Can anyone give me some startup tips?

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Mythos

Regular
I'm really lost here on how I'm supposed to actually get started. I can only have 80 troops, 30 of which are going to be worthless mercenaries that can't even fight, and out of my 50 special troops 40 of them are going to be low tier and I can't upgrade them. Every castle has at least 100 men, and almost all of them have a lord sitting in them, adding another hundred men. Siege tower castles are out of the question, considering how in the 21 hours it takes to build one some lord with a 150 man army ALWAYS shows up and kicks my ass. Can someone tell me some helpful stuff I can do to actually get a kingdom going? Last time I actually got a kingdom going I just got my castle taken back in a couple days, as I said in my other topic. None of the factions are remotely weakened right now, so just picking on the losing faction isn't an option.
 
First, you need the help of experts - go collect your companions. OK, they are not experts yet, but you need to assign each a role and build their skills. Although they may grow to be good warriors, it is their party skills that you really need. Get a medic an engineer and a scout. Someone with good strategy is useful. The sooner you get them, the sooner they will level up. Don't forget to give them trainer skill once they get to 10-ish level - it will make building armies and replacing the dead MUCH easier.

Second, you need cash. Tournaments are a good start, just pick the cities that have tournaments that fit your style. I usually have low or no power draw and no mounted archery, so tournaments at the Khergit cities tend to be more challenging. The Nord and Rhodok cities offer more foot melee and Swadia offer more mounted combat, Vaegir have more foot archery in the mix. Ask you local arena master about where to find tournaments.

The other way to make both cash and some XP is to fight bandits. Sea raiders are lucrative in term of loot, but are difficult and will cause many casualties on your side. Mountain bandits are easy if you know how to counter their mounted units (light horses, pretty easy). Forest bandit are a pain if you don't have many shield troops. Against shields or armored cavalry they are meat. Use some blunt weapons to get prisoners - sell them, or talk to them in the party screen to get them to join you and fill your ranks. Do not piss off any nation until you are ready to begin your conquests. Then you can raid the caravans of the nation you want to attack for some cash and to start a personal war with them (so you can siege them).

When you have some cash (don't spend too much on gear, there will be time to get the l33t stuff later. A decent armor and some weapons are enough) start recruiting mercs like mad. Get the one in the taverns and ask the bartender for lowest tier troops. If you (and companions) have some trainer skills, they will become 3-4 tier mercs very fast and it is cheaper than recruiting professionals. Fill your party, then form a regiment (talk to a troop in party screen, then on the world map talk to this new unit to transfer more troops). Fill the regiment, tell it to follow you and get even more troops. Just remember that you want them for siege war - mounted troops have no advantage in that respect and foot mercs are cheaper. Then start your conquests.

First thing you build in your new home is barracks or a range to recruit home troops. If you have this in the castle/town it will start recruiting garrison even when you are not there, supplying you with an endless stream of fresh blood and prevent the castle from being sieged by puny lords. From this point on, the world is your oyster.

 
Regiments are key:

Talk to one of your men, and tell him to start a regiment (don't do it near enemy groups or he will run off before you can talk to him... a real pain in the ass that).

Talk to the regiment. Fill it with men. You can have as many men in a regiment as you have in your party, and as many regiments as you'd like.

I usually put my homeland troops in a regiment, along with some cavalry (so they can keep up) as you don't need to raise the XP of your homeland troops just yet. Beware that regiments cost a lot more, so you'll want to hold off raising regiments until the last possible moment (i.e. when you have lotsa money and a target in mind). Using bandits and mercenaries to fill regiments quickly is a good idea, or if your a vassal than raise an army in the standard way.

hope this helps.

-Sobric
 
I disagree with this regiment tactics. I now controll all of former Vaegir teritory and I never used single regiment. You'd want to do something like this: first. pick someone who will be easy for you to battle (if you play Adenians chose nords etc.). Now, it's time to get some troops. Your motherland troops backed with some mercenaries will do. Now, do carefully read the messages. When you get a message that someone from your picked faction besieged a castle, travel immediately to it's location. Wait till the castle is sieged and also give the besiegers some time to get away. Now, you have a free castle. It won't have more than 20 defenders total, and you should have about 100 troops. Tell them to give up. You will have a castle and some prisoners to recruit into your garrison. Now, take a small army with you (10-20 people max) and go for some bandits (note - be sure you have negative honor before atempting this). Offer them to join you for money and dump them into your castle. In my first castle, I had about 180 mountain bandits before I garrisoned something different. Now, go back to your castle, sit and pray noone will come to take it back. If you will garison it fast enough, you have won.
 
@SanDiego - lol!  That's a good approach too.

Me, I dislike the patrols, so I just level up until I can have about 90+ men in my party (and I get my companions as early as possible, so that they level up with me).  I take any opportune situation that happens to come up to snag a castle, and from there same thing - do my best to garrison it and get an range built and find more peasants to recruit and train up into a replacement army (gotta love killing bandits and caravans).

Soon enough, I've got a new party of 100+, a castle with 100+ garrison, and I'm looking for the next castle I can take... :smile:
 
mouthnhoof said:
First, you need the help of experts - go collect your companions. OK, they are not experts yet, but you need to assign each a role and build their skills. Although they may grow to be good warriors, it is their party skills that you really need. Get a medic an engineer and a scout. Someone with good strategy is useful. The sooner you get them, the sooner they will level up. Don't forget to give them trainer skill once they get to 10-ish level - it will make building armies and replacing the dead MUCH easier.

Second, you need cash. Tournaments are a good start, just pick the cities that have tournaments that fit your style. I usually have low or no power draw and no mounted archery, so tournaments at the Khergit cities tend to be more challenging. The Nord and Rhodok cities offer more foot melee and Swadia offer more mounted combat, Vaegir have more foot archery in the mix. Ask you local arena master about where to find tournaments.

The other way to make both cash and some XP is to fight bandits. Sea raiders are lucrative in term of loot, but are difficult and will cause many casualties on your side. Mountain bandits are easy if you know how to counter their mounted units (light horses, pretty easy). Forest bandit are a pain if you don't have many shield troops. Against shields or armored cavalry they are meat. Use some blunt weapons to get prisoners - sell them, or talk to them in the party screen to get them to join you and fill your ranks. Do not piss off any nation until you are ready to begin your conquests. Then you can raid the caravans of the nation you want to attack for some cash and to start a personal war with them (so you can siege them).

When you have some cash (don't spend too much on gear, there will be time to get the l33t stuff later. A decent armor and some weapons are enough) start recruiting mercs like mad. Get the one in the taverns and ask the bartender for lowest tier troops. If you (and companions) have some trainer skills, they will become 3-4 tier mercs very fast and it is cheaper than recruiting professionals. Fill your party, then form a regiment (talk to a troop in party screen, then on the world map talk to this new unit to transfer more troops). Fill the regiment, tell it to follow you and get even more troops. Just remember that you want them for siege war - mounted troops have no advantage in that respect and foot mercs are cheaper. Then start your conquests.

First thing you build in your new home is barracks or a range to recruit home troops. If you have this in the castle/town it will start recruiting garrison even when you are not there, supplying you with an endless stream of fresh blood and prevent the castle from being sieged by puny lords. From this point on, the world is your oyster.

I already know the basic stuff for Native, but it's actually getting my kingdom started that's the problem. From my experience, the mercs are completely ****ing pathetic in a fight (in my all merc army, I was losing men 3-4 to 1) so I'd be needing several hundred men to take a castle with a 100 man garrison, assuming I could actually find a castle without a lord camping out in it for all eternity. That leaves me with just my kingdom troops, which aren't very many. And Diavolo, the only thing I got told there was to target newly captured castles (which I did) and, from you, to get 100 swadian knights. Which, you know, isn't exactly the easiest/cheapest thing to do. Plus becoming a vassal means 3-4 kingdoms are going to hate my wimpy new kingdom, meaning my amazing reconstruction of my lost kingdom would last about 2 days before every lord in 4 kingdoms show up knocking on my door. Or, you know, mounting it with ladders and burning my new castle to the ground.
 
Mercs in V4.1 are a bit better I suppose. Plus from the V4 the merc line is slightly different (2 troops were added, merc footman and merc sharpshooter).
 
I don't care for mercs either (though I admit to not having used the new ones yet).  So you can always swear vassalage for the 3 month minimum, and build up some Calradian natives, which are better.

As to surviving the initial time after taking your first castle: sometimes its harder than others.  Do you best to kite the forces that come siege you... That's what I do.  If I can get one or two stacks to come after me away from the others (I often have to skirt the edge of their aggro range to tease them away from the main host), then I can take them down piecemeal.  If I have to try to defend my castle against the entire host (say 5+ stacks), I lose.  So don't do that.  Get them to come after you, one army at a time, and destroy them.  They won't be back for a long time if you crush their 5-7 armies in detail, giving you plenty of time to build up & take another castle, and bolster your first with even more defenders.:wink:
 
Hire Blades are fairly good. They have shield and great helmet. What else do you expect? Do you have enough Hire blades in your army? Or you could just lower the damage to you and your troops at the siege.
 
I found the starting to be the most difficult part of the game, you are carrying around a slow army which isn't too effective and no ability to gain decent troops.  Eventually I decided to hunt deserters and bandits with lots of prisoners and come up with a decent sized, and skilled army where I could take and hold my first castle.  Once you have a castle and are able to hold it from the first counter attack you are in good shape.  I also did a good bit of recruiting of key soldiers as prisoners to fill out the weaknesses in my unit. 
Actually, you really need to keep an eye out the entire game for troops you want to recruit that your faction is poor with. 
 
Mythos said:
I already know the basic stuff for Native, but it's actually getting my kingdom started that's the problem. From my experience, the mercs are completely ****ing pathetic in a fight (in my all merc army, I was losing men 3-4 to 1) so I'd be needing several hundred men to take a castle with a 100 man garrison, assuming I could actually find a castle without a lord camping out in it for all eternity.
...
Mercs are weaker than faction troops, but they are a dime a dozen and you don't pay them much if they are dead (just the recruitment fee). The point of using regiments is to bring a lot of fodder to the fight. Besides killing the occasional enemy, they tip the strategy balance in your favor, so you don't spawn with 5 men against 100 (depends also on your battle size slider if you computer can take it). It also allows you to retreat and attack again before their wounded heal. Not very elegant, but this is what you have in the beginning. Eventually, when you take the castle, you have to fill it quickly or every passing lord will stop to siege it - this is why the "regiment meat wagon" is useful.

Sea raiders are excellent troops and very cheap for their skills. I equip my companions with blunts, recruit man hunters and go "recruiting" sea raiders. The man hunters are crap (I hope they get overhauled next version), but they come with horses at low tiers and hopefully knock out a raider before dying - you essentially exchange them for sea raiders. This is a good pass-time occupation in the beginning since it both fills your rank with super cheap good soldiers, fills your pockets from the loot and allows you and companions to level. They are equivalent to mid-high nord troops (not anywhere near Huscarls though). Recruit them by talking to them from party screen,  not from the camp screen.

Remember to use the "hold you fire" command if you want your missile troops to charge in. After you take the top of the ladder, it is better to let them melee than stand and shoot - they will not be very productive unless you tell them where to stand. Also, give "hold fire" order to your infantry. This way they will not stop to use thrown weapons if they have them.

I consider Swadians and Rhodok the easiest factions to attack.

These are all the tips I have.
 
Who to attack when playing (warning - SanDiego's opinion following):
Adenians
Probably nords. As Adenians have supreme cavalry and nords have none you'll be pretty well able to ride them down.
Antarians
I went for Vaegirs, they have relatively weak infantry line, their cavalry isn't of the strongest, but they have really nasty archers. But that can be solved by this tactics: gather your troops by pressing F2 and find a suitable hill. Then, hold position behind the hill, so when enemy archers will be in position to shoot you, you will be in position to slaughter them. Once you defeated first wave, the reinforcements are just a nuisance. Or you could choose nords.
Marinians
Now it's definitely Nords, Vaegirs if you have sympathies with those Nords. Your superior infantry line will stop their and your crossbowmen will literaly grind them to jelly.
Villainese
I would choose Vaegirs, because they have about the same range as you do, but you have better archers and your infantries can stop most charges. You might choose Swadians, but the crossbowmen have superior range. It may be a bad idea to choose nords here.
Zerrikanians
Go for nords. Circle them, shoot them full of arrows, stomp their mutilated corpses into the burned soil. Questions?
 
So basically all of the foreign homeland troops have a huge bias against nords and trained extensively to combat them. And I thought the Rhodocks had it rough.

Except for the Villainese. How do they do against the Kherjits?
 
I need some advice about my first castle, I want to get Distar first (Kingdom of Distar sounds cool) but my 70 nords (veterans, huscarls) failed against the 90 khergit defenders (those lancers are beasts in melee with the 180+ proficiency and 4 power strike, sabres are faaast)

So I want to get Distar, what troops should I use?
 
You could always try to soften them up with archers. I don't know if it's a siege tower castle or not, but if it is then having half the lancers dead by the time your melee guys reach it could be a huge help.
 
they could also be losing because they are being in a bottleneck on the top of the ramp, therefore go a bit "leroy" and try to make some way just on the top of the ramp so your men really can use their numbers. IF this is the case that is.
 
I'm using the Antarians, and they tend to do quite nicely on the bottleneck. They get some damage thanks to archers while trying to break through, but the losses start piling up AFTER the bottleneck. Then again, that's generally when my pathetic, worthless mercs start coming into the fight.
 
Against Khergits just pick someone with shields. Khergits are beasts when it comes to longe range fighting, but in close quarter combat they lack the abilities of other factions. It would be probably best to pick some nord troops or mercerany swordsmen/hired blades, some merc sharpshooters (they have longer range and punch larger force than khergits) and your favourite homeland troops (marinians/antarians/adenians). Send the nords/merc in the first wave, they'll break the bottleneck on the walls (though I highly recommend L&R siege pack). When they get roughed up, your motherland dominators come to scene. Archers and such are already occupied on walls, so your troops will storm them and proceed to reinforcements spawn point, thus making short work of theese. Trust me - a few nobles on reinforcements spawn point effectively blocks the reinforcements :grin:
 
Thanks for the tips, I will disband the nords since they suck against khergits in field battles (as usual) and in sieges to (now thats strange), even if I manage to get Distar I will lose it in the first siege.

I will stick with rhodoks until I get my homeland troops (Sultanate lol)

After I have my kingdom will I still be able to recruit calradian native troops?
 
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