If you still don't understand or choose to remain willfully ignorant suit yourself. You are on my ignore anyways. I don't want to see some blind fanboy's drivel who can't even digest information he is spoonfeed.
sure whatever you say mr black knight xD ive been so ignorantly following this project in to detail that i couldn't see a thing because of fanboiiiing,,, mb hahaha these guys .....You just made my night sir
TW is the most inefficient game developer in existence, I am glad they actually reached the point where BL is now and hope for mod tools soon. There is no saving the base game, because it's a rotten structure(game design) built on a solid foundation(engine).
So i could come up with a dozen developers within the last 10 years that were far worse. So calling them that is nowhere near correct. At the same time you say it has a solid engine, that Taleworlds made themselves. Then you say the games design i rotten, by that you must mean Warband was a rotten design aswell, cause its pretty much the same game, except Bannerlord is alot better in many ways.
Yeah, it is kinda surprising. I was expecting normal development, where they have the DD all laid out and ignore anything else, with EA being a stress test for game systems, adding polish and final balancing.
They are polishing a skeleton. But this is a thread intended to discuss improving the game, instead there are a handful of people intentionally derailing it by complaining about how bad game is instead of offering solutions.
They are polishing a skeleton. But this is a thread intended to discuss improving the game, instead there are a handful of people intentionally derailing it by complaining about how bad game is instead of offering solutions.
So i could come up with a dozen developers within the last 10 years that were far worse. So calling them that is nowhere near correct. At the same time you say it has a solid engine, that Taleworlds made themselves. Then you say the games design i rotten, by that you must mean Warband was a rotten design aswell, cause its pretty much the same game, except Bannerlord is alot better in many ways.
Do you even know what inefficient means or do you just register it as random insult toward TW? Name 12 developers who are more inefficient than TW, I'll wait. Yes, I call the engine solid. What about it? How is that contradictory to anything I stated? Bannerlord is not Warband, both games are quite different. If I have to point out all the differences to you I wouldn't even know where to start, nor would I care to write such a lengthy post. It's not the same game and Bannerlord is worse in many ways, too.
I think that internal conflict would better curb snowballing than alliances. Based on what mexxico has said, and issues pointed out by some of the community members, making and breaking alliances might pose too many issues considering how interconnected the systems are.
However, if there was a mechanic where the larger a nation gets the less stable it becomes would serve to break up a nation that grows too big too fast, essentially stymying rapid growth by any nation.
I think that internal conflict would better curb snowballing than alliances. Based on what mexxico has said, and issues pointed out by some of the community members, making and breaking alliances might pose too many issues considering how interconnected the systems are.
However, if there was a mechanic where the larger a nation gets the less stable it becomes would serve to break up a nation that grows too big too fast, essentially stymying rapid growth by any nation.
Im pretty sure they did mention rebellions at one time, the quest where you walk around talking with lords about The Folly, also heavily hints at Claimants/Rebellion leaders, as the other guy that you talk to in a faction, other than the leader, talks about his negative relationship with the current leader.
Im pretty sure they did mention rebellions at one time, the quest where you walk around talking with lords about The Folly, also heavily hints at Claimants/Rebellion leaders, as the other guy that you talk to in a faction, other than the leader, talks about his negative relationship with the current leader.
Im pretty sure they did mention rebellions at one time, the quest where you walk around talking with lords about The Folly, also heavily hints at Claimants/Rebellion leaders, as the other guy that you talk to in a faction, other than the leader, talks about his negative relationship with the current leader.
My memory tells me the same, though I don't recall devs mentioning how it would function. I think (considering the issue with snowballing horselords) it should function to prevent factions from taking over half of Calradia by year 6 of a campaign... That is if rebellions will still be a thing.
My memory tells me the same, though I don't recall devs mentioning how it would function. I think (considering the issue with snowballing horselords) it should function to prevent factions from taking over half of Calradia by year 6 of a campaign... That is if rebellions will still be a thing.
How mexxico mentioned it it will be tied to the loyalty mechanic which will probably get some sort of overhaul if you want more info go to the thread diplomacy developments
How mexxico mentioned it it will be tied to the loyalty mechanic which will probably get some sort of overhaul if you want more info go to the thread diplomacy developments
Yes it is late for deciding adding that big features. Sometimes I think how we can add alliances feature and I realize different problems. Thats why I cannot join discussions for now. I need to think all problems all together. For example : what will be side effects or costs of announcing a new alliance, what will happen if one alliance is ended - suddenly war peace calculation scores will change and this will trigger new wars to start, so there will be more war peace declerations (which is not good for stability of game / bad for gameplay). How will be diplomacy screen ui for allied factions? What will happen when alliance is declared if there are existing wars or tribute payments including factions which declared alliance. There are tons of different problems and we need to find answers to them before start coding. Also if we can not solve these problems in a good way we cannot add this feature thats why I cannot give 100% guarentee for adding alliances feature for now.
I wish we had all game design 8 years ago (when we start this project) and we follow that design document. Probably we could finish game sooner if that kind of development is followed. If this was the case all these problems would be already solved. We are trying to add features one by one and this is not best way to create a detailed game like Bannerlord because all different features are connected each other and we should think all together not one by one. Adding features one by one is dangerous (can broke existing mechanics). However Warband is also developed that way too and be a great game. But even Warband example I think this is hard way to develop a game.
Actually I am not diplomacy guy also, my responsible areas are generally campaign ai, army and party ai, economy / trade, recruit systems, food / money management of parties / clans. I did not worked at diplomacy features for Warband also. It was obvious diplomacy side of Bannerlord was very weak and players want developments at diplomacy so I wanted to help development at August started examining these parts. However I am not real owner of these parts. Critisisms are right but they are not helping our current situation.
Understandable. It is much appreciated you threw your experience into the mix, W/P is very comfortable in 1.5.2.
Honestly this mod did it very well. Just going through the change log takes you along the journey and the issues they ran into and changes made, I'm going to summarize what I've basically taken away from them and provide the key change notes for each update of it.
I'll be editing this post as I go through the versions, join me on this journey everyone. Ok its finished, I've underlined the major points from the key takeaways.
It was first just a mod to activate the Declare War / Propose peace button in the Diplo screen back when it wasn't active and the AI completely controlled W/P. Then they added:
configuration on how much it would cost to make war and peace.
added configurable cooldowns for declaring war and making peace,
a messenger button that lets you pay influence to open a dialog with another kingdom (I want this)
a config on how long the messenger would take
let player kingdoms control their own W/P decs. No more AI auto W/P decs (this isn't an issue anymore)
It also made it to where you could choose to accept peace or not from other kingdoms. (I want this)
Version 1.0.0
Allows the player to use the Declare War / Propose Peace buttons in the Diplomacy Screen.
Added MBOptionsScreen support.
Added configurable costs with both scaling and flat influence cost flavors. These are configurable in the Mod Options screen.
Added checks to prevent the player from declaring war or proposing peace when they do not have enough influence.
Added checks to prevent the player from making peace when there is an active story quest that requires war between the factions.
1.0.1 they added in configurable cooldowns for declaring war and making peace
Version 1.0.1
Added configurable cooldowns for declaring war and making peace.
Updated the description of EnableInfluenceCostsForDiplomacyActions setting.
Added debug messaging in case the diplomacy action throws an exception.
1.0.2 and 1.0.3 they made some fixes and display improvements
Version 1.0.2
Fixing initialization issue with the cooldown manager.
Updated messages to display the required duration for war/peace cooldowns.
Version 1.0.3
Added influence cost indicator below the diplomacy action button.
1.0.4 they added in a messenger button that lets you pay influence to open a dialog with another kingdom. I like this, honestly should be able to do it for anyone, companion or lord.
Version 1.0.4
Updated display for influence cost.
Added "Send Messenger" button. This allows you to open a dialogue with a kingdom leader. This has a configurable influence cost.
1.0.5 it was a compatability/crashes fix
Version 1.0.5
Removed a Harmony patch for MakePeaceAction in favor of a CampaignBehavior event listener. Should improve compatibility with other mods.
Added MBOptionsScreen as a SubModule for the mod. This should prevent some crashes and issues with the mod menu.
1.0.6 it added a config on how long the messenger would take and let player kingdoms control their own P/W decs. It also made it to where you could choose to accept peace from other kingdoms.
Version 1.0.6
Added configurable delay on messengers arriving at opposing faction leader.
Stop random declaration of war and peace from your kingdom. When another kingdom wants to make peace, you'll get a pop-up box with a decision and some money for war reparations!
Reorganized the mod options page.
1.0.7 - 1.0.10 it was just fixes and compatability changes
Version 1.0.10
Experimental branch moved to stable.
Fixed a broken string on the Mod Options page.
Version 1.0.9
String localization fixes (thanks reduce5419!).
Updated to MCM 2.0.10. This should resolve some crashes but a duplicate "Mod Options" menu may appear.
Version 1.0.8
Added preliminary localization support.
Updated MBOptionScreen to MCM 2.0.8
Fixed bug that allowed sending messengers without enough influence.
Attempt to fix bug that could prevent saving while messengers are en route.
Version 1.0.7
Bannerlord e1.3.0 compatibility
Minor bug fixes
For their 1.1 updates they:
added in a war exhaustion mechanic with configurations
forced the AI to follow the cooldowns for war and peace.
They added in sending messengers to any character via the encyclopedia page (I want this)
the ability for the player to claim settlement without vote.
they added a war exhaustion display to the diplo page (good idea if you use this)
added the ability to send messengers to NPC's without parties. (I want this)
added in applying all costs, conditions, and cooldowns for declaring war or proposing peace to the AI kingdoms.
added in Peace proposals due to war exhaustion now include war reparations and influence costs. (Pre-tribute system)
1.1.0 they added in a war exhaustion mechanic with configurations and forced the AI to follow the cooldowns for war and peace
Version 1.1.0
Added "war exhaustion" mechanic to the mod. Consider either removing "Configurable War Attrition" or disabling war exhaustion in the mod settings as they are similar mechanics.
Now creates save data. Messengers, declare war cooldowns, war exhaustion, and more will now be saved!
AI factions now use the same "declare war" cooldowns as the player. No longer make peace with a faction just to have them declare war immediately!
Added a cooldown for rejected peace proposals.
Various string/localization fixes.
1.1.1 - 1.1.2 they made some fixes and additional war configs
Version 1.1.1
Added two mod versions - one for e1.2.1 and one for e1.3.
Attempt to fix bug where declare war cooldowns could be circumvented by AI factions.
Version 1.1.2
Opposing kingdoms now respect both declare war and minimum war duration (propose peace) cooldowns.
Added more war exhaustion configurations.
1.1.3 they added in sending messengers to any character via the encyclopedia page and the ability for the player to claim settlement without vote.
Version 1.1.3
Added the ability to send messengers to any character via the Encyclopedia Page.
Added the ability for a player to claim player-taken settlements without a vote.
Updated messenger strings. Will need localization updates.
Fixed some missing localization data.
Updated method of enabling/disabling war exhaustion. Now requires a game restart.
1.1.4 -1.1.5 it was just crash fixes
Version 1.1.4
Resolved crashes with messengers in lord persuasions and mercenary faction conversations.
Changed the position of the Send Messenger button in the encyclopedia.
Version 1.1.5
Mitigated some crashes related to messengers to invalid targets and messengers arriving while the player is in a settlement or siege.
Mitigated war exhaustion crashes with modded kingdoms that don't have a stringId.
Fixed location links in encyclopedia pages.
1.1.6 they added a war exhaustion display to the diplo page.
Version 1.1.6
Added war exhaustion display to the diplomacy page.
Fixed crash where there was no last attacking party when a settlement changed hands.
Fixed rare crash where a companion had a grievance and a messenger arrived simultaneously.
1.1.7 added the ability to send messengers to NPC's without parties.
Version 1.1.7
Added null-safety for kingdom stringIds to all war exhaustion operations. Should prevent some crashes for people with mods that create or modify kingdoms.
Allowed the player to send messengers to NPC's without parties. NPC's without parties will wear civilian clothes.
1.1.8 added in applying all costs, conditions, and cooldowns for declaring war or proposing peace to the AI kingdoms
Version 1.1.8
Moved from using stringId to MBGUID internal Id for keeping track of war exhaustion values. This should resolve crashes related to other mods' created kingdoms.
All costs, conditions, and cooldowns for declaring war or proposing peace now apply to AI kingdoms.
Added war reparations costs to making peace for the player. These costs will appear on the Diplomacy screen.
Added Bannerlord Beta e1.4 support and discontinued Bannerlord e1.21 updates.
1.1.9 added in Peace proposals due to war exhaustion now include war reparations and influence costs.
Version 1.1.9
Peace proposals due to war exhaustion now include war reparations and influence costs.
Fixed declare war cooldown issues.
Fixed issue in war exhaustion migration where records of nonexistent kingdoms would cause a crash.
Lowered default influence cost for messengers to 10.
For their 1.2 updates they just made bug fixes and made sure features like messengers to wanderers worked.
Version 1.2.0
Resolved issue where sieges weren't contributing to war exhaustion.
Version 1.2.1
Added toggleable debug messages for war exhaustion applied to the player kingdom.
Updated sync activities to only execute when loading a save.
Added various null-safety measures to prevent crashes.
Version 1.2.2
Allow messengers to wanderers again.
Fixing issue where peace inquiries would crash when war exhaustion is disabled.
Fixing crash in conversation with lords under certain conditions when the banner investigation quest is active.
Version 1.2.3
Fixed missing string localization id.
For 1.3 updates they:
added in Granting fiefs interface into the encyclopedia and the Kingdom management clan page (I want this)
Added maximum war exhaustion threshold for declaring war.
Added war exhaustion display on kingdom diplomacy page for kingdoms at peace.
Prevented messengers from causing crashes when a player is in an army or siege.
Version 1.3.0
Added a Grant Fief user interface accessible via the Encyclopedia and Kingdom Management Clan page.
Added support for Bannerlord e1.4.1
Version 1.3.1
Fixed broken expel and support events on the kingdom clan page.
Added maximum war exhaustion threshold for declaring war.
Added war exhaustion display on kingdom diplomacy page for kingdoms at peace.
Fixed bug where messenger events would duplicate.
Version 1.3.2
Player-captured settlements should work properly again.
Clans can no longer call for votes on wars or peaces that are invalid.
Version 1.3.3
Prevented messengers from causing crashes when a player is in an army or siege.
Fixed bug where influence wasn't deducted from vassal players who proposed peace.
Update 1.4 is where they finally added alliances, safe to say I want all of these:
Added alliances to the game. These can be initiated by AI factions and by the player through the Kingdom Diplomacy screen.
Hints added to the buttons on the Kingdom Diplomacy Page rather than showing messages on screen.
Added allies section to the faction encyclopedia page.
Added war and alliance displays to the Kingdom Diplomacy page.
Made alliances optional via mod setting. This will gradually remove AI alliances from your game as well.
New condition for making peace where a player siege cannot be active between the factions. Resolves a bad state.
Add relation gain to clan granted fiefs and relation penalty with other clans.
Improved the claim fief behavior so that it appears right away.
Version 1.4.0
Added alliances to the game. These can be initiated by AI factions and by the player through the Kingdom Diplomacy screen.
Hints added to the buttons on the Kingdom Diplomacy Page rather than showing messages on screen.
Version 1.4.1
Upgrade to Mod Configuration Menu v3.
Resolve crash that occurred when a kingdom had no fiefs.
Version 1.4.2
Added allies section to the faction encyclopedia page.
Added war and alliance displays to the Kingdom Diplomacy page.
Made alliances optional via mod setting. This will gradually remove AI alliances from your game as well.
Fix bug where minimum alliance duration returned to default.
New condition for making peace where a player siege cannot be active between the factions. Resolves a bad state.
Version 1.4.3
Add relation gain to clan granted fiefs and relation penalty with other clans.
Improved the claim fief behavior so that it appears right away.
Fixed crash when a player leaves a kingdom from the Diplomacy screen and keeps their fiefs.
Version 1.4.4
Fixing broken Break Alliance and Propose buttons on the Kingdom Diplomacy page.
Removing check from AI faction leaders because influence costs are no longer assessed against them. This may make war declarations more common.
Version 1.4.5
Upgraded to MCM v3.1.9. Should resolve compatibility issues with Modlib and various Mod Options bugs.
Update 1.5 adds:
Added Non-Aggression pact agreements.
Messengers can be paid for with gold rather than influence if not in a kingdom
Add button to donate gold to a clan via the Clan menu in the Kingdom Management screen.
Added influence balancing, including influence decay and corruption.
Added the ability to cancel arrived messengers.
Added expansionism score, used in diplomatic agreement scoring. Added expansionism diplomacy penalty
Updated the faction behavior for forming alliances. Rebalanced alliance costs.
Adding the ability to usurp the throne of a kingdom.
Alliance war declarations now follow war conditions more strictly.
Updated alliances to be defensive only.
Prevent the player from granting fiefs that are pending election.
War cooldowns are now represented as non-aggression pacts that form when peace is declared.
Added variable travel time to messengers based on distance.
Changing send messenger functionality from influence to gold cost.
Version 1.5.0
Added Non-Aggression pact agreements. Currently only available to players, but will be rolled out to AI factions soon.
Messengers can be paid for with gold rather than influence if not in a kingdom.
Added tabbed display to the Kingdom Diplomacy screen.
Fixed crashes when sending a messenger to a target doesn't have a location.
Removing leader cost conditions for AI kingdom decision proposals. More kingdom proposals for leaders with low influence (including the player). Should make wars more common in passive games.
Removed redundant declare war cooldown condition. (no behavior change)
Version 1.5.10
Updates for compatibility with e1.4.3.
Fixed e1.4.2 crashes on startup due to update.
Fixed bug where mercenary players could claim fiefs.
Version 1.5.11
Fixed crash in encyclopedia when hero has null clan. (1.4.3)
Fixed broken grant fief button in Kingdom Clan page. (1.4.3)
Fixed clans automatically selling fiefs to the player clan to reduce their corruption.
Clans no longer consider trading fiefs to a clan under mercenary service.
My memory tells me the same, though I don't recall devs mentioning how it would function. I think (considering the issue with snowballing horselords) it should function to prevent factions from taking over half of Calradia by year 6 of a campaign... That is if rebellions will still be a thing.
I just remember it was also part of the Vlandia faction, that they would have more dissatisfied lords from the start, so yes i hope for a system, a bit like the claimant system in Warband, but with possible repeats, where the king will have to reconquer some of his lands in a war, but in return for it, he gets to legally expels/execute clans/lords who took part in it, when he wins. In the loosing senario, it should just be the king who flees the game, with the clan becoming a clan in the new kingdom, thats what im hoping for, we will see. The game does need a system like this.
Understandable. It is much appreciated you threw your experience into the mix, W/P is very comfortable in 1.5.2.
Honestly this mod did it very well. Just going through the change log takes you along the journey and the issues they ran into and changes made, I'm going to summarize what I've basically taken away from them and provide the key change notes for each update of it.
I'll be editing this post as I go through the versions, join me on this journey everyone.
It was first just a mod to activate the Declare War / Propose peace button in the Diplo screen back when it wasn't active and the AI completely controlled W/P. Allow configuration on how much it would cost to make war and peace.
Version 1.0.0
Allows the player to use the Declare War / Propose Peace buttons in the Diplomacy Screen.
Added MBOptionsScreen support.
Added configurable costs with both scaling and flat influence cost flavors. These are configurable in the Mod Options screen.
Added checks to prevent the player from declaring war or proposing peace when they do not have enough influence.
Added checks to prevent the player from making peace when there is an active story quest that requires war between the factions.
For 1.0.1 they added in configurable cooldowns for declaring war and making peace
Version 1.0.1
Added configurable cooldowns for declaring war and making peace.
Updated the description of EnableInfluenceCostsForDiplomacyActions setting.
Added debug messaging in case the diplomacy action throws an exception.
@mexxico Have alliances not been brought up by the team in the past (that you are aware of)? There are blocks of code that deal with alliances that have been in the code since release, so I had assumed they were at least considered previously. Or were they just put in as more of a preemptive "just in case" type situation?
Understandable. It is much appreciated you threw your experience into the mix, W/P is very comfortable in 1.5.2.
Honestly this mod did it very well. Just going through the change log takes you along the journey and the issues they ran into and changes made, I'm going to summarize what I've basically taken away from them and provide the key change notes for each update of it.
I'll be editing this post as I go through the versions, join me on this journey everyone.
It was first just a mod to activate the Declare War / Propose peace button in the Diplo screen back when it wasn't active and the AI completely controlled W/P. Allow configuration on how much it would cost to make war and peace.
Version 1.0.0
Allows the player to use the Declare War / Propose Peace buttons in the Diplomacy Screen.
Added MBOptionsScreen support.
Added configurable costs with both scaling and flat influence cost flavors. These are configurable in the Mod Options screen.
Added checks to prevent the player from declaring war or proposing peace when they do not have enough influence.
Added checks to prevent the player from making peace when there is an active story quest that requires war between the factions.
For 1.0.1 they added in configurable cooldowns for declaring war and making peace
Version 1.0.1
Added configurable cooldowns for declaring war and making peace.
Updated the description of EnableInfluenceCostsForDiplomacyActions setting.
Added debug messaging in case the diplomacy action throws an exception.
For 1.0.2 and 1.0.3 they made some fixes and display improvements
Version 1.0.2
Fixing initialization issue with the cooldown manager.
Updated messages to display the required duration for war/peace cooldowns.
Version 1.0.3
Added influence cost indicator below the diplomacy action button.
For 1.0.4 they added in a messenger button that let you pay influence to open a dialog with another kingdom. I like this.
Version 1.0.4
Updated display for influence cost.
Added "Send Messenger" button. This allows you to open a dialogue with a kingdom leader. This has a configurable influence cost.
I loved the maproad on Trello.. Keeps thing much clear to follow. I always work there too, but about the mod:
It's great and I think taking some ideas from the Warband mod would be great as well, specially if the devs did this too.
Non agression pacts
Trade agreements
Send Messengers
I think what could be add, it's more treaties between kingdoms and kings. You know like ceding castle or town as peace treaty, hostages, marriages, trading (which you increace the influx of caravans between kingdoms.
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