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<p>Concept artists are the backbone of an art department. A 3D artist or an animator might be constrained by technical limitations or by the particular engine that a game is using, but a concept artist can let their imagination run wild. Combining their research, their artistic sources, and their own skill, they explore new aesthetic possibilities and lead the art of a game to new territories, effectively pushing the boundaries of what a game can offer (in visual terms) to its players. In this week's entry in our blog about Mount & Blade II: Bannerlord and the team behind it, we talk with our concept artist Ali Eser, who created (among other things) the faction banners, many castles, interiors, clothes, and armours. When you look at some impressive-looking armours from Bannerlord: it's very likely that it started with Ali thinking, "hey, this would look cool in the game!".</p></br> [/parsehtml]Read more at: http://www.taleworlds.com/en/Games/Bannerlord/Blog/61
Dev Blog 24/05/18
- Thread starter Callum
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CheetahSpeed
Recruit
Nice
I'd prefer something like 10% but I agree it should be reasonable. I do question how difficult it is to balance though since there is no reason the devs can't just make the middle height most optimal and have if be a cosmetic sacrificemonoolho said:
Hello, my dear, distant, unfamiliar friend monoolho! Thanks for the kind words!monoolho said:Edit: I have just seen this...
THE LEGEND RETURNS!Yaga said:Hello, Callum! Hello, friends!
Guys, I missed you.
Callum, and who draws the trees?
And how do they look now?
Welcome, my dear good sir from the slavlands! And I do hope everything is good and well with you and your loved one!
Life, a complicated thing. But my beloved and I are doing well! We try very hard - we cope with obstacles, overcome evil, multiply goodness, and create our new life!
Maximim 10% of allowed height difference in singleplayer is more than enough. That means if we take the average height of soldiers in calradia to be 180cm (they are soldier afterwards, not common folks) so maximum height would be 198cm and minimum would be 162. The max difference of height would then be 36cm which is not unusual, but most of the soldiers would again keep the "default height" being the average,and rest would deviate, having the least amount with max and min height.
Maybe more like 5% is better for balance, and could be used in multiplayer as well.
That is an interesting concept for companions also,if some companion is really high and strong,you would take him as your bodyguard, but another who is shorter and more quick and agile, you would take into stealth missions rescuing imrisioned lords or companions.
Maybe more like 5% is better for balance, and could be used in multiplayer as well.
That is an interesting concept for companions also,if some companion is really high and strong,you would take him as your bodyguard, but another who is shorter and more quick and agile, you would take into stealth missions rescuing imrisioned lords or companions.
When i first started to think about it, I immagined it something like this.
Default height to be optimal for usage of everything available to soldiers, but if you were 2m high,your horseriding and archery skills (fat fingers ?) for example, should take a serious hit, also your agility in general suffers greatly thus you are very slow and big of a target,but your strength, health and throwing power is great.
Also if you were extremely short, usage of some 2h weapons and heavy throwing skills should take a hit, but your riding is the best (like jockeys), you are more quick, agile and less of a target.
Somewhere along that path, the height feature is IMO very reasonable to have in game,even in multiplayer, but i would like to hear opinion from someone within Taleworlds development team about this.
Default height to be optimal for usage of everything available to soldiers, but if you were 2m high,your horseriding and archery skills (fat fingers ?) for example, should take a serious hit, also your agility in general suffers greatly thus you are very slow and big of a target,but your strength, health and throwing power is great.
Also if you were extremely short, usage of some 2h weapons and heavy throwing skills should take a hit, but your riding is the best (like jockeys), you are more quick, agile and less of a target.
Somewhere along that path, the height feature is IMO very reasonable to have in game,even in multiplayer, but i would like to hear opinion from someone within Taleworlds development team about this.
1.8m wouldn't be overly tall for the average man by medieval standards (average was about 1.75m), so I don't see why you made the distinction. Also, soldiers are commoners, even the professional soldiers. Standing armies are also expensive, so when they're not campaigning they probably have other jobs.piconi89 said:
While this is typically true in reality, it doesn't have to be the case for Bannerlord. If the height range is relatively small, like +-10cm from the average (so the shortest person is 20cm shorter than the tallest person) then there would be enough variation to make a row of soldiers standing side by side look varied, but not enough difference to make variable arm & weapon length a necessity.BayBear said:
I wouldn't want to see height have any affect on stats, damage, reach, or anything of the kind. It should be purely aesthetic.
Maybe you are right, it is too much too ask for different stats,perks and maluses, which would add maybe another several months of development, if not even more.
Only enlarged or shrinked hitbox is enough, but i would be gratefull with pure height aesthetics only, too.
That would mean a world for diversity on the battlefield.
Only enlarged or shrinked hitbox is enough, but i would be gratefull with pure height aesthetics only, too.
That would mean a world for diversity on the battlefield.
Having it purely aesthetic (aside from the necessary change to hitbox size) means it has no effect on balance, which is a crucial MP concern. If players can't be below average height in MP, then they can only be average height and above which makes them a bigger, easier-to-hit target. With the possible exception of shifting the torso hitbox high enough to prevent reliable melee headshots, this is just a hindrance.
Just one problem comes to my mind, if height of NPC soldiers would be randomised, how would it be configured in, for example upgrading? If i have 2 recruits, one is short,one is tall, and i upgrade one to lvl 2 soldier, would that upgraded soldier, if he was the tall one,remain tall or would his height be random every time he spawns on the battlefield?
Simmilar mechanic as the horse markings issue in the earlier blog i believe.
Simmilar mechanic as the horse markings issue in the earlier blog i believe.
In my opinion height would be a role-playing feature for singleplayer. For multiplayer, I feel like they could remove the height feature so that it's fair.
There is height difference in V:C. I've no idea wheter it increases reach. It looks alright, though. Although I would never really notice it, since most of enemy's view is covered by shield wall
It is one of these things that would be nice in the game, but I would not loose hair over it.
It is one of these things that would be nice in the game, but I would not loose hair over it.
You re right, that would not be a dissaster, but you know what would to me? Same old stick up soldiers who jump so stiff while holding shield as someone lifted them up, not as they are using their legs.dr4gunov said:There is height difference in V:C. I've no idea wheter it increases reach. It looks alright, though. Although I would never really notice it, since most of enemy's view is covered by shield wall
It is one of these things that would be nice in the game, but I would not loose hair over it.
Also a jumping melee attack with its own animation and physics impact on damage would be great, in warband a jumping attack animated the same move as if you were steady on your feet, which always seemed off to me . . .
I immagined a jump and stab attack inspired by the opening scene of the movie "Troy" where Achiles killes that giant soldier with that move. Since we already have an over head spear stab, something of a sort could be done with a sword in mid-jump.
sealedknight
Recruit
Callum what percentage of the game is complete? I guess it would give a general idea of far from release it is. Also pls release sooner than later.
Time waits for no one
Time waits for no one
Aesthetic 10-15cm difference is all we need, and only in SP. It is only somewhat necessary for npcs, not players. Any difference in players can prove to make it slightly more difficult or easier to fight, even if it is just visually, it would be akin to playing with a high ping (latency), where you have to calculate the attack on the future position of the enemy, not his actual position (I know about this, I'm an expert in fact, since I live in brazil playing on euro and n. american servers my whole life). Height difference could make it so you feel you have to aim lower or higher to hit, even if the hitbox was the same. The cons substantially outweigh the pros of height difference in MP. But in single player, it would be some unnoticed "added difficulty", or just more variation that you would not notice, but feel , further adding to the immersion aspects of small details. So, yeah, totally agree with you.Orion said:
While i completely understand it, and would like something of the sort, it feels awkward for M&B, it feels out of place... But I would really love something like this in mods, and giants are a thing we can now do, because they allow for different skeletons in the game, so probably someone will mod a "giant" here and there, and maybe some different attacks...piconi89 said:
It is so good to hear that from you! Really happy, and have to say, that is an inspirational quote for life right there!Yaga said:
BayBear said:
Sorry to say that, but you're wrong. IK is very adaptable and can even help matching different models in the same position.
Let's imagine the stock animation for mounting horses is tailored for average height (1.70m). The shortest model (1.60m) would clip the horse, while the tallest (1.80m) would have gaps between the legs and the saddle. IK would help correcting these issues, just by adding IK to some parts of the armature, such as feet and knees, anchoring them in the right position regardless of model size.
Most games I've played with adjustable character height have had horrible clipping at some point, even with inverse kinematics.... guess developers don't apply it to everything, maybe it's a resource hog?
That said, I'm expectng bannerlord to have horrible clipping anyway so what does it matter?
That said, I'm expectng bannerlord to have horrible clipping anyway so what does it matter?
Hello !
Sorry to bother you once again +Innocent Flower but first I wanted to thank you for giving me the opportunity to discuss a bit of history. It is quite enjoyable.
On the first point of your response, you convinced me : a common footman wouldn't spend too much money on such an attire. He may belong to the second class (the one that could afford its own equipement, like in the roman Republican time period). However, leather offers some advantages mails do not : this "skirt" should protect the legs, therefore leather is obviously more confortable in order to run. But that is nitpicking. I think the real reason why this soldier has this kind of protection is because of the roman design of officers' uniform like this one
.
I guess there isn't anything left to discuss on this subject.
About colours however, I ask you one more time : what are your sources ? If they are coherent I might reconsider my position and my own sources, but until now, I was the only one to say where my informations came from :
you can both go to war and be fashionable at the same time. So if the artists from Taleworld want to imagine beautiful uniforms, why not ?
If you had sources, I will be happy to read them.
Sorry to bother you once again +Innocent Flower but first I wanted to thank you for giving me the opportunity to discuss a bit of history. It is quite enjoyable.
On the first point of your response, you convinced me : a common footman wouldn't spend too much money on such an attire. He may belong to the second class (the one that could afford its own equipement, like in the roman Republican time period). However, leather offers some advantages mails do not : this "skirt" should protect the legs, therefore leather is obviously more confortable in order to run. But that is nitpicking. I think the real reason why this soldier has this kind of protection is because of the roman design of officers' uniform like this one
I guess there isn't anything left to discuss on this subject.
About colours however, I ask you one more time : what are your sources ? If they are coherent I might reconsider my position and my own sources, but until now, I was the only one to say where my informations came from :
Indeed some fabrics were better suited for being coloured than others. That's not the point.
About the possibility to wear certain colours or clothes, I have to explain myself more in details :
Some colours or fabrics weren't only forbidden only because they were expensive. They were forbidden because of the law or customs. It was to prevent all other classses to compete with the nobility. These laws were edicted in France, with Philipp the Fourth (in 1294), or Edward the Third : they listed a strict list of colours and fabrics that were available according to your social statut, sex and profession. Of course, the higher your social statut, the more expensive the colours and fabrics are. As I already said, some shades of red were then forbidden to commoners. Another indication is this edict from Queen Elizabeth the first of 1574 the (Sumptous law). If a law was edicted it clearly means some tried to. But now, out of honnesty, I also have to immediatly temper my point : it was hard to control the rightfull application of these prescriptions because it changed often and was widly different in some countries. But then if you're caught you had to pay and only the most well-off could do that. Now I may recall you my point on Landknecht and be more precise : once again, not all bright colours were forbidden or economically available. But you may have the privilege to wear some, exactly like the Landknechte with beautifull armors and garments and I jump back on my first point :
About the possibility to wear certain colours or clothes, I have to explain myself more in details :
Some colours or fabrics weren't only forbidden only because they were expensive. They were forbidden because of the law or customs. It was to prevent all other classses to compete with the nobility. These laws were edicted in France, with Philipp the Fourth (in 1294), or Edward the Third : they listed a strict list of colours and fabrics that were available according to your social statut, sex and profession. Of course, the higher your social statut, the more expensive the colours and fabrics are. As I already said, some shades of red were then forbidden to commoners. Another indication is this edict from Queen Elizabeth the first of 1574 the (Sumptous law). If a law was edicted it clearly means some tried to. But now, out of honnesty, I also have to immediatly temper my point : it was hard to control the rightfull application of these prescriptions because it changed often and was widly different in some countries. But then if you're caught you had to pay and only the most well-off could do that. Now I may recall you my point on Landknecht and be more precise : once again, not all bright colours were forbidden or economically available. But you may have the privilege to wear some, exactly like the Landknechte with beautifull armors and garments and I jump back on my first point :
As a side note, I don't know were you find this information on the blue colour... For it is (according to what I read) utterly false. You have to distinguish two perdiods : Michel Pastoureau in his book The Blue clearly said that until the twelve century, blue was very hard to obtain. This information can be confirmed with the paintings of this time period were blue is very rare. But because of the high demand, dyers have made some progress with admirable shades but even at the begin of Renaissance, blue was still expensive, even with woad. So if the game is situated around the tenth century, blue should be really rare, but I won't complain about it, because it would be a bit... monotonous
If you had sources, I will be happy to read them.
