[DISCUSSION] Fan Suggestion Thread

[12oz Jesus]

Adding in a "Royal Sandbox" starting option (start as King of a faction or similar shortcut to some of the early grind) ala Viking Conquest would be most welcomed.

I fully understand that PoP is intended to be harder and for experienced M&B players, etc, etc.  However, many of us have successfully completed the early grind many, many, many, many, (shall I go on?), times in a number of mods including previous versions of PoP.  It is not a matter of can we overcome the challenge; it becomes a lengthy repetition to get to "the good stuff".

Love the mod, would love it much more with this OPTION for those who chose it.

 

[Raviollius]

Well, for the time being you can always import your character, turn cheats on and pick the "Make me awesome" option of the MV's testing stuff in the cheatmenu.

 

[12oz Jesus]

Can't find any "Make me awesome" or MV's Testing. (I was curious to see what it did)

 

[Savhos]

I'd like to see some aspects of the "A Clash Of Kings" mod added here in PoP, like lances breaking after a hit, infinite waves of reinforcements/new enemies that allow big battles to be smoother, lore related quests.

I'm no modder, I don't know if that's doable, nor I expect everybody to like those features, but I think it'd be cool to have them here too.

 

[Vitorio]

KotEG bounty quest are to hunt down some Noldor and Silvermist
The problem is :

Noldor are hardcore
Silvermists are elusive

Alternate targets beside silvermists (e.g heretics, forest bandit) are much apreciated.

 

[Raviollius]

KotEG bounty quest are to hunt down some Noldor and Silvermist
The problem is :

Noldor are hardcore
Silvermists are elusive

Alternate targets beside silvermists (e.g heretics, forest bandit) are much apreciated.

Step 1- Pick bounty quest
Step 2- Pick Rival Order quest
Step 3- Kill Silvermists that spawned outside your fief
Step 4- Turn in both quests at once

 

[Vitorio]

Silvermist did not have chapter, unfortunately 

 

[Evelyn]

I'd like to see some aspects of the "A Clash Of Kings" mod added here in PoP, like lances breaking after a hit, infinite waves of reinforcements/new enemies that allow big battles to be smoother, lore related quests.

I'm no modder, I don't know if that's doable, nor I expect everybody to like those features, but I think it'd be cool to have them here too.

As awesome as that would be, there just isn't enough coding manpower available to make that a reality. Unless you want to wait eight months for six-hundred more patches after the fact.

 

[Vissy]

KotEG bounty quest are to hunt down some Noldor and Silvermist
The problem is :

Noldor are hardcore
Silvermists are elusive

Alternate targets beside silvermists (e.g heretics, forest bandit) are much apreciated.

Dude, you don't get what being a KotEG is all about. They are ironmen. If you were a true KotEG, you wouldn't call Noldor "hardcore", you'd be crushing them on the battlefield by the hundreds. Silvermists *ptooie* are just noldor wannabes, weakling cowardly archers. True KotEG relish challenge. True KotEG find all Silvermists, because cowards can't hide from real men. True KotEG crush all elves, because nobody is more hardcore than Knights of the Ebony F****ng Gauntlet.

 

[Vitorio]

True KotEG find all Silvermists, because cowards can't hide from real men. True KotEG crush all elves, because nobody is more hardcore than Knights of the Ebony F****ng Gauntlet.

 

Well, thats too much...I guess...

 

[Chriss39]

Is there any chance of implementing a script that spawns different feast attendees each time you enter the hall? It's somewhat annoying to never be able to find the person you're looking for because all the spawn spots have already been taken. I really like that you've implemented the Veccavi upgrade path for the peasant women line. Would it be possible to have one branch for Veccavian Royal Archers?

I'm really looking forward to being able to train all the Mettenheim troop types from the Avontereur tavern mercenaries.

 

[Aunodin]

Is there any chance of implementing a script that spawns different feast attendees each time you enter the hall? It's somewhat annoying to never be able to find the person you're looking for because all the spawn spots have already been taken. I really like that you've implemented the Veccavi upgrade path for the peasant women line. Would it be possible to have one branch for Veccavian Royal Archers?

I'm really looking forward to being able to train all the Mettenheim troop types from the Avontereur tavern mercenaries.

I think having man hunters given the option to upgrade to the royal archers may be a bit op but something I would like to see, since apparently the royal archers are better than the ravenstern wardens, but worse than the rangers. So upgrading so early may be something they would want to avoid. You may be able to get away with it if it branchs off from the Horse or there is an additional archer unit for the Veccavia.

I suggested that there should be a Meltine character in the companion roster, A suggestion could be to add in Flavius from PoP 4 but 20 years younger. Again adding a Meltine character gives you the option of having one of each major foreign power in the game.Since julia seems to only have one character she likes, you could have her like Flavius and Flavius could consider her a cousin because of their empires past connection.

Is it possible to add in the Meltine as a possible recruitment choice for the heartbeat quests? I really do want the possibility of my empire army to have the combo of both

 

[wou]

In general I think the KO quests could use some rework, when it comes to bounties it's pretty unbalanced. For example I was doing bounties for Clarion Call, and it was smooth as butter, there are Jatu and Noldor aplenty all around, and you need one/two warbands and you're done. Two days tops with chasing them through the desert. Then I tried doing a bounty for the Phenixes, Red Brotherhood and Rogue Adventurers (I think?). And that was a royal pain in the a.. because there are rather few of them, spread all over the map, and the RB units barely give any points so you need to track and kill a load of them. Had to savescum to barely make it in time.
And the renown quest... 170 renown in 20 days? 190? Really?
I mean, yeah, it is doable, in right circumstances and with a fair bit of cheesing, but come on...

Also a general though, I think the point in the game when you're able to join an order comes too late in game. I think it'd be a great way to obtain your first decent suit of armor, but by the point you have 500 renown and are able to defeat 3 knights at once you don't need that stuff anymore, the sergeant, knight and likely even knight commander stuff you get will go straight to companions/store. You grind through 220 rank points with no real reward on hand.
Of course there needs to be some limit so you don't get the lordly stuff too early, but maybe your rank can be tied to the renown maybe?
Maybe you could become a sergeant easily, but advancing to knight would require the trial of arms and enough renown?

Oh, and one more thing:
Establishing CKO takes a qualis gem, and that's perfectly fine.
But maybe building another chapter of the same order, as long as you still have your first one, could be possible without it?

 

[Amalec]

Any chance you'd take a look at the economics side of the game next? Current state (imo):

Prisoner farming: By far the best way to pull in cash, all game.
Tournaments: A solid supplement as long as you get max odds on your bets.
Industry: A decent, reliable supplement for a reasonable investment cost.
Fiefs: A couple of villages is a nice supplement, but hardly decisive compared to tournaments and prisoners. Other than for knights and a place to store troops, castles and towns aren't really worth the cost of garrisoning or the hassle of re-taking or beating of sieges.
Loot: Reasonable in the early game, irrelevant by mid game.
Quests: Most cost you pay next to nothing. A few pay enough to be relevant in the first hour or so of a game. Only ever really done for relations afterward.

Early game feels good. Fighting for loot and prisoners, participating in tournaments and doing the odd quest feels pretty decent.

Mid game feels right. You've got your first castle and your industries up and running. Clubbing adventure companies and winning tournaments to build up cash and renown to further your ambitions makes sense. Being able to make meaningful investments in your fiefs would make a lot of sense at this point, rather than stockpiling cash.

Late game, not so much. You've built up a half dozen fiefs but they don't really pay well. Garrisoning castles, protecting villages, and beating off sieges takes a lot of time and men. It feels right, but still needing to farm prisoners and fighting in tournaments to pay your men doesn't. Upgrading your fiefs is a huge cash sink and takes ages, with very little reward.


It'd be really nice if, by late game, the economic game transferred to fief management. Building upgrades, beating off raiders and sieges, hiring sheriffs to patrol for bandits and clearing bandit lairs, sending and protecting merchant caravans, etc. instead of more prisoner farming. You're a powerful lord or a king after all, you should be funding tournaments not fighting in them in the hopes you can pay your men for a couple more weeks with the winnings. And, like every other lord in the game, you should be able to afford reasonable garrisons and field a reasonable army with proper stewardship of your lands.

 

[TrashMan]

- Best buds with a lord
- Hero of the kingdom, tons of renown and honor
- His daughter loves me
- Get married
- Ask my mother-in-law to help smooth relations with a lord
- "I don't know you well enough"

Marrying should give you a relation boost with family members!


Also, it's next to impossible to get relationship boosts with ladies (mothers, not the ones you plan to woo), since they have to in the town/castle you won the tournament in (can't dedicate victory) and they don't give you any quests whatsoever (except prison rescue, but the lord has to be captured for that)

 

[TrashMan]

Any chance you'd take a look at the economics side of the game next? Current state (imo):

Prisoner farming: By far the best way to pull in cash, all game.
Tournaments: A solid supplement as long as you get max odds on your bets.
Industry: A decent, reliable supplement for a reasonable investment cost.
Fiefs: A couple of villages is a nice supplement, but hardly decisive compared to tournaments and prisoners. Other than for knights and a place to store troops, castles and towns aren't really worth the cost of garrisoning or the hassle of re-taking or beating of sieges.
Loot: Reasonable in the early game, irrelevant by mid game.
Quests: Most cost you pay next to nothing. A few pay enough to be relevant in the first hour or so of a game. Only ever really done for relations afterward.

Early game feels good. Fighting for loot and prisoners, participating in tournaments and doing the odd quest feels pretty decent.

Mid game feels right. You've got your first castle and your industries up and running. Clubbing adventure companies and winning tournaments to build up cash and renown to further your ambitions makes sense. Being able to make meaningful investments in your fiefs would make a lot of sense at this point, rather than stockpiling cash.

Late game, not so much. You've built up a half dozen fiefs but they don't really pay well. Garrisoning castles, protecting villages, and beating off sieges takes a lot of time and men. It feels right, but still needing to farm prisoners and fighting in tournaments to pay your men doesn't. Upgrading your fiefs is a huge cash sink and takes ages, with very little reward.


It'd be really nice if, by late game, the economic game transferred to fief management. Building upgrades, beating off raiders and sieges, hiring sheriffs to patrol for bandits and clearing bandit lairs, sending and protecting merchant caravans, etc. instead of more prisoner farming. You're a powerful lord or a king after all, you should be funding tournaments not fighting in them in the hopes you can pay your men for a couple more weeks with the winnings. And, like every other lord in the game, you should be able to afford reasonable garrisons and field a reasonable army with proper stewardship of your lands.

He is kinda right.
Especially some time-consuming quests, like tracking down bandits that are on the other end of the map.
Even better when they ask you to kill a Jatu Army or something!

The money gained should reflect the risk.

 

[TrashMan]

3. Please, just change the throne room in Sarleon and move it to another city. It looks like a tavern. The three cities of the Empire sport awesome main halls. Why not Sarleon, the most prestigious city of the realm?

Why does the throne hall of the city which produce the biggest amount of beer of all Pendor look like a tavern, I wonder? 

I LIKE THAT ROOM!
Don't touch it!

 

[Raviollius]

It'd be really nice if, by late game, the economic game transferred to fief management. Building upgrades, beating off raiders and sieges, hiring sheriffs to patrol for bandits and clearing bandit lairs, sending and protecting merchant caravans, etc. instead of more prisoner farming. You're a powerful lord or a king after all, you should be funding tournaments not fighting in them in the hopes you can pay your men for a couple more weeks with the winnings. And, like every other lord in the game, you should be able to afford reasonable garrisons and field a reasonable army with proper stewardship of your lands.

But you can do that currently. It's just nowhere as good as prisoner farming, but that's a fault of the latter.

 

[TrashMan]

Rune Crossbows/Javelins?

Runed MACE.

I honestly think weapons and armor need re-balancing.

 

[Amalec]

But you can do that currently. It's just nowhere as good as prisoner farming, but that's a fault of the latter.

Not really. I mean, prisoner farming may or may not be too effective but lowering it enough to make fief income relevant alone would mean you'd hardly be able to afford even token garrisons on top of the men to travel around beating off sieges and retaking castles.

And sure, you can play a fief management game currently. You just shouldn't. Chasing bandits and setting up patrols is a waste of your time. 99% of fief improvements will effectively never pay back their upfront cost. Merchant caravans are just something that happens and, while more make it through in peacetime, it doesn't even come close to compensating for the income of having hostile lords to farm prisoners from. You could substantially differentiate mid-game play from late-game play just by tweaking the numbers a bit.

I would like to see fief improvements pay back their investment in around the same time as industry currently does, and add substantially more value than the currently do. That'd make it worthwhile to actually garrison your castles instead of just re-taking them every 3 days, since you'd lose the income and need to repair the improvements. To compensate, you'd actually be able to afford to garrison your castles rather than spending all your time chasing prisoners.

Even better, I'd love to see improvements which paid only towards the wages of garrisoned troops. I doubt this would even be possible though.