[Europe 1805] Main Topic: General debate, feedback, DOWNLOAD and news.

[Berthout]

For those who are interested I'll post a list with all firearms included in the game.
As you can see I've got more then enough muskets, but if you can still think of a rifle or carbine you would want to see included: feel free to make suggestions.

Pistols (A useful back-up weapon for short ranges)
Dragon - Austrian
1777 Cavalry Pistol - French
An IX Pistol - French
Heavy Dragoon Pistol -British
Long Sea Service Pistol - British
Short Sea Service Pistol - British
Modell 1780 Horse Pistol - Prussian
Modell 1802 Pistol - Swedish
Tula Pistol - Russian
Ottoman Pistol - Ottoman

Old Pistol
Boot Pistol
Duelling Pistol
Hunting Pistol
Hunting Pistol with Shoulder Stock


Muskets (The main Napoleonic weapon. Can fire about 3 shots a minute but is horribly inaccurate.)
Brown Bess - British
India Pattern - British
1766 Charleville - French
1777 Charleville - French
Modell 1740 Musket - Prussian
Modell 1782 Musket - Prussian
Danish 1791 Musket - Danish
Modell 1798 Musket - Austrian
Russian 1805 Musket - Russian
Spanish 1757 Musket - Spanish
Ottoman Miquelet Musket - Ottoman
Sicilian Miquelet Musket - Sicilian

Matchlock Musket
Double Barrel Fowler !!2 shot!!

Rifles (Unlike a normal musket a rifle can be very accurate. The downside is that they have a very low reload speed)
Baker Rifle - British
Pattern 1776 Infantry Rifle - British
Jaeger Rifle - Germanic
Ottoman Miquelet Rifle - Ottoman
Modell 1780 Repeating Air Rifle - Austrian !!30 shot!!
Ferguson Rifle - English !!Breachloader!!

Hunting Rifle

Carbines and Musketoons (Can be used on horseback)
An IX Dragoon Standard - French
Brown Bess Cabrine - British
1753 Miquelet Musketoon - Spanish
Modell 1787 Karbin - Swedish
Double Barrel carbine !!2 shot!!

Bows
Nomad Bow - Russian

 

[TheJohan]

For those who are interestd I'll post a list with all firearms included in the game.
As you can see I've got more then enough muskets, but if you can still think of a rifle or carbine you would want to see included: feel free to make suggestions.

Spoiler

Pistols (A useful back-up weapon for short ranges)
Dragon - Austrian
1777 Cavalry Pistol - French
An IX Pistol - French
Heavy Dragoon Pistol - English
Modell 1780 Horse Pistol - Prussian
Tula Pistol - Russian
Ottoman Pistol - Ottoman

Old Pistol
Duelling Pistol

Muskets (The main Napoleonic weapon. Can fire about 3 shots a minute but is horribly inaccurate.)
Brown Bess - English
India Pattern - English
1766 Charleville - French
1777 Charleville - French
Modell 1740 Musket - Prussian
Modell 1782 Musket - Prussian
Danish 1791 Musket - Danish
Modell 1798 Musket - Austrian
Russian 1805 Musket - Russian
Spanish 1757 Musket - Spanish
Ottoman Miquelet Musket - Ottoman
Sicilian Miquelet Musket - Sicilian

Matchlock Musket
Double Barrel Fowler !!2 shot!!

Rifles (Unlike a normal musket a rifle can be very accurate. The downside is that they have a very low reload speed)
Baker Rifle - English
Pattern 1776 Infantry Rifle - English
Jaeger Rifle - Germanic
Ottoman Miquelet Rifle - Ottoman
Modell 1780 Repeating Air Rifle - Austrian !!30 shot!!
Ferguson Rifle - English !!Breachloader!!

Hunting Rifle

Carbines and Musketoons (Can be used on horseback)
An IX Dragoon Standard - French
Brown Bess Cabrine - English
1753 Miquelet Musketoon - Spanish

Double Barrel carbine !!2 shot!!

Bows
Nomad Bow

What about Swedish guns?
I don't know when they were used but i got links to pictures and first year of manufacture.
(You may have to translate the pages with the help of google translate)
Pistols: http://www.sfhm.se/templates/pages/ArmeObjectListPage____1180.aspx?epslanguage=SV
Carbines: http://www.sfhm.se/templates/pages/ArmeObjectListPage____847.aspx?epslanguage=SV
Rifles: http://www.sfhm.se/templates/pages/ArmeObjectListPage____700.aspx?epslanguage=SV
Muskets: http://www.sfhm.se/templates/pages/ArmeObjectListPage____73.aspx?epslanguage=SV

If you have any questions just ask. 

 

[bjorne.]

For those who are interestd I'll post a list with all firearms included in the game.
As you can see I've got more then enough muskets, but if you can still think of a rifle or carbine you would want to see included: feel free to make suggestions.

Spoiler

Pistols (A useful back-up weapon for short ranges)
Dragon - Austrian
1777 Cavalry Pistol - French
An IX Pistol - French
Heavy Dragoon Pistol - English
Modell 1780 Horse Pistol - Prussian
Tula Pistol - Russian
Ottoman Pistol - Ottoman

Old Pistol
Duelling Pistol

Muskets (The main Napoleonic weapon. Can fire about 3 shots a minute but is horribly inaccurate.)
Brown Bess - English
India Pattern - English
1766 Charleville - French
1777 Charleville - French
Modell 1740 Musket - Prussian
Modell 1782 Musket - Prussian
Danish 1791 Musket - Danish
Modell 1798 Musket - Austrian
Russian 1805 Musket - Russian
Spanish 1757 Musket - Spanish
Ottoman Miquelet Musket - Ottoman
Sicilian Miquelet Musket - Sicilian

Matchlock Musket
Double Barrel Fowler !!2 shot!!

Rifles (Unlike a normal musket a rifle can be very accurate. The downside is that they have a very low reload speed)
Baker Rifle - English
Pattern 1776 Infantry Rifle - English
Jaeger Rifle - Germanic
Ottoman Miquelet Rifle - Ottoman
Modell 1780 Repeating Air Rifle - Austrian !!30 shot!!
Ferguson Rifle - English !!Breachloader!!

Hunting Rifle

Carbines and Musketoons (Can be used on horseback)
An IX Dragoon Standard - French
Brown Bess Cabrine - English
1753 Miquelet Musketoon - Spanish

Double Barrel carbine !!2 shot!!

Bows
Nomad Bow

You made all those? Hot damn... you've been busy.

 

[Berthout]

For those who are interestd I'll post a list with all firearms included in the game.
As you can see I've got more then enough muskets, but if you can still think of a rifle or carbine you would want to see included: feel free to make suggestions.

Spoiler

Pistols (A useful back-up weapon for short ranges)
Dragon - Austrian
1777 Cavalry Pistol - French
An IX Pistol - French
Heavy Dragoon Pistol - English
Modell 1780 Horse Pistol - Prussian
Tula Pistol - Russian
Ottoman Pistol - Ottoman

Old Pistol
Duelling Pistol

Muskets (The main Napoleonic weapon. Can fire about 3 shots a minute but is horribly inaccurate.)
Brown Bess - English
India Pattern - English
1766 Charleville - French
1777 Charleville - French
Modell 1740 Musket - Prussian
Modell 1782 Musket - Prussian
Danish 1791 Musket - Danish
Modell 1798 Musket - Austrian
Russian 1805 Musket - Russian
Spanish 1757 Musket - Spanish
Ottoman Miquelet Musket - Ottoman
Sicilian Miquelet Musket - Sicilian

Matchlock Musket
Double Barrel Fowler !!2 shot!!

Rifles (Unlike a normal musket a rifle can be very accurate. The downside is that they have a very low reload speed)
Baker Rifle - English
Pattern 1776 Infantry Rifle - English
Jaeger Rifle - Germanic
Ottoman Miquelet Rifle - Ottoman
Modell 1780 Repeating Air Rifle - Austrian !!30 shot!!
Ferguson Rifle - English !!Breachloader!!

Hunting Rifle

Carbines and Musketoons (Can be used on horseback)
An IX Dragoon Standard - French
Brown Bess Cabrine - English
1753 Miquelet Musketoon - Spanish

Double Barrel carbine !!2 shot!!

Bows
Nomad Bow

You made all those? Hot damn... you've been busy.

Well to be honnest: Most of the meshes I was given permission to use from other people. So most of the credit goes to them.

But I did have my fun with doing research to get the correct stats for all these guns. Overall I think I can say they are balanced in the same way as in real life.

 

[Berthout]

For those who are interestd I'll post a list with all firearms included in the game.
As you can see I've got more then enough muskets, but if you can still think of a rifle or carbine you would want to see included: feel free to make suggestions.

Spoiler

Pistols (A useful back-up weapon for short ranges)
Dragon - Austrian
1777 Cavalry Pistol - French
An IX Pistol - French
Heavy Dragoon Pistol - English
Modell 1780 Horse Pistol - Prussian
Tula Pistol - Russian
Ottoman Pistol - Ottoman

Old Pistol
Duelling Pistol

Muskets (The main Napoleonic weapon. Can fire about 3 shots a minute but is horribly inaccurate.)
Brown Bess - English
India Pattern - English
1766 Charleville - French
1777 Charleville - French
Modell 1740 Musket - Prussian
Modell 1782 Musket - Prussian
Danish 1791 Musket - Danish
Modell 1798 Musket - Austrian
Russian 1805 Musket - Russian
Spanish 1757 Musket - Spanish
Ottoman Miquelet Musket - Ottoman
Sicilian Miquelet Musket - Sicilian

Matchlock Musket
Double Barrel Fowler !!2 shot!!

Rifles (Unlike a normal musket a rifle can be very accurate. The downside is that they have a very low reload speed)
Baker Rifle - English
Pattern 1776 Infantry Rifle - English
Jaeger Rifle - Germanic
Ottoman Miquelet Rifle - Ottoman
Modell 1780 Repeating Air Rifle - Austrian !!30 shot!!
Ferguson Rifle - English !!Breachloader!!

Hunting Rifle

Carbines and Musketoons (Can be used on horseback)
An IX Dragoon Standard - French
Brown Bess Cabrine - English
1753 Miquelet Musketoon - Spanish

Double Barrel carbine !!2 shot!!

Bows
Nomad Bow

What about Swedish guns?
I don't know when they were used but i got links to pictures and first year of manufacture.
(You may have to translate the pages with the help of google translate)
Pistols: http://www.sfhm.se/templates/pages/ArmeObjectListPage____1180.aspx?epslanguage=SV
Carbines: http://www.sfhm.se/templates/pages/ArmeObjectListPage____847.aspx?epslanguage=SV
Rifles: http://www.sfhm.se/templates/pages/ArmeObjectListPage____700.aspx?epslanguage=SV
Muskets: http://www.sfhm.se/templates/pages/ArmeObjectListPage____73.aspx?epslanguage=SV

If you have any questions just ask. 

Thanks a lot! This exactly what I needed. I'll look into them a bit and will probably add a couple.

 

[bjorne.]

Yea? I presume you've made the weapons alot more accurate right?

I got a counciling question to you. What do you think is the best?

Accurate but Slow
Quite Accurate and Quite Slow
As inaccurate as now but abit faster

 

[Berthout]

I think accuracy is about the same actually. Personally I prefer as realistic as possible.

 

[Quintillius]

I prefer huge difference between the rifles. Also very high prices (+10.000). and low prices. =) But I think this is already ingame =).

 

[bjorne.]

I think accuracy is about the same actually. Personally I prefer as realistic as possible.

Yea, but thinking about it. Normal firing range with a musket is 30-100meters. For each 10meter does the hit chance decrease by 1. So 100% (1) at 10meter, 50%(1/2) at 20 meters, 30% (1/3) at 30 meters. But coming as close as 30meters doesn't work, since then the AI would charge.  100meters is close enough, but realisticly it would be a 1/10 to hit, 10% that is. So if you have 80 units does 8 actually hit something. But then again, this is danger-close ingame. It might just be 200meters.  1/20 chance, 5%. So now 80 troops fire and 4 hit. Does this make any sense?

I'd like to see 80 fire and 15 at the range of 200meters. And when the enemy charges and you manage to make a last volley, and make that volley at about 50meters or so, then 60 guys hit. Which would be way cooler, right?

Note: Hits doens't mean leathal hits.

and yet again, you want to encourage the player to use guns aswell, if you never hit, it ain't that fun.
And if you look at the beta right now, are the guns so bad, they are useless. It's alot more efficiant to use cavalry or melee infantry, considering the siege battles are the most important. There are cavalry with lances the best, and that's just wrong.

Though having to efficiant muskets ain't good either, then sieges would be impossible to accomplish, since you'd be shot down on the ladders or ramps.

So it's something that's need to be polished for sure...


God save math..

 

[Bearomir]

I agree with the level of futility when using firearms in Realm of revolution. I believe they should be more lethal.
For instance when fighting sea raiders and equal numbers, the sea raiders will rip trough your lines. To begin with their shields manage to stop most of the bullets and once the close by the soldiers are no match for their melee.
I believe they should be a bit innacurate but mighty lethal.

This would encourage lines to get as close as possible to the enemy then unleash a volley and then do a bayonet charge. But then again, we have an issue with shields as they will at least stop one hit before being destroyed. I guess there is no fix around that.

 

[Berthout]

I think accuracy is about the same actually. Personally I prefer as realistic as possible.

Yea, but thinking about it. Normal firing range with a musket is 30-100meters. For each 10meter does the hit chance decrease by 1. So 100% (1) at 10meter, 50%(1/2) at 20 meters, 30% (1/3) at 30 meters. But coming as close as 30meters doesn't work, since then the AI would charge.  100meters is close enough, but realisticly it would be a 1/10 to hit, 10% that is. So if you have 80 units does 8 actually hit something. But then again, this is danger-close ingame. It might just be 200meters.  1/20 chance, 5%. So now 80 troops fire and 4 hit. Does this make any sense?

I'd like to see 80 fire and 15 at the range of 200meters. And when the enemy charges and you manage to make a last volley, and make that volley at about 50meters or so, then 60 guys hit. Which would be way cooler, right?

Note: Hits doens't mean leathal hits.

and yet again, you want to encourage the player to use guns aswell, if you never hit, it ain't that fun.
And if you look at the beta right now, are the guns so bad, they are useless. It's alot more efficiant to use cavalry or melee infantry, considering the siege battles are the most important. There are cavalry with lances the best, and that's just wrong.

Though having to efficiant muskets ain't good either, then sieges would be impossible to accomplish, since you'd be shot down on the ladders or ramps.

So it's something that's need to be polished for sure...


God save math..

Aha! I get the problem now. My way of think was different. I limited the effective range of muskets because of the small map size (I just hate it when you get shot from the other side of the map). To compensate I increased the reloading speed a bit.

I also don't have problems with the charging because of the formations kit

 

[Quintillius]

Though having to efficiant muskets ain't good either, then sieges would be impossible to accomplish, since you'd be shot down on the ladders or ramps.

You can’t win a siege scene in native… So there is no difference. You only can win by setting the maximum people ingame from 100 to 10/40

But… Did you ever heard of ladders or siege towers in 1805? I not. So I have got a siege ready and there are no ladders/siege towers.

Also you will have enough possibilities to take cover. (Traverse e.g.)

Spoiler

About the guns. The bullet is firing in an arc. Can you make it, so the bullet will fire in a straight line? This would be very handy, surely when I retexture the texture of that ball. (more white, like Napoleon – Total War, but not TOO WHITE) When I do this, you can see where the bullet is, so you can aim  much and much better.

 

[AK]

Though having to efficiant muskets ain't good either, then sieges would be impossible to accomplish, since you'd be shot down on the ladders or ramps.

You can’t win a siege scene in native… So there is no difference. You only can win by setting the maximum people ingame from 100 to 10/40

But… Did you ever heard of ladders or siege towers in 1805? I not. So I have got a siege ready and there are no ladders/siege towers.

Also you will have enough possibilities to take cover. (Traverse e.g.)

Spoiler

About the guns. The bullet is firing in an arc. Can you make it, so the bullet will fire in a straight line? This would be very handy, surely when I retexture the texture of that ball. (more white, like Napoleon – Total War, but not TOO WHITE) When I do this, you can see where the bullet is, so you can aim  much and much better.

Cool

 

[Quintillius]

Spoiler

 

[Bearomir]

I think accuracy is about the same actually. Personally I prefer as realistic as possible.

Yea, but thinking about it. Normal firing range with a musket is 30-100meters. For each 10meter does the hit chance decrease by 1. So 100% (1) at 10meter, 50%(1/2) at 20 meters, 30% (1/3) at 30 meters. But coming as close as 30meters doesn't work, since then the AI would charge.  100meters is close enough, but realisticly it would be a 1/10 to hit, 10% that is. So if you have 80 units does 8 actually hit something. But then again, this is danger-close ingame. It might just be 200meters.  1/20 chance, 5%. So now 80 troops fire and 4 hit. Does this make any sense?

I'd like to see 80 fire and 15 at the range of 200meters. And when the enemy charges and you manage to make a last volley, and make that volley at about 50meters or so, then 60 guys hit. Which would be way cooler, right?

Note: Hits doens't mean leathal hits.

and yet again, you want to encourage the player to use guns aswell, if you never hit, it ain't that fun.
And if you look at the beta right now, are the guns so bad, they are useless. It's alot more efficiant to use cavalry or melee infantry, considering the siege battles are the most important. There are cavalry with lances the best, and that's just wrong.

Though having to efficiant muskets ain't good either, then sieges would be impossible to accomplish, since you'd be shot down on the ladders or ramps.

So it's something that's need to be polished for sure...


God save math..

Aha! I get the problem now. My way of think was different. I limited the effective range of muskets because of the small map size (I just hate it when you get shot from the other side of the map). To compensate I increased the reloading speed a bit.

I also don't have problems with the charging because of the formations kit

Are you using the "Form Ranks!" kit or the other one?

 

[CCDK]

Are you making new fortress scenes for the five pointed modern fortresses instead of the old box type too?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Fortbourtange.jpg

 

[Berthout]

Are you using the "Form Ranks!" kit or the other one?

I'll release 2 or 3 versions. 1 with form ranks, 1 without any kit and possibly one with mirathei's formations.

Are you making new fortress scenes for the five pointed modern fortresses instead of the old box type too?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Fortbourtange.jpg

Yes, but I'm not sure yet if you will be able to attack them from all sides.

 

[bjorne.]

But… Did you ever heard of ladders or siege towers in 1805? I not. So I have got a siege ready and there are no ladders/siege towers.

I'm not quite sure what you are implying... what is it you miss in the siege? You might wanna clearify that.

Also you will have enough possibilities to take cover. (Traverse e.g.)

Spoiler

The problem with this is that cover doesn't work that well in Mount&Blade. Since your troops won't fire if something stands infront of them and got a certain height. And the cover does need a certain height to gain the cover effect.
So I don't know really.

About the guns. The bullet is firing in an arc. Can you make it, so the bullet will fire in a straight line? This would be very handy, surely when I retexture the texture of that ball. (more white, like Napoleon – Total War, but not TOO WHITE) When I do this, you can see where the bullet is, so you can aim  much and much better.

Or, you're an awesome guy like me and remodel the entire thing, with a white trace. Atleast until I get my white-trace code working.
I was thinking of adding a thin particle system in the form of very light dense smoke after the model. But then I'd have to remake it into a sceneprop, I think. Since I don't think item triggers will look that good, or maybe it does.


EDIT: Oh and by the way, the bullets do fire in a straight line... Notice that it's speed is at 255, max, making it as straight as possible.

 

[Berthout]

Or, you're an awesome guy like me and remodel the entire thing, with a white trace. Atleast until I get my white-trace code working.
I was thinking of adding a thin particle system in the form of very light dense smoke after the model. But then I'd have to remake it into a sceneprop, I think. Since I don't think item triggers will look that good, or maybe it does.

Won't this reduce the game speed (and thus battle size) more then it improves the gameplay?

 

[Quintillius]

Are you making new fortress scenes for the five pointed modern fortresses instead of the old box type too?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Fortbourtange.jpg

Only forts are star forts I think. The map is too little to contain a large (realistic) city.
Actually, in the 19th centuries... they decide to checkout the walls and place parks/boulevards etc. That was around 1850, but the walls lost their defend skill since there is artillery.

But… Did you ever heard of ladders or siege towers in 1805? I not. So I have got a siege ready and there are no ladders/siege towers.

I'm not quite sure what you are implying... what is it you miss in the siege? You might wanna clearify that.

When you are entering a battle, the walls are already destroyed by the heavy artillery. There are no ladders or unrealistics siege towers.

Also you will have enough possibilities to take cover. (Traverse e.g.)

Spoiler

The problem with this is that cover doesn't work that well in Mount&Blade. Since your troops won't fire if something stands infront of them and got a certain height. And the cover does need a certain height to gain the cover effect.
So I don't know really.

I know. But it isn't for the stupid () AI. It's for the player himself. In the native siege scenes... it's almost impossible to win it...
Now, I added many cover possibilities, also when you are attacking a wall (outside walls) You will find many little wooden walls, like trenches. So, you won't hit by the gunmen on the wall, which could really be a ****.

About the guns. The bullet is firing in an arc. Can you make it, so the bullet will fire in a straight line? This would be very handy, surely when I retexture the texture of that ball. (more white, like Napoleon – Total War, but not TOO WHITE) When I do this, you can see where the bullet is, so you can aim  much and much better.

Or, you're an awesome guy like me and remodel the entire thing, with a white trace. Atleast until I get my white-trace code working.
I was thinking of adding a thin particle system in the form of very light dense smoke after the model. But then I'd have to remake it into a sceneprop, I think. Since I don't think item triggers will look that good, or maybe it does.

I'm sorry, I can't understand you very good. My plan was to edit the visible flying _arrow into a little thingie (bullet). The texture will be white, so you can train your accurary skills on a more realistic and better way.
I hope I can finishing this, before the mod will release.

EDIT: Oh and by the way, the bullets do fire in a straight line... Notice that it's speed is at 255, max, making it as straight as possible.

Nice =), very nice!! A question. What about the 1866 mod. Do they have the same speed?