kappawt
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That's simply not true. Keep defending an unfinished game that still needs more content, you're ruining for everyone else here who would like to see that content. Good one.
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SP - General Early Access = Exhausting Alpha
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That's simply not true. Keep defending an unfinished game that still needs more content, you're ruining for everyone else here who would like to see that content. Good one.
It's unfinished but not a lot of stuff is missing from Native Warband, while they also added new things like Smithing.
How is not true?
You were not around when the original Mount and Blade released were you? Because I can assure you that that was way more barebones than what we have now, broken and unfinished as it may be. That's what you should compare this with, not Warband. A year or two from now we can start comparing to Warband.
Look, I don't think anyone thinks that this game is perfect or flawless. I and a lot of other people just don't think there is anything to be gained by going all doom and gloom and screaming and kicking on the forum. Give your feedback, point out bugs, criticize, and stay along for the ride until the game is in a better shape. Or don't, there's lots of other games out there if this is not to your liking. Either way, just don't be an ass about it, it doesn't help anyone.
Capillati
Banned
Why would you compare game building 15 years ago with today on the same time scale? 2 years to compare it to warband? Makes no sense, really... Performance output of computers, number of programs to code and create games is far greater today, hiring people and subcontracting is also easier... The game should`ve looked a lot better and have far more things to do in it than what we have today. Agreed on being an ass about it all but pointing out such things isn`t really being an ass...
I think StrengthRatio is the ratio of your strength vs the strength of the other side as seen by the different-colored bars. So your force needs to have 0.9 : 1 strength ratio or 10% less power than the enemy to even gain valor in the battle at all. Apparently THEN your xpvalue is related to the power of enemy troops that you personally wound/kill during the battle. You're supposed to get Valor even if you lose, but I've never seen it even with a mod that shows your trait progression.
What this practically means is that the average player with a high-level force almost NEVER gains valor except in lopsided mass battles vs recruits or by taking on large bandit hideouts (when your max 10 troops are sorely outnumbered). The most I've seen anyone claim to get is like 100 Valor from a battle. The most I've gotten is like 10. You are theoretically supposed to get extra valor for dueling bandit chiefs but that's never happened to me.
As for the threshholds for getting recognized... you need 1000 for step 1 and 4000 for step 2... the max is 6000. So, in other words, you have to rescue *50* captured lords or convince *50* lords to join your kingdom in order to qualify for Calculating. I'm pretty sure that since the rescue dialogue was commented out of the code you're stuck with just convincing lords to join... which when you consider the fact that only clan leaders can be convinced to join means that you basically have to convince half of the nobles in the entire world to be considered "Calculating 1."
This means that, practically speaking, the only way for the average player to see a change in personality trait is if they execute lords that do not have the "dishonorable" trait. Apparently you only get the Honor debuff if you execute someone who hasn't proven that they have no honor themselves.
If you want to be "Honorable 1" you need to complete approx 33 quests and you lose progress every time you fail one. Some quests (like family feud) give no honor on success and can only lose you honor on failure. Considering how ridiculously buggy quests are ATM, that's nuts.
If you want to be "Merciful 1" you need to complete a 30something quests using the "Merciful" option - which usually entails persuasion successes so GOOD LUCK WITH THAT. If you want "Cruel 1" for some reason, you have to raid 30 villages.
And, of course, even with extremely high Charm it is extremely difficult to get persuasion successes unless you have things like Honor or Calculating to begin with so... basically save scum every single time?
Apparently Generosity is supposed to raise by maintaining high food variety and lost while failing to feed/pay your troops. I've yet to see it happen, though. I think Generosity is not implemented at all because when I cheated myself 2 Generosity (which would generally reset to zero on any gain or loss) it never budged an inch in all my subsequent playtime.
The short story is: use the damn fix traits mod and start a new game. I did recently and started with "Calculating" which disappeared from my character sheet but DOES show up in dialogue (i.e. I get bonuses for having it in some persuasion checks). I'll try to grind Valor and Honor and see if that works at all.
FullbordadGames
Recruit
Mount and blade was released after four years of development. This has taken eight years. If we completely disregard that they have more capital/employees etc it would be more fair to compare this to what mount and blade was four years after release.
I agree that whining isn't going to solve things but there's honestly no excuse for the AAA price tag on a late alpha/early beta. If it was 20€ I would be a lot more fine with the state of the game. I mean, critically acclaimed games like The Witcher 3 and GTA V are 20€ cheaper than this game. This game has the same price as Half Life Alux.
It says EA on steam, the developers are patching the game, but the price tag alone, not to mention all the hype positive reviews, are veeeeeeeery misleading. It would make a ton of sense to make a road map and stop focusing on arbitrary stuff like balancing until they've added most of the features promised.
Things that should be easy to just fix and would make the game A LOT more enjoyable:
- Perks that actually work. I mean come on.
- You want people to test the game but you nerf the early game so hard that it's a big grind to get to the late-mid to late-game. Why?
(
*Auto-resolve that kills half your army to rock throwing hobos.
*Caravans and workshops nerfed
*AI lords getting more troops instantly after defeat.
*Smithing prices made worse.
*Leveling a character is super slow etc etc.
)
- A declare war/peace button for your own kingdom.
- Failing the diplomacy RNG mini-game wont lock the NPC forever.
It's not like the game is utter trash. But it's an empty shell right now and I think it's very important to say and/or write about that instead of saying "It's EA it will be fixed in X years."
I hope to see some serious changes to personality traits in the future, especially ways to more feasibly rank them.
For instance:
* Winning tavern games should give Calculating
* Executing bandits should give Honor, freeing them should give Mercy, and ransoming them should just give money
* Freeing lords should give Honor and sticking them in your dungeon should give Calculating
* Freeing enemy military troops should give Mercy, executing them should give Cruelty and ransoming them just give money
* Winning bandit duels should DEFINITELY give Valor
* Hell... ANY serious participation in major combat should give Valor appropriate to your deeds unless the situation is completely lopsided in your favor - with all the penalties involved with getting ganked in combat (including death if you have it turned on), there should be commensurate rewards for having more confirmed kills than Chris Kyle in a massive evenly-matched combat with 2000 troops
Honestly Calculating deserves more love than all the other traits combined. It is simply insane to expect people to have to successfully convince 50 enemy nobles to turn traitor in order to get a reputation for cunning.
I'm guessing that things like buying rounds of drinks or holding a party for your troops like you could in Warband should give Generosity when it's implemented. Honestly if it just gave it for having high food variety that would be fine too - since I do that as an RP thing regardless.
I don't know what should give "Emotional" but probably something involving vengeance or defending the honor of your beloved or whateevr.
From what I understand, Mercy and Honor are designed to be basically the same concept... except applied to peasants vs nobility. Which makes sense in a kind of cynical way.
Uhh yeah except that we're talking about 12 years ago vs now.
Not only has M&B happened... Warband happened and so did Fire & Sword and Viking Conquest, not to mention dozens of full conversion mods. Part of my frustration is that the devs seem to be reinventing the wheel when they should be emulating the most popular mods and expansions.
Viking Conquest had working spears and shieldwalls because - historically - spears worked and variations on shieldwalls were the most effective infantry formation ever. M&B2 does not have working spears - and the devs are busy nerfing them to be EVEN WORSE. Like... come on, man.
IDK why people were complaining about the Menavlion. I've noticed it's pretty cheesy when you do a side-swipe on horseback but that could probably be solved better in other ways... like is that even a plausible thing? Did anybody IRL ever side-swipe a spear like a giant baseball bat in mounted combat?
SERIOUSLY! A roadmap... ANY roadmap would be really helpful right now.
Something to let us know that the Devs are focused on making a better play experience, not on nerfing for balance.
Again... the personality trait system is straight-up bugged to basically not work right now. The only way the average player sees a change in their traits (other than their start values magically disappearing 2 minutes into play) is by executing nobles.
Why? If that feature isn't implemented yet - why didn't they just turn off personality change so that players keep the same stats they started with? That would have been a reasonable solution in the meantime.
AND it wouldn't have been so frustrating if they were up-front about it instead of leaving it to modders to dig into the code to tell us exactly how it's bugged and crappily designed to begin with.
I hope to see some serious changes to personality traits in the future, especially ways to more feasibly rank them.
For instance:
* Winning tavern games should give Calculating
* Executing bandits should give Honor, freeing them should give Mercy, and ransoming them should just give money
* Freeing lords should give Honor and sticking them in your dungeon should give Calculating
* Freeing enemy military troops should give Mercy, executing them should give Cruelty and ransoming them just give money
* Winning bandit duels should DEFINITELY give Valor
* Hell... ANY serious participation in major combat should give Valor appropriate to your deeds unless the situation is completely lopsided in your favor - with all the penalties involved with getting ganked in combat (including death if you have it turned on), there should be commensurate rewards for having more confirmed kills than Chris Kyle in a massive evenly-matched combat with 2000 troops
Honestly Calculating deserves more love than all the other traits combined. It is simply insane to expect people to have to successfully convince 50 enemy nobles to turn traitor in order to get a reputation for cunning.
I'm guessing that things like buying rounds of drinks or holding a party for your troops like you could in Warband should give Generosity when it's implemented. Honestly if it just gave it for having high food variety that would be fine too - since I do that as an RP thing regardless.
I don't know what should give "Emotional" but probably something involving vengeance or defending the honor of your beloved or whateevr.
From what I understand, Mercy and Honor are designed to be basically the same concept... except applied to peasants vs nobility. Which makes sense in a kind of cynical way.
I honestly agree with the both of you on most things. All I am saying is that there is constructive feedback, which actually is what you are both doing in these two posts, and then there's making threads with titles such as "Early Access = Exhausting Alpha". It vents your frustration, and I even understand where that frustration is coming from, but it doesn't accomplish anything constructive. It just fuels other people who are also frustrated, and then we have a nice little thread full of people arguing with each other and I am just... Why? What good can possibly come of this? It's not like devs are oblivious to the fact that there's a lot wrong with the game and many people are unhappy. It's not like they are sitting around and not doing anything about it.
The price is high for what they offer, but then honestly 10 dollars for Warband was ridiculously low for the enjoyment that it offered, so I am not too peeved about that myself. All the other things, well we can only keep providing feedback and hope that they will fix things. There really isn't anything else we can do about it.
I have the impression that the bigger team worked against results. Clearly management is not TW's forte, and they went with a lot of over the top things (e.g. motion capture for animation) in order to follow their grand vision. There is a lot more work behind Bannerlord than it ever went into Warband, but they did a poor job when it comes to delivering results.
Edit: 100% agree on the roadmap, I have been requesting one myself. Of course they can only share a roadmap if they have one
Dr-Shinobi
So are non pessimistic realists with a lot of experience in game white knights to ? just checking. Because i can see flawns in this OPs post that are just inexperience, even if i can agree that some aspects of those statements should be discussed for sure..But i dont want to be to much "White Knight" about it or whatever its called. I mean i can hear a lot of whining about this and that in the forums and some things are not even true, Could be because of the lack of experience or premature anger so yeah some need some kind of "reality checks" from time to time so the devs dont have to waste time when they could make better things. How ever opinions and constructive thinking is always healthy, but sitting here ranting about something you dont understand or wanting easier ways to cheese things is just rubbish posting in my opinion. There is plenty of mods for that.
So to add i have both a top level smith i made along with companions with good skills and rich as **** without cheating on mods in 3-4 days.
I also have a Top commander with top lvl Leadership without a problem. Sure it can take little more time then the others but when you get your armies and/or your vassalship is up its no worries what so ever. (ps theres a cheese for that to if you need handicap)
Ive built and trading Empire asw etc etc
Idk how much people are demanding these days and want everything served with a silver spoon as long as they scream
But i guess some wants to finish the game in 8 hours like the rest of scrub games of today
So with that said....come with solid arguments first then we can talk business
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FullbordadGames
Recruit
The thread is about 95% of the game missing, not how fast you want to finish a campaign.
Also, you can't for real defend that a companion has zero in every skill and -120 in skill points.
Alright, right there. Isn't that a little excessive?
60% of game is missing. The most of the core functions are there. Battles are playable.
A roadmap would really be appreciated. I beta tested Warband and I always had this thought that TW would flesh out the game. It never REALLY happend. They continued to patch the game but developed spinoffs instead of expanding the game I loved. Mount and Blade (original) was so basic, Warband was basic. I want to see them make this game what it should be. Arenas and tournaments for example remain almost completely unchanged since M&B's original release 12 years ago. That is really inexcusable. Arenas, feasts, town scenes, diplomacy, quests and NPC interaction deserve WAY more depth.
My concern is that, like past releases, Bannerlord will remain absolutely bare bones and abandoned post bug fixing to rake in more money with mod-like releases. If they need a cash machine, release DLC. This is mainly a SP focused audience anyway.
In addition to a roadmap schedule, I'd like the community to help define development objectives both short and long term.
A roadmap would really be appreciated. I beta tested Warband and I always had this thought that TW would flesh out the game. It never REALLY happend. They continued to patch the game but developed spinoffs instead of expanding the game I loved. Mount and Blade (original) was so basic, Warband was basic. I want to see them make this game what it should be. Arenas and tournaments for example remain almost completely unchanged since M&B's original release 12 years ago. That is really inexcusable. Arenas, feasts, town scenes, diplomacy, quests and NPC interaction deserve WAY more depth.
My concern is that, like past releases, Bannerlord will remain absolutely bare bones and abandoned post bug fixing to rake in more money with mod-like releases. If they need a cash machine, release DLC. This is mainly a SP focused audience anyway.
In addition to a roadmap schedule, I'd like the community to help define development objectives both short and long term.
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you're being kind, I'd wager 75% of the game is missing, it's just bare-bones gameplay, missing many core features, and also missing progression.
There are a ton of perks that do not work, absolutely zero diplomacy (all diplomacy is being run by place-holder RNG scripts), there are balancing issues, formations are still not working properly, and the list goes on... If you think that killing Looters and serving a noble as a mercenary are 40% of the game, I won't argue, I think it isn't.
FullbordadGames
Recruit
It's a battle simulator with a world map. All the features told about are either not working or simply missing. It's like they took Warband, removed mechanics, gave it better graphics and added smithing. It also took eight years. I mean a simple thing as tournaments had blatant issues like not giving experience. Says a lot about the effort put into testing.
No but seriously, I'm being harsh I know. But it's not like there's small things that needs fixing or should be added. As I wrote earlier in the thread. Get the perks working. Let us auto resolve bandits for experience without loosing T6 units to looters, or just add global exp after fights. Add a god damn button that lets us declare war and peace when we have our own kingdom. Then stop nerfing things unless they are REALLY game breaking and put all focus on adding mechanics instead of fine tuning stuff.
If they did that I would be a very happy dude.
Dr-Shinobi
Well its been entertaining me for 400 hours now and im still not tired of the game so something they must be doing right. Sure theres things missing here but saying its bare boned is little little bit to be underestimating the game.in my opinion. They have been releasing constantly and fixes in short notices. They said 1+ year from now in full release and we are like grasping and yelling for a finished release already after one month. Some cant just take in what they get and want everything now. But sure doesn't mean you can give feedback and try to ship in new ideas. But a game just cant have everything either. Would be to demanding, takes a lot of time along with tweaks and should be handed over to the heroes of the modding community
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royalpaste
Recruit
this is what white knighting is guys "its fine for me so it should be for you". no ones asking for a full game were asking for core issues to be fixed first instead of more goddamn caravan nerfs/nerfs in general. id be fine with the nerfs and whatnot if they was more. but right now a single nerf, nerfs like a 3rd of the game. there's still units with the wrong stats too, like c'mon the caravan nerfs can wait. not to mention they nerfed donation troops/prisinor influence gain into the ground, instead of just nerfing merc contact gold gain... so yes the whining is justified if everyone went on all sunshine and rainbows the game will end up dead in the water like dayz and gang
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Dr-Shinobi
lol what a pile of bull**** comment. Belive me if i really had a gripe about something in a game i would say it and not be mild about it. But since these posts are just bull**** wanting some mechanic they dont understand to be fixed or making the game so ****ing easy because they are to lazy and want xray vision because they are to dumb to think for em selves.... then im here to tell em a thing or two because i want a challenge and enjoy the game to you know
Ex had a guy blatenly going all over saying that one handed spears are useless.So i made a character to see if that was true. Def not and i have proof of it. Next guy saying all over forums the Sturg archers are the worst in game...Then i come out with proof that they are actually second best....So do you get me now kid ?! These ****ing trolls and casual gamers pffff And do you know what the funny part is....80% of the post comments where following up saying the same thing in the comment section even if the proof was there after. So with that said...theres sometimes valid rants which i love to discuss and both agree and disagree with.and sometimes i can be wrong to thinking it was a cool feature after all.... but then theres sometimes just ignorant spoiled pricks who cant see longer then their own noses. And to be frank i think theres other companies in here to wanting to sabotage some success because they are so ****ty to their core, but thats just speculations from an CIA novel
But yeah youre right, they have made the game to easy now because of the complaints, armor can take way to much hits now,. companions cost as much as 3 coal but now have been balanced with some salary so its something, fall damage been reduced which was no biggie, you skill up in no time and you can train your troops to T6 like nothing and so on. So with that im now wanting a new difficulty level and you know whats gonna take time and re balancing for that to happen ? Just because people just complains before even trying, perhaps had one bad experience or they fell a little scraping their knees. And the problem is that TW now have to balance the damn scale back and forth because theres people not really checking in to it and just says its wrong before they have even really tried it
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royalpaste
Recruit
where did i say i want xray vision or make the game easier? or anyone for that matter? i see people actually wanting it harder in other areas than just the economy. and how do we not "understand" the mechanics? the castle and city mechanics are literally as simple as you can get, modders have already took a dive into the code, thats how we found out the autocalc simulation is also exetemely basic. also fyi that 'jab' at the "casuals" only shows your superiority complex, or your just a troll as non of that helps towards the game, non. im just gonna be ignoring your futures posts man, as you dont actually seem to want this game to be better.
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Dr-Shinobi
well then why is the OP complaining about the Trading, Leadership skills and Smithing ? and other stuff ive been figuring out and couldnt see so much problem with like he did ? ...yeah man i love mods to in games and i could say every game is **** to because they dont have em in their game. Especially not when they havent been finished yet and perhaps working on a solid solution or own ideas. What youre missing is that modders can do a specific mod but they are usually not very stable and in some cases balanced in some areas so theres that to. Not saying that all mods are bad and doesnt work but they can unstable your game in some areas. Take skyrim as an example. Its a real cool epic platform but pretty **** rpg without mods if you really look in to it. So its like when someone inventing the light but theres guys making an lampcover thinking the idea of the lamp was all theirs in the first place mentality. And Superiority complex lol you are an manipulator for sure.... No but ive seen what casual gaming mentality actually have been doing with good games and the gaming industry in general the past decades or so. But yes man please ignore my posts since you are just one of those ignorant guys im talking about
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