skill.

I think that you should try it now, as it's relatively stable, and when the patch goes live play with the Old Realms total conversion mod who also recently got a massive update.

 

[saittam]

player faction to snowball after they get strong enough.

I experience exactly that. It´s just too easy once you recruit 5 clans.

 

[black_bulldog]

I experience exactly that. It´s just too easy once you recruit 5 clans.

It was pretty much the same in Warband. It's this or make the late game so grindy the player loses interest. Personally I'd prefer that at some point I can steam roll the game instead of a slog the whole way through, just my 2 cents.

 

[Totalgarbage]

Yeah, by snowballing I mean steamrolling the map. You really can't steamroll the map with 5 clans, you become relatively stable. If a faction controls 2/3 of the map (and if the overwhelming majority of the remaining 1/3rd is not owned by 1 faction), the lords should straight up be able to take over the map on their own within 2-3 in game years.

 

[saittam]

It was pretty much the same in Warband. It's this or make the late game so grindy the player loses interest. Personally I'd prefer that at some point I can steam roll the game instead of a slog the whole way through, just my 2 cents.

Me i want resistence. Went it´s too easy i start a new game. Something should happen once the player reach a certain strenght. They join against the player, get higher tier troops or something. Thats what i loved about MTW2 when the mongols came and timurids.
My opinion. Bannerlord difficulty is more very easy.

 

[Wulfric]

It was pretty much the same in Warband. It's this or make the late game so grindy the player loses interest. Personally I'd prefer that at some point I can steam roll the game instead of a slog the whole way through, just my 2 cents.

It doesn't have to be grindy but each stage should have its own set of challenges where, for instance, late-game could involve dealing with more high level -perhaps political- issues instead of going into a besieging spree or running errands. One doesn't get to properly experience what being a monarch entails.

 

[black_bulldog]

Me i want resistence. Went it´s too easy i start a new game. Something should happen once the player reach a certain strenght. They join against the player, get higher tier troops or something. Thats what i loved about MTW2 when the mongols came and timurids.
My opinion. Bannerlord difficulty is more very easy.

Imo one of the best ways to slow down steamrolling without being too grindy would be to allow alliances. But unfortunately Taleworlds won't put them in because reasons...

It doesn't have to be grindy but each stage should have its own set of challenges where, for instance, late-game could involve dealing with more high level -perhaps political- issues instead of going into a besieging spree or running errands. One doesn't get to properly experience what being a monarch entails.

You expect Taleworlds to come up with a set of challenges for each stage? This is a studio who still can't get the ai to function properly during sieges.

 

[saittam]

Imo one of the best ways to slow down steamrolling without being too grindy would be to allow alliances. But unfortunately Taleworlds won't put them in because reasons...

The mod diplomacy does that. Still to easy.
I remember sometime when i bought this game. I always choose khuzait. And one war decleration they made was (ranom faction) is getting too strong, we better attack.
Can´t remember i have seen that in the last 6 months.
I actually choose grindy over too easy. It can´t be worse then smithing.

 

[Dodgy]

Yeah, by snowballing I mean steamrolling the map. You really can't steamroll the map with 5 clans, you become relatively stable. If a faction controls 2/3 of the map (and if the overwhelming majority of the remaining 1/3rd is not owned by 1 faction), the lords should straight up be able to take over the map on their own within 2-3 in game years.

If it wasn't for the fact that by then, the stupid lords will constantly push to declare wars when you are focusing on conquering one faction, only to put a vote for peace when you are almost done, giving them time to partially recover.
Your stupid lords meanwhile keep conquering fiefs, leaving them with zero defence, allowing even powerless factions to take them back, and leading to a boring game of whack a mole.

The main issue of this game in my opinion is still the AI, both the campaign and the Lord's. That's just the bare minimum to make the game play in a logical way, sadly the end game with no features aside from conquering one fief after another would still remain boring unless they add content, but at least it would be over sooner once one of the factions have significantly outgrown the rest, and be more challenging until you reach that point.

 

[Totalgarbage]

The main issue of this game in my opinion is still the AI, both the campaign and the Lord's. That's just the bare minimum to make the game play in a logical way, sadly the end game with no features aside from conquering one fief after another would still remain boring unless they add content, but at least it would be over sooner once one of the factions have significantly outgrown the rest, and be more challenging until you reach that point.

I feel the same, and in my opinion the only ways to fix the late game is by either ending it faster or giving the player milestones to end the game (which would also end it faster). While I would like something like a late game invasion, it would only prolong the process of infinite wars & sieges.

One example for a milestone is to destroy/reunite the empire, which is the base campaign goal, another would be controlling the "totally-not-mediterranean-sea" with 1 faction, another would be to control the "northern realms", another would be to amass 10 million denars, etc.. Players can already set milestones by themselves, there only needs to be confirmations of their completion (& maybe special rewards such as unique crowns and/or sword, armor, etc.)

 

[Bluko88]

Luckily there is a mod for exactly that

Yeah I was using this one in the past: https://www.nexusmods.com/mountandblade2bannerlord/mods/4920/

Combat AI actually feels really different, though you may or may not like them being better at blocking (they're not as good as RBM but there's also no posture system either). Many people used to hate it until TW tweaked it a bit in 1.2.4. I do like these AI changes for field battles; Ranged units and Skirmishers actually skirmish when infantry gets close to them, shield wall formation feels like a good defensive formation, cavalry is much better at fighting other mounted troops, etc. Formation targeting also makes the battles a bit more tactical (and lets the player actually meaningfully command units for siege defences). Also, now you can build siege engines in siege defences.

Yes agents block much more effectively, my only issue is when you start out as a Level 1 Goober this make it extremely difficult to land hits in Practice Matches. I'm not sure how much concern there should be for new players at this point, but if I had no Mount & Blade experience could be really frustrating.Though I'm still doing okay in Tournaments with a bit of combat skill now. Overall I think the bigger emphasis on blocking has improved mass combat a lot. Having superior numbers matters a lot more now, since even Recruits won't just let themselves get hit freely. No more losing 10-15 Recruits to a few Looters.

Formation targeting is nice, though a little clunky, but better than not having it. Means I can probably consider playing without RTS Camera for once.

Weather feels very atmospheric and actually affects combat, so I really like it overall (and I also would like to see sand/dust storms added).

Yes it will be a slight improvement over the Weather Mod, since it applies to the map as well. Though strangely 1-2 times it's been "raining" the ground is just wet and there's no actual rain in the scene. They need to add Dust Storms, and I hope I see some Blizzard and Heavy Rain conditions too.

It doesn't have to be grindy but each stage should have its own set of challenges where, for instance, late-game could involve dealing with more high level -perhaps political- issues instead of going into a besieging spree or running errands. One doesn't get to properly experience what being a monarch entails.

Yeah something like Crusader Kings 3 does the game stage scaling pretty well.

Honestly Bannerlord's endgame as King/Emperor needs to be less about leading endless sieges, and more about directing your armies and keeping your vassals in line. IMO Bannerlord's endgame needs these 3 features:

1. Actual Diplomacy: This means truces, non-aggression pacts, and the ability to form alliances. Would go a long way to make forming a Kingdom a realistic goal; without abusing certain game mechanics so much. This whole War On/Off crap as "Diplomacy" needs to stop. Also if you take a fief you should be forced to declare a Kingdom.

2. Kingdom Management: How about the ability to direct Armies to attack/defend certain targets at the cost of Influence? Decisions need to be more impactful too in terms of Clan Relations. There should be Factions within Kingdoms that sort of inherently form based on who gets what fiefs, etc. Policies should also play into the Faction element with certain Clans liking/disliking various Policies. Honestly most Policies should be redone since a lot don't work well or are garbage anyway. Maybe make them favored on Traits?

3. Civil Wars: If a Kingdom is getting too big it should be very prone to splitting in two. This would have been a better way of dealing with snowballing, rather then explicitly making A.I. "dumb" when they are doing too well. It also seems odd that a game that features a Civil War between the Empire, has no such mechanics built-in if say the Aserai, Vlandians, or Khuzaits borders expand a great deal.

IMO conquering the entire map should be a nigh impossible task. Forming a relatively independent & stable Kingdom should be the true goal of the game.


Also would like to see Retreating/Surrendering be more viable options. The whole "fight to the death!" really isn't in-keeping with how most Medieval combat played out from what little I know. Losing an entire Warband/Army should only happen as result of a major F'ck Up.

 

[IJIN]

How's the 1.2.4 ? Thinking of jumping back in for a playthrough. I haven't played since 1.21. Any game breaking/very.annoying bugs present or more or less all stable?

Input appreciated.

 

[mongoid]

Yeah I was using this one in the past: https://www.nexusmods.com/mountandblade2bannerlord/mods/4920/


Yes agents block much more effectively, my only issue is when you start out as a Level 1 Goober this make it extremely difficult to land hits in Practice Matches. I'm not sure how much concern there should be for new players at this point, but if I had no Mount & Blade experience could be really frustrating.Though I'm still doing okay in Tournaments with a bit of combat skill now. Overall I think the bigger emphasis on blocking has improved mass combat a lot. Having superior numbers matters a lot more now, since even Recruits won't just let themselves get hit freely. No more losing 10-15 Recruits to a few Looters.

Formation targeting is nice, though a little clunky, but better than not having it. Means I can probably consider playing without RTS Camera for once.


Yes it will be a slight improvement over the Weather Mod, since it applies to the map as well. Though strangely 1-2 times it's been "raining" the ground is just wet and there's no actual rain in the scene. They need to add Dust Storms, and I hope I see some Blizzard and Heavy Rain conditions too.


Yeah something like Crusader Kings 3 does the game stage scaling pretty well.

Honestly Bannerlord's endgame as King/Emperor needs to be less about leading endless sieges, and more about directing your armies and keeping your vassals in line. IMO Bannerlord's endgame needs these 3 features:

1. Actual Diplomacy: This means truces, non-aggression pacts, and the ability to form alliances. Would go a long way to make forming a Kingdom a realistic goal; without abusing certain game mechanics so much. This whole War On/Off crap as "Diplomacy" needs to stop. Also if you take a fief you should be forced to declare a Kingdom.

2. Kingdom Management: How about the ability to direct Armies to attack/defend certain targets at the cost of Influence? Decisions need to be more impactful too in terms of Clan Relations. There should be Factions within Kingdoms that sort of inherently form based on who gets what fiefs, etc. Policies should also play into the Faction element with certain Clans liking/disliking various Policies. Honestly most Policies should be redone since a lot don't work well or are garbage anyway. Maybe make them favored on Traits?

3. Civil Wars: If a Kingdom is getting too big it should be very prone to splitting in two. This would have been a better way of dealing with snowballing, rather then explicitly making A.I. "dumb" when they are doing too well. It also seems odd that a game that features a Civil War between the Empire, has no such mechanics built-in if say the Aserai, Vlandians, or Khuzaits borders expand a great deal.

IMO conquering the entire map should be a nigh impossible task. Forming a relatively independent & stable Kingdom should be the true goal of the game.


Also would like to see Retreating/Surrendering be more viable options. The whole "fight to the death!" really isn't in-keeping with how most Medieval combat played out from what little I know. Losing an entire Warband/Army should only happen as result of a major F'ck Up.

Please sir, stop speaking sense.

 

[Bluko88]

How's the 1.2.4 ? Thinking of jumping back in for a playthrough. I haven't played since 1.21. Any game breaking/very.annoying bugs present or more or less all stable?

Input appreciated.

Well I can't really compare to 1.2.1, but 1.2.4 is decently stable, just one crash so far I think and wasn't reproducable. Worst thing I've run into is a Quest update won't go away even though it's long been complete; for that new insurrection Quest from Lords. Also some issues targeting inner gate on sieges, did not realize TW made it impossible to hack down the outer gates now - which I'm guessing is partly to blame. Good intended change I guess, infantry hacking outer gate down was a really cheesy tactic for taking Castles/Towns.

Also I gotta say kind of disappointed with TW's weather now. It looks like from the campaign map there's a decent amount of clouds, rain, etc. But seriously in a dozen hours haven't even had one battle in the rain, despite rain being nearby. But that wet ground texture sure is impressive with dust clouds! The campaign map feature is nice since it adds some life to world, but gotta say Realistic Weather Mod is still superior. I don't think I'll ever see a snowstorm in base game, if that's even implemented.


And then there's the troop imbalance... seriously this is a real problem now with the improved agent blocking. Armor, weapons, and skill matter a whole lot more now since the game is more than just F1+F3 mosh-pit battles. Fians are truly absurd now in melee combat. There's basically no reason to not exclusively recruit Fians and Khan's Guards now, cause shields are only good for catching arrows, and both those units have those already!

Like it just irks me that someone apparently has had enough time to mess around with minor faction rosters (who cares?), but the main troop trees? Are we going to do anything about them (the ones that compromise 95% of in-game units)? Especially since console peasants don't have access to such simple mods? Nah! It's just laughable at this point.

And did anyone do anything about the garbage Mercenaries? Those are pretty simple. Nope... Sword Sisters still don't have any head gear at all LOL. But Tier 2 Vlandian Levy Crossbows have a little leather hood with like 9 armor! Oh well I guess Troop Balance will happen whenever the intern at TW finally gets bored of playing ping-pong in the Office. Like how is this not a priority? The game has been RELEASED now with achievements and you can't even bother to make sure the troop power meters are at least relatively accurate?


Thank goodness I made my own Troop mods. Didn't think I'd need them a year later, but apparently still do, and probably will well into 2024...

Sad too that I've effectively proven the long requested Sturgian Elite Tree being Heavy Infantry works quite well. And there are multiple ways to fix Khan's Guards (and still be good units) so they aren't blantly broken.


And why did my Imperial Wife's voice change when we got married (she can't have smoked that many cigarettes already..) ? My latest Male Character/Clan is Imperial, so again the question is why did her voice change? So because she's in my Clan she just randomly gets the Female Imperial Companion voice? That makes no sense. This is just as bad as newborn male NPCs having women's clothing, and all the "clone" children. I guess lucky for you TW most people don't play that long!

The overhaul mods can't come soon enough... Anything to end this nightmare of middling updates that introduce 1 or 2 good features, but then break otherwise good mods.

 

[Piconi]

And why did my Imperial Wife's voice change when we got married (she can't have smoked that many cigarettes already..) ? My latest Male Character/Clan is Imperial, so again the question is why did her voice change? So because she's in my Clan she just randomly gets the Female Imperial Companion voice?

At a glance, this looks like a bug, we will investigate this.

 

[Yoshioki Ouchi]

Have the banners/flags/shields textures been fixed? The latest version on PS4 (presumably 1.1.x) still has the tarnished banners/shields and it's an awful eyesore that I haven't seen anybody talking about lately while looking for news updates.