"Too Complex" and "Soon"

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Terco_Viejo

Spanish Gifquisition
Grandmaster Knight
The players: Do you see this as perfection TW? We don't.

TW: Improvements can be made.

The players: Would you mind expanding upon that?

TW: We may or may not implement improvements later on down the line.

The players: Err... Okay. Thanks, I guess.
TW: But make sure you post your suggestions, they are always welcomed.

The players: Well, actually about the ...

TW: Too complicated bro, unnecessary.
giphy.gif

You two are bad people :iamamoron:
 

Nodice83

Squire
WBWF&SNWVC
The players: Do you see this as perfection TW? We don't.

TW: Improvements can be made.

The players: Would you mind expanding upon that?

TW: We may or may not implement improvements later on down the line.

The players: Err... Okay. Thanks, I guess.
TW: But make sure you post your suggestions, they are always welcomed.

The players: Well, actually about the ...

TW: Too complicated bro, unnecessary.
Reminds me of @MostBlunted... he was famous for those TW-players genre cutscenes. You are both worthy of his legacy!
 

vonbalt

Knight at Arms
WBNWVCM&B
he will return like jesus christ and help us continue this holy fight against the infidels
I say we storm TW's HQ, capture Armagan and keep him as a figurehead like the Shoguns used to do with the emperor of Japan, then we install a privy council of forumites who'll have de facto power in the decision makings of the game :party:
 

danEN

Banned
WBM&BWF&SNWVC
I say we storm TW's HQ, capture Armagan and keep him as a figurehead like the Shoguns used to do with the emperor of Japan, then we install a privy council of forumites who'll have de facto power in the decision makings of the game :party:
good plan BUT there's no point in storming the HQ nobody's ever there working it's just Mexxico locked in the basement forced to work on the game on by himself
 

vonbalt

Knight at Arms
WBNWVCM&B
good plan BUT there's no point in storming the HQ nobody's ever there working it's just Mexxico locked in a room forced to work on the game on by himself
dammit, i've underestimated Armagan, he was one step ahead all this time.

Maybe we can use this to rescue Lust from their dungeons instead? haven't seen the guy since he "left" as community manager, maybe he is still crying for help to this day, shackled to a wall while alone in the dark of Ankara's underground.. :ohdear:
 

danEN

Banned
WBM&BWF&SNWVC
dammit, i've underestimated Armagan, he was one step ahead all this time.

Maybe we can use this to rescue Lust from their dungeons instead? haven't seen the guy since he "left" as community manager, maybe he is still crying for help to this day, shackled to a wall while alone in the dark of Ankara's underground.. :ohdear:
I think he got the **** out of there fast, general manager Ali Erkin left as well, soon Mexxico, The most influential people leaving this train wreck of a company while the game is still in development... makes you wonder.
 

ShakenSpeare

Sergeant at Arms
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
You two are bad people
You can't make an omelette without breaking some eggs!
Reminds me of @MostBlunted... he was famous for those TW-players genre cutscenes. You are both worthy of his legacy!
Thank you, my Lord. 'Tis an incredible honor to be compared to a legend of such epic historical proportions, even if the very essence of my expected humility behoove me to never, ever, even for once consider myself to be anywhere near equal footing to him, the Messiah, and his inexorable grandeur.
 

SOku

Veteran
I can't believe this. Wow. If that doesn't prove a lot of what they are doing is for intention of the consoles, than what does? :confused:

It doesn't prove anything as to the current state of the game, it's a UI change nothing else.
It does prove that TW fails to give us options.
 

Piconi

Fashionista
Section Moderator
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
MRay was kind enough to provide an answer when called upon, no matter what the answer is, and is actually one of the most active developers down at the Suggestions board, the UI subboard, that has seen many community suggestions being implemented.

That being said, "reenacting" the dialogue with a snarky tone is not fair to him specificaly, especially after he has made an appearance at this thread, saying most likely as much as he can, within the scope of his area.

We are always asking TW to "communicate more", rightfully so in most cases, and now when we have a developer actually doing that (even if we don't like the answers), and much, much more in his particular case, i won't let anyone here, or anywhere on the forums, making him uncomfortable anymore by flaming and/or ganging up on him by posting low effort satirical "dialogues", in a thread he participates in, which could potentially lead to him being less active and we see less community suggestions being applied to UI as a consequence of that.
 
It doesn't prove anything as to the current state of the game, it's a UI change nothing else.
It does prove that TW fails to give us options.
They made it so we can't manually adjust the slider for number of troops in battle among other options. I'd call that "not giving us options." One of many of these regressive nonsensical wonders.
 
MRay was kind enough to provide an answer when called upon, no matter what the answer is, and is actually one of the most active developers down at the Suggestions board, the UI subboard, that has seen many community suggestions being implemented.

That being said, "reenacting" the dialogue with a snarky tone is not fair to him specificaly, especially after he has made an appearance at this thread, saying most likely as much as he can, within the scope of his area.

We are always asking TW to "communicate more", rightfully so in most cases, and now when we have a developer actually doing that (even if we don't like the answers), and much, much more in his particular case, i won't let anyone here, or anywhere on the forums, making him uncomfortable anymore by flaming and/or ganging up on him by posting low effort satirical "dialogues", in a thread he participates in, which could potentially lead to him being less active and we see less community suggestions being applied to UI as a consequence of that.

You're right, we've reacted immature and shouldn't have done that. @MRay did nothing to warrant such a response and we're nothing but grateful that someone picked up the glove to engage with us. Rewarding it with low-tier, snarky jokes will not work in both our favors.
Thanks for calling us out and I'll improve my behaviour.
 

Life_Erikson

Master Knight
M&BWBNWVC
MRay was kind enough to provide an answer when called upon, no matter what the answer is, and is actually one of the most active developers down at the Suggestions board, the UI subboard, that has seen many community suggestions being implemented.

That being said, "reenacting" the dialogue with a snarky tone is not fair to him specificaly, especially after he has made an appearance at this thread, saying most likely as much as he can, within the scope of his area.

We are always asking TW to "communicate more", rightfully so in most cases, and now when we have a developer actually doing that (even if we don't like the answers), and much, much more in his particular case, i won't let anyone here, or anywhere on the forums, making him uncomfortable anymore by flaming and/or ganging up on him by posting low effort satirical "dialogues", in a thread he participates in, which could potentially lead to him being less active and we see less community suggestions being applied to UI as a consequence of that.

I don't think the joke was on him personally. The joke is on the relationship between the developement and the playerbase in general. Whilst individual devs might be interested in feedback and may even try and bring suggestions forward, TW's actions and answers speak a different language.

Attacking such devs is of course unjust. They are between a rock and a hard place in terms of information and especially positive news they can give us. But thinking that there is anything to loose in terms of influence on the game developement is a bit bonkers. There is none.
 

Tirdezan

Master Knight
MRay was kind enough to provide an answer when called upon, no matter what the answer is, and is actually one of the most active developers down at the Suggestions board, the UI subboard, that has seen many community suggestions being implemented.

That being said, "reenacting" the dialogue with a snarky tone is not fair to him specificaly, especially after he has made an appearance at this thread, saying most likely as much as he can, within the scope of his area.

We are always asking TW to "communicate more", rightfully so in most cases, and now when we have a developer actually doing that (even if we don't like the answers), and much, much more in his particular case, i won't let anyone here, or anywhere on the forums, making him uncomfortable anymore by flaming and/or ganging up on him by posting low effort satirical "dialogues", in a thread he participates in, which could potentially lead to him being less active and we see less community suggestions being applied to UI as a consequence of that.
You won't let? Lol, mute me.

Anyway, i don't think MRay will get upset and unmotivated (to the point that he refuses to implement or even evaluate any sensible suggestions) just because some random internet dude memed his ideas about the whole situation (and rightfully too, as it is criticism in a humourous way, call it low effort if you want to reduce it to being worthless but it is still criticism, you don't shut criticism down, you take it, harsh or not) (And am i wrong in what i've said? Isn't suggestions are turned down because they are too complicated? If not, then explain it why, so people will relieve and if right and again explain why, so we can have a idea about the situation we don't know why so just meme it with "low effort" satirical "dialogues"). My addition wasn't even directed at him either, i am directly aiming the way this whole situation (EA, slow pace of development, communication problem, lack of depth in the game and refusal of suggestions towards this) handled.

As you mentioned, we are asking for TW to communicate more rightfully. But anwering questions in the forum thread some 2k people have seen is the right way to that? Right, it is supernice thing to come here, see the question, answer it as much as you can. It is nice but it is not a "corporate" way to that. I mean let's say someone will want to learn same issue about this question 2 weeks later, what will happen? Someone will go there an paste the link of this thread. 1 month later same thing will happen. And it is only one question. A series of regular Q&A event would solve that.

My regards.
 
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Nodice83

Squire
WBWF&SNWVC
e are always asking TW to "communicate more", rightfully so in most cases, and now when we have a developer actually doing that (even if we don't like the answers), and much, much more in his particular case, i won't let anyone here, or anywhere on the forums, making him uncomfortable anymore by flaming and/or ganging up on him by posting low effort satirical "dialogues", in a thread he participates in, which could potentially lead to him being less active and we see less community suggestions being applied to UI as a consequence of that.
I don't think the joke was on him personally. The joke is on the relationship between the developement and the playerbase in general. Whilst individual devs might be interested in feedback and may even try and bring suggestions forward, TW's actions and answers speak a different language.

Attacking such devs is of course unjust. They are between a rock and a hard place in terms of information and especially positive news they can give us. But thinking that there is anything to loose in terms of influence on the game developement is a bit bonkers. There is none.
Something is wrong here if this requires further explanation... I am pretty sure everyone (or almost everyone) realized that this wasn't sarcastic innuendo to @MRay (i like your new nickname btw.). No one here would dare to actually blame any developer for anything (and especially MRay - because he actually cares about what we say and for what he has already proven by accomplishing many tasks related to the feedbacks).

I believe this is a general snarky tone to the overall communication policy, which clearly has been imposed on developers. Because I don't know what else happened...

Blaming devs has never been the case on this forum but it is fair to say those things have to be expressed clearly. Making anybody feeling uncomfortable shouldn't be allowed.
 

czarny

Regular
Something is wrong here if this requires further explanation... I am pretty sure everyone (or almost everyone) realized that this wasn't sarcastic innuendo to @MRay (i like your new nickname btw.). No one here would dare to actually blame any developer for anything (and especially MRay - because he actually cares about what we say and for what he has already proven by accomplishing many tasks related to the feedbacks).

I believe this is a general snarky tone to the overall communication policy, which clearly has been imposed on developers. Because I don't know what else happened...

Blaming devs has never been the case on this forum but it is fair to say those things have to be expressed clearly. Making anybody feeling uncomfortable shouldn't be allowed.
That's right. I never thought that any of these "make fun of TW" post were directed to any dev.
 

danEN

Banned
WBM&BWF&SNWVC
You're right, we've reacted immature and shouldn't have done that. @MRay did nothing to warrant such a response and we're nothing but grateful that someone picked up the glove to engage with us. Rewarding it with low-tier, snarky jokes will not work in both our favors.
Thanks for calling us out and I'll improve my behaviour.
giphy.gif
 

ShakenSpeare

Sergeant at Arms
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
MRay was kind enough to provide an answer when called upon, no matter what the answer is, and is actually one of the most active developers down at the Suggestions board, the UI subboard, that has seen many community suggestions being implemented.

That being said, "reenacting" the dialogue with a snarky tone is not fair to him specificaly, especially after he has made an appearance at this thread, saying most likely as much as he can, within the scope of his area.

We are always asking TW to "communicate more", rightfully so in most cases, and now when we have a developer actually doing that (even if we don't like the answers), and much, much more in his particular case, i won't let anyone here, or anywhere on the forums, making him uncomfortable anymore by flaming and/or ganging up on him by posting low effort satirical "dialogues", in a thread he participates in, which could potentially lead to him being less active and we see less community suggestions being applied to UI as a consequence of that.
Lol, what a bunch of garbage. I was mocking the general communication policy, not MRay himself. I wrote the dialogue from the perspective of "TW". In addition, it was lighthearted memery about the situation and the policy and communication style, not "flaming and ganging up on a developer". My grievances are with TW, the organization as a whole, and probably the management, not individual developers. If somehow making fun of what someone has said is equivalent to attacking, flaming, and making someone extremely uncomfortable, then I don't know why someone would ever participate around on the internet. I could easily make a similar argument about you making me feel "uncomfortable and unwelcome" by dissing and disliking my posts, yet, it's valid criticism and open discussion, and an equally ridiculous argument that would clearly demonstrate I shouldn't be on here, so obviously, criticism should not be silenced simply because it is mockery. Clearly, the majority of constructive feedback is ignored, and people will naturally resort to memes or humor when carefully constructed feedback is blatantly ignored or responded to with a "too complex" or whatever vague statement the developers are forced to use.
 
Lol, what a bunch of garbage. I was mocking the general communication policy, not MRay himself. I wrote the dialogue from the perspective of "TW". In addition, it was lighthearted memery about the situation and the policy and communication style, not "flaming and ganging up on a developer". My grievances are with TW, the organization as a whole, and probably the management, not individual developers. If somehow making fun of what someone has said is equivalent to attacking, flaming, and making someone extremely uncomfortable, then I don't know why someone would ever participate around on the internet. I could easily make a similar argument about you making me feel "uncomfortable and unwelcome" by dissing and disliking my posts, yet, it's valid criticism and open discussion, and an equally ridiculous argument that would clearly demonstrate I shouldn't be on here, so obviously, criticism should not be silenced simply because it is mockery. Clearly, the majority of constructive feedback is ignored, and people will naturally resort to memes or humor when carefully constructed feedback is blatantly ignored or responded to with a "too complex" or whatever vague statement the developers are forced to use.

There was a time when children were taught "sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me". Nowadays, it seems people get affected by words way too easily.
 

Piconi

Fashionista
Section Moderator
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
You won't let?
I won't let.
Lol, mute me.
I don't want to do that, nor is there a reason.
And am i wrong in what i've said? Isn't suggestions are turned down because they are too complicated?
I don't think you are wrong, and i have a similar feeling that this game is going more and more towards "accessibility over complexity", sometimes even "accessibility over aesthetics", and i'm not happy about it either.

However, during the period of Beta testing, and then early EA release, i've said most of what i wanted to say about the things i care in this game and now i don't complain anymore (which doesen't mean i am happy with the state of the Native game), but i always tended to express my frustrations in a respectful manner, even recently about 1.5.8 patch and the removal of battlesize slider in favor of dropdown battlesize divisions.
Lol, what a bunch of garbage. I was mocking the general communication policy, not MRay himself. I wrote the dialogue from the perspective of "TW"
To me, it was pretty clearly pointing towards his previous post, as his own sentences from it:
-"Improvements can be made", and
-"If you have more suggestions for the current version, I invite you to the UI suggestions section"
...were paraphrased with a mocking tone, only with the "TW" label instead of his username, only 4 and 5 posts after his, respectively.

That being said, this is still mild stuff to me and that's why i just simply wrote a post here, so it stays that way and doesen't repeat, at least not in this form of what i understood it as.

It's one thing to make fun of a dev and his answers, but then at least be honest about your intentions when called out on it.
If i am wrong, however, and both of you are being honest (like Lord Grindelvald was with his follow up post, which i salute), then MRay will read this and be sure he wasn't personally ridiculed - no harm done, other than me falsely calling something out, in which case i would apologize (but as of now i am not convinced one bit for reasons stated two paragraphs ago).

If you are not, the verbal warning from my previous post in this thread stands as a reminder of what is not desirable, in case it repeats, which would make it not be "mild stuff" anymore, and further action has to take place.
I could easily make a similar argument about you making me feel "uncomfortable and unwelcome"
You too are free to report whatever post of mine makes you feel that way, in which case someone (not me) will handle it appropriately.
 
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