Where's Lezalit when you really need him?

[arthur666]

Dang man I spent an entire evening doing training for recruits and peasants. I'd put them all in one group and just send them charging into looters and forest bandits while me and the Cataphracts just sat there chugging the wine and beer they'd captured for us. "Oh how many we loose this time boss?" "I don't know, don't care, gimmee that wine jug... move out boys!"

Never thought I'd miss Lezalit.

 

[bonerstorm]

I can't f***ing believe that the fix to recruit doomstacks is going to be "make the AI cheat again" instead of actually fixing the structural problems at play.

Namely that there is zero training mechanism in the game AT ALL.

From everything I know about military history, there is almost no scenario where medieval lords would go on offensive campaign with armies consisting almost entirely of half-naked peasants armed with farm implements and no training.

Just like lords should be going to towns to rest when over a quarter of their force is wounded... they should also have a passive training mechanic which is vastly buffed at castles (this would also help reduce snowballing by keeping big settlements loaded with troops). Lords and players should have the ability to train troops up to T3 without ever setting foot on a battlefield.

And, with said passive training mechanic, they should not be going off to war after being respawned until they turn their 200 recruit doomstacks into T2 troops. Have valorous and closefisted lords stick more to T2 troops... whereas cowardly and generous lords lean towards T3's. This will provide a balance where some lords get right back into the fight and others stay behind until they're fielding an effective force.

 

[Earth Dragon]

I can't f***ing believe that the fix to recruit doomstacks is going to be "make the AI cheat again" instead of actually fixing the structural problems at play.

Namely that there is zero training mechanism in the game AT ALL.

From everything I know about military history, there is almost no scenario where medieval lords would go on offensive campaign with armies consisting almost entirely of half-naked peasants armed with farm implements and no training.

Just like lords should be going to towns to rest when over a quarter of their force is wounded... they should also have a passive training mechanic which is vastly buffed at castles (this would also help reduce snowballing by keeping big settlements loaded with troops). Lords and players should have the ability to train troops up to T3 without ever setting foot on a battlefield.

And, with said passive training mechanic, they should not be going off to war after being respawned until they turn their 200 recruit doomstacks into T2 troops. Have valorous and closefisted lords stick more to T2 troops... whereas cowardly and generous lords lean towards T3's. This will provide a balance where some lords get right back into the fight and others stay behind until they're fielding an effective force.

Take a deep breathe, because nothing is indicating that no training system aren't coming down the pike. There is a little more wait and see that needs to be associated with the legitmate criticisms and requests.

 

[bonerstorm]

Take a deep breathe, because nothing is indicating that no training system aren't coming down the pike. There is a little more wait and see that needs to be associated with the legitmate criticisms and requests.

Perhaps. I'm just frustrated that the dev reaction to every problem with the gameplay, especially the campaign, is to hit something hard with the nerf bat instead of fixing the underlying problem.

I understand that they're doing critical engine work but FFS I could really do without "fixes" like making looters into T6-killing rambo's in autobattle... autobattles against looters having been the ONLY reasonable way to train recruits up til then.

Why do they insist on making the game WORSE? Who could have possibly wanted an autobattle buff for looters? Who the eff is talking to the devs and whispering anti-fun poison into their ears???

 

[Earth Dragon]

Perhaps. I'm just frustrated that the dev reaction to every problem with the gameplay, especially the campaign, is to hit something hard with the nerf bat instead of fixing the underlying problem.

I understand that they're doing critical engine work but FFS I could really do without "fixes" like making looters into T6-killing rambo's in autobattle... autobattles against looters having been the ONLY reasonable way to train recruits up til then.

Why do they insist on making the game WORSE? Who could have possibly wanted an autobattle buff for looters? Who the eff is talking to the devs and whispering anti-fun poison into their ears???

Youtubers and Streamers actively mocking the system while they play.

Those tools and fools have WAY too much pull right now. They are a minority that then makes it look like a majority since you can watch and listen to them.

I'm with ya to be sure. I thought is was a very intentional thing to gives a training hold over and if a change was on the docket, could and should have waited until other things were in place.

 

[Koshkasa]

If I can risk trying to read the designers' minds a bit, I think they probably intended the lack of passive training to be compensated for by the fact that you can recruit mid-tier units directly.

That did cross my mind also, but didn't make sense in the long run. If you're giving players the ability to recruit T3 troops, might as well delete those clueless T1 peasants from the game. It's not like they ever have any application other than eating into my grain reserves and dying.

 

[Earth Dragon]

That did cross my mind also, but didn't make sense in the long run. If you're giving players the ability to recruit T3 troops, might as well delete those clueless T1 peasants from the game. It's not like they ever have any application other than eating into my grain reserves and dying.

A huge boost will happen once they fix the leadership training buff to effect the stack. Grabbing 30 Imperial Recruits and able to convert a couple to archers everyday would be sufferable. As it stands now, there is no point to those perks

 

[Koshkasa]

I personally find the troops upgrading speed to be quite acceptable, a little too fast maybe. I mainly use archers and cavs (because infantry just die like flies in battle), and after every battle against a lord or any sizable army, quite a few (usually more than 10 and probably more than 20) of my troops are upgrading to the next tier, and there are a lot of such fights to be had. What I do in game is basically training troops to the top tier and put them in the garrison. I now have my own kingdom and 4 towns each has more than 250 top tier units. The only problem is just they are starving from time to time.

Your point is absolutely true for archers and cav, meaning troops at least T2 and beyond.
That, however, requires the player to obtain those T2 units in the first place. And the inescapable black hole of T1 meatbags wrapped in sweaty rags dying from an archer's cough just won't let you do that effectively.
Hell, I'd say Raise the Meek would be worth it if it only worked (in the sane interpretation of working on every unit of the stack) on T1 peasants. At least I wouldn't feel like throwing clueless chickens into a meat grinder because I expected to chase the millionth looter party down and suddenly stumbled upon a hostile lord.