Steppe Bandits

[Mistwraith]

Okay.. I get the idea behind them loving horses... But, 100% always cavalry units that destroy all your companion parties in auto resolve, and you can't run from them because they are always max speed... How are your companion parties supposed to survive that? Without mods that's not even a possibility, because you would require very specific parties to fight the steppe bandits. but cannot control their party makeup.

 

[SkiFreeYeti]

If they weren't absurdly fast on the world map, I don't think they'd be a problem, but as it stands, if you're big enough to fight them you can't catch them, and if you're smaller than them you can't run away from them.

 

[Ananda_The_Destroyer]

If they weren't absurdly fast on the world map, I don't think they'd be a problem, but as it stands, if you're big enough to fight them you can't catch them, and if you're smaller than them you can't run away from them.

Well since they added heritage abilities this isn't true anymore, if you're a Khouzit person you can catch them pretty easily unless you are much larger or have other speed penalties. I still they they should get slower campaine map speed though just for general de-suckyness of the game.

 

[durbal]

Yeah, they need to have some troops on foot added so that they're catchable if more movement actions like resting and such aren't added.

Campaign movement speed is too strong right now and causes all sorts of wonkiness and problems (like having to buy a million horses).

 

[kweassa]

Go in with small number of elite cav, and get rid of them yourself. Then, after cleaning up an area of roamers, hit the hideout.

Problem solved for months.

 

[durbal]

Go in with small number of elite cav, and get rid of them yourself. Then, after cleaning up an area of roamers, hit the hideout.

Problem solved for months.

Ehhh...not that easy. If your force is small enough to catch their smaller units (4-7 or so) then you put yourself at risk of being mobbed by them. It's doable, but it's definitely a bigger pain than any other bandit type. Also, it's worth pointing out that you need a fief of some kind to store your troops in order to do this unless you want to just dismiss your army outright just to deal with steppe bandits.

And their hideout design is horrible. It's just a shooting gallery and the whole field in front of the cave gets pulled when you shoot one guy. Clearing a hideout of 40+ of these guys is bloody and almost unapproachable if you don't have Palatine Guard/Fian Champions or some other armored ranged unit and even then you'll take some decent casualties. And since, again, you can't really catch their smaller units it becomes hard to bleed the hideout of parties by killing the patrols.

It makes no sense that the east is plagued by super bandits. They're too far out of line.

Also, bandit hideouts respawn on a weekly tick, so the problem isn't solved for months.

 

[Mistwraith]

It's not even a worry about my player party. It's the companions that get broken by this. Your companions always rely on auto resolve to finish combat. Steppe Bandits not only get that massive speed boost, but the strength of cavalry in auto resolve combat is sure to decimate whatever party your companion has built. The only way that a steppe bandit is going to get into combat with your companion is when they are about to wreck them with ease. And, your companion can't do crap about it, because even keeping them with horses in inventory, they still can't run away.

 

[Mistwraith]

When create a party, I start them out with 10 Legionary, 10 Palatine Guard, and 10 Imperial Bucellarii. I create this party, and sent them on the way. Unfortunately, I was in the east. As soon as they took off a steppe bandit group of 11 attacked them. I thought, no prob... My guy got that... So I started to walk away. That 11 man unit destroyed my 30 man unit without a problem.

 

[Apocal]

It's not even a worry about my player party. It's the companions that get broken by this. Your companions always rely on auto resolve to finish combat. Steppe Bandits not only get that massive speed boost, but the strength of cavalry in auto resolve combat is sure to decimate whatever party your companion has built. The only way that a steppe bandit is going to get into combat with your companion is when they are about to wreck them with ease. And, your companion can't do crap about it, because even keeping them with horses in inventory, they still can't run away.

When create a party, I start them out with 10 Legionary, 10 Palatine Guard, and 10 Imperial Bucellarii. I create this party, and sent them on the way. Unfortunately, I was in the east. As soon as they took off a steppe bandit group of 11 attacked them. I thought, no prob... My guy got that... So I started to walk away. That 11 man unit destroyed my 30 man unit without a problem.

You were unlucky but troop composition was the issue here. Don't give parties formed in the east non-cavalry. I usually throw 40-50 cavalry in for their starter parties and they manage from that point to survive reasonably well. The only times they get wiped under such circumstances is bad luck like engaging a 12-15 man party of steppe bandits but then having three or four more pile in so they wind up buried in them. And keep in mind that steppe bandits tend to be high tier since they can run down village parties so easily, so you're probably looking at 70% or more being raiders rather than the basic steppe bandits or marauders.

 

[durbal]

You were unlucky but troop composition was the issue here. Don't give parties formed in the east non-cavalry. I usually throw 40-50 cavalry in for their starter parties and they manage from that point to survive reasonably well. The only times they get wiped under such circumstances is bad luck like engaging a 12-15 man party of steppe bandits but then having three or four more pile in so they wind up buried in them. And keep in mind that steppe bandits tend to be high tier since they can run down village parties so easily, so you're probably looking at 70% or more being raiders rather than the basic steppe bandits or marauders.

Needing to give companions 40-50 cavalry is completely unreasonable and isn't even a good idea anyway since they'll still find a way to waste them.

Steppe bandits are completely out of line with all other bandits and need to be changed. Period.

 

[Mistwraith]

You were unlucky but troop composition was the issue here. Don't give parties formed in the east non-cavalry. I usually throw 40-50 cavalry in for their starter parties and they manage from that point to survive reasonably well. The only times they get wiped under such circumstances is bad luck like engaging a 12-15 man party of steppe bandits but then having three or four more pile in so they wind up buried in them. And keep in mind that steppe bandits tend to be high tier since they can run down village parties so easily, so you're probably looking at 70% or more being raiders rather than the basic steppe bandits or marauders.

That would be great, but they end up over there... They don't start there... Then there is the issue with my companions losing MORALE at untold amounts and not being able to hold troops. Which is weird. That is a new one for me after moving up to the latest BETA. And, Steppe Bandits are legitimately OP if you have to do something unreasonable like cheat to get that many cav to waste on a companion early on.

 

[Apocal]

Needing to give companions 40-50 cavalry is completely unreasonable and isn't even a good idea anyway since they'll still find a way to waste them.

Why is that unreasonable?

And, Steppe Bandits are legitimately OP if you have to do something unreasonable like cheat to get that many cav to waste on a companion early on.

Am I doing something incredibly right that I don't really care about 40-50 cav in the mid-game? Like, I don't feel like it is a huge imposition or anything, once I've got my main party fleshed out. They certainly aren't hard to get or expensive, especially the cheap T2 and T3 units you can get out in Khuzait lands.

 

[Ananda_The_Destroyer]

Just leave the steppe bandits alone.

 

[Old-Bull]

Call me a glutton for punishment but I start out the game by taking my three companions and hunting small groups of steppe bandits. I do this until I hit clan tier 1. I usually end up with a party of 12-16 mounted archers with all my prisoners being Khuzait cav.

I do this BECAUSE I play as a Battanian and it's really hard to find mounted archers in or around Battania.

It sucks to fight them though. I use java from horseback and if I don't kill them all my party struggles to finish the off.

Steppe bandits are tough.

 

[:P]

I havn't had to engage them so I dunno. But are the people who are having an easy time playing on "realistic"?
Why are some people having trouble and others not?

I just ignored their parties because they're too fast. I havn't even had a chance to fight them. Testing custom battles though, horse archers are overpowered.

 

[durbal]

I havn't had to engage them so I dunno. But are the people who are having an easy time playing on "realistic"?
Why are some people having trouble and others not?

I just ignored their parties because they're too fast. I havn't even had a chance to fight them. Testing custom battles though, horse archers are overpowered.

I have a feeling a lot of the people saying they're ok are not playing in realistic and/or are playing as Khuzait with their movement speed buff and thus are able to catch them with larger parties. If you're not any of the above, steppe bandits are basically a big 'screw you deal with us' because that's all you can do.

 

[:P]

Ye, I suspect that's the case.

 

[Apocal]

I havn't had to engage them so I dunno. But are the people who are having an easy time playing on "realistic"?
Why are some people having trouble and others not?

I just ignored their parties because they're too fast. I havn't even had a chance to fight them. Testing custom battles though, horse archers are overpowered.

I have a feeling a lot of the people saying they're ok are not playing in realistic and/or are playing as Khuzait with their movement speed buff and thus are able to catch them with larger parties. If you're not any of the above, steppe bandits are basically a big 'screw you deal with us' because that's all you can do.

Most of my playthroughs are pre-1.3 beta branch, so I didn't have the Khuzait campaign movement speed buff. My movement speed modifier is set to realistic. When I hunt steppe bandits it is with a small party (usually less than 25, almost always less than 30) then sitting on top of their hideout so they come to me. I only chase particularly annoying or juicy steppe bandit parties (lots of prisoners) but try to keep my speed above 7.4.

The other reason those small parties are so fast compared to most player parties, even with all-cav, is there is a hidden debuff to the Cavalry bonus to movespeed, based on party size. I understand why TW did this, but it would be nice if it was listed and universal, rather than simply making the Cavalry bonus weaker for larger parties.

Once I figured that out, the solutions were obvious. Either go small, with high-tier shock cav, stripped down in numbers, no spare horses, very little food, no loot/prisoners and zoom-zoom around sniping all of them or bait them in with their hideouts. As an aside, desert bandits can be just as bad, but relatively few people complain about them, even accounting for their low-tier bandits being foot units.

edit: I am not saying steppe bandits are not out of line with others (desert bandits take a bit of time to get rolling) but I think I'm the only person posting how to farm them, so I assume I'm the person you guys are talking about.

 

[:P]

That's a great explanation. Seems like ya gotta tweak your composition to deal with them specifically. But good to know.

Can ya camp outside their hideouts and still catch them with slower movement speeds or do they run away?

 

[Mistwraith]

Seems like no one is actually listening to the issue here...

For those not on point with the convo:
**IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH MY MAIN PARTY COMPOSITION I WRECK WITH MAIN PARTY**

New Parties that I let go and allow to roam the map will eventually work there way into the east. Usually when they are still fledling. However, no matter the composition I give them, they get get wrecked by Steppe Bandits pretty easy. They may win a fight or two, but being the in the east, the chances are that they won't make it thru all of them.

This is the last time I am re-posting the same statement, so... When you guys don't this one, I will just understand that it isn't going to happen with you.