Simulation vs Mission

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Mumiago

Recruit
The game has been officially released and the following issue has still not been fixed nor have I found any mods to at least partially fix this. How does no one care about such a big gameplay / balance issue?

The issue:
The game is literally unplayable. I consider sieges as the most fun part of the game and there is a huge balance issue. Using simulation "send troops" gives siege defenders incredible advantage compared to actually playing the mission where defenders barely have any advantage. So for example 1200 attackers vs 600 defenders on lvl3 walls. In simulation the defenders win with barely sustaining 300 casualties. If I choose to play the mission instead the defenders stand no chance no matter how many extra kills I get as player or if I try to command the defense by myself without the help of AI. How am I supposed to play a game that encourages me to not actually play it ?

The defending army always waits inside the castle for slaughter. Archers on walls have no advantage whatsoever and will therefor trade evenly with the enemy archers standing in front of the walls. Furthermore the amount of archers placed on the walls is very small no matter how large your army garrisoning the castle actually is. At best you will score some catapult hits on the enemy army before they get into the castle. Once they get into your castle its an even fight. The castle walls feel like a cosmetic feature which is just ridiculous.
 

Ananda_The_Destroyer

Grandmaster Knight
I don't think they will fix it. They need different scenes to actually field ranged troops in useful positions and numbers. They already boasted about improving collision so what we've got is probably all we get. They already made the AI ignore a % of the player's power so they will actually attack at all if the player is in a fief (before AI would just siege something else...). I think TW just expect you to siege siege siege and pikachu face when the AI takes something back in an endless loop and this would fit their vision.

There's piles of problems with offensive siege too.
 

Bluko88

Sergeant
The game has been officially released and the following issue has still not been fixed nor have I found any mods to at least partially fix this. How does no one care about such a big gameplay / balance issue?

The issue:
The game is literally unplayable. I consider sieges as the most fun part of the game and there is a huge balance issue. Using simulation "send troops" gives siege defenders incredible advantage compared to actually playing the mission where defenders barely have any advantage. So for example 1200 attackers vs 600 defenders on lvl3 walls. In simulation the defenders win with barely sustaining 300 casualties. If I choose to play the mission instead the defenders stand no chance no matter how many extra kills I get as player or if I try to command the defense by myself without the help of AI. How am I supposed to play a game that encourages me to not actually play it ?

The defending army always waits inside the castle for slaughter. Archers on walls have no advantage whatsoever and will therefor trade evenly with the enemy archers standing in front of the walls. Furthermore the amount of archers placed on the walls is very small no matter how large your army garrisoning the castle actually is. At best you will score some catapult hits on the enemy army before they get into the castle. Once they get into your castle its an even fight. The castle walls feel like a cosmetic feature which is just ridiculous.
Look on the bright side at least auto-resolve is good for something.

But yeah it's kind of a shame you get substantially better results from auto-resolving than actually fighting in person (not how it's supposed to work usually). The A.I. still does way too much dumb **** during sieges, like literally letting enemies run right past them after coming up a ladder. I understand not rushing the ladder, but FFS don't let a dude just run by you to open the gate.


Still get a good laugh from troops jumping off the wall into enemies below.

Don't laugh so much from troops getting stuck in effective dead zones. Really bad map making when you have literal spaces troops and the player can fall into with no way to get out. I can let clipping slide, since virtually every game suffers from that in some way. But the poor layout? No.


The problem is siege maps all vary in quality. Some are okay if you've got a smaller party, but they can also be a problem when you've got a lot of troops too. Then there's others which are much too large. They should all effectively be the same size at least in regards to whether it's a Town/Castle. And or they could actually be tested, but I guess that's what the player base is for.

How am I supposed to play a game that encourages me to not actually play it ?
Uninstall it and wait for complete overhaul mods that actually factor in the player experience. I become more and more convinced that the base game is basically un-salvageable at this point.


Sadly we need more reviews like the IGN one. People can kick and scream here all they want, but unless actual websites and streamer types call TW out on the game's issues - nothing will be done.
 

Brano

Sergeant at Arms
For me it is back to combat flight simulators and waiting for Manor Lords. This game is beyond repair 🤷🏻‍♂️
 

Apocal

Grandmaster Knight
Archers on walls have no advantage whatsoever and will therefor trade evenly with the enemy archers standing in front of the walls. Furthermore the amount of archers placed on the walls is very small no matter how large your army garrisoning the castle actually is.
Yeah. The AI doesn't understand how to use the wall to its advantage and will keep feeding men up there as well.

Instead they should go to a fallback position that can cover the wall and force the enemy to endure being on the receiving end from more numerous archers.
 

Bluko88

Sergeant
Here ya go OP, unfortunately this only works on some siege scenes - cause half of them are broken and troops you manually order just man the walls anyways.
:roll:

 

Mumiago

Recruit
They could at least simply give the archers on walls HP/Attack/Accuracy buff if fixing the AI is so hard.
 

Apocal

Grandmaster Knight
They could at least simply give the archers on walls HP/Attack/Accuracy buff if fixing the AI is so hard.
They'd need to be absolutely insane buffs to compete with an army outside that can bring three, five, ten times as many archers.
 

JunKeteer

Veteran
Here ya go OP, unfortunately this only works on some siege scenes - cause half of them are broken and troops you manually order just man the walls anyways.
:roll:

Yeah, was about to suggest this, dependent on town/castle layouts but takes advantage of how stupid the AI is and the siege pathing set in scenes. Make sure to remove ballistics though as you can't stop your units 'leaking' to re-man them too.

I just wish the rocks you toss were stronger like before, now you need to chuck a couple to take out units now.
 

Mumiago

Recruit
Thats really just abusing bad AI mechanics. Is there no mod that at least somewhat improves siege battles ?
 

JunKeteer

Veteran
I'm sure there is, but it's the entire set-up of everything; from the map siege mechanics (building rams/catapults phase), lack of defender able to choose what they build, poor locations of siege engines sometimes, AI agents still on some very basic siege script pathing, basic troop assignments (ie accidently dropping unit outside the wall or take fall damage when positioning), lack of AI 'in-town' (once walls breached) stage, etc...is a tall task for a modder in their free time.
 

Mumiago

Recruit
Maybe there is an overhaul mod that also brings different siege maps that work better ? If anyone tried any I would welcome recommendations.
 
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