Who has the best archers?

[ttsec]

Umm... the Rhodok sharpshooters have bows? Why was I not aware of this?

Yes, it's called a crossbow.

 

[Ruthven]

Umm... the Rhodok sharpshooters have bows? Why was I not aware of this?

Yes, it's called a crossbow.

It's not a "bow" it's a crossbow. Archers use bows. NOT crossbows. so, Vaegir archers are the best, seeing as crossbowmen, as revealed in a shocking study, are actually crossbowmen, and not archers.
and no, I didn't mean for it to come out that harshly. but it did.

 

[allthesedamnnamesaretaken]

I've made a comparison table:

http://img90.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mbrangedstatsic5.jpg

Based on the stats, we can draw these conclusions:

-Swadian Sharpshooters have the best armor
-Vaegir Marksmen have the best helmets
-Khergit Veteran Archers are now the best ranged damage dealers since they are much more accurate now and can get Bodkin and Khergit arrrows. HOWEVER, they might get Javelins instead of bows so that makes them unreliable. Also, their spears are a weakness in melee combat despite being well-armored.
-Nord Archers just suck. Period.
-Rhodok Sharpshooters are the best in melee and now most versatile and best overall ranged troop type.

The only thing that I think is debatable is whether Vaegirs or Khergits have the best bow-using troops.

 

[Wraithcat]

I like Vaegir Archers on the normal battlefield, where being able to get alot of arrows off quickly makes a huge difference to a charging opponent.

However, for seiges, I prefer crossbowmen, as I find that a whole bunch of archers inevitably target the same defender, thereby wasting their ammo. On the other hand, crossbowmen, due to their longer firing times don't tend to do this and therefore tend to do more damage to the enemy defenders, while not shooting off thier ammunition as quickly.

 

[Maan]

@allthesedamnnamesaretaken:
Excellent one, thank you!

Have to say, I witnessed Khergits taking a Vaegir castle... and damn, those Horse Archers' missile fire swept Vaegir troops from the battlements, even with the advantage of cover Vaegirs couldn't stand their rate of fire.

It's not noticeable when Khergits missile troops are mounted, because their rate of fire is lower then... but when dismounted, they remember me of good-ole Vaegir Marksmen

Also, those Lancers are quite effective in the close quarters of a siege... must be their fast one handers...

 

[Zilberfrid]

Umm... the Rhodok sharpshooters have bows? Why was I not aware of this?

Yes, it's called a crossbow.

It's not a "bow" it's a crossbow. Archers use bows. NOT crossbows. so, Vaegir archers are the best, seeing as crossbowmen, as revealed in a shocking study, are actually crossbowmen, and not archers.
and no, I didn't mean for it to come out that harshly. but it did.

But then, archers, historically, could mean either bowmen or crossbowmen (though I can't be arsed to get you the quote now, what with working and all). Archers as a troop type on the field use either bowmen or crossbowmen or even throwers, archers are defined as having the ranged_guaranteed use either bowmen, crossbowmen or throwers.

 

[InstantBlade]

@allthesedamnnamesaretaken:
Excellent one, thank you!

Have to say, I witnessed Khergits taking a Vaegir castle... and damn, those Horse Archers' missile fire swept Vaegir troops from the battlements, even with the advantage of cover Vaegirs couldn't stand their rate of fire.

It's not noticeable when Khergits missile troops are mounted, because their rate of fire is lower then... but when dismounted, they remember me of good-ole Vaegir Marksmen

Also, those Lancers are quite effective in the close quarters of a siege... must be their fast one handers...

Really? Anyone else seen this? I've allways had problems sieging with the khergs. It was always a pain in the butt. Specially in close quarters.

 

[GraaEminense]

Really? Anyone else seen this? I've allways had problems sieging with the khergs. It was always a pain in the butt. Specially in close quarters.

Haven't played Khergits for a while, but they keep on attacking me these days. And man, if there's anyone I want to siege me, it's the horseboys.
My companions and vaegir skirmisher/archer/marksman army eat them alive on the top of the ladder. And, when attacking, I take less casualties against Khergits than anything else.

Admittedly, the AI doesn't use archers when attacking, but then neither do I when defending (all to the wall!), and I tend to have a better ratio of high-tier troops, but even so the differences in casualties are bizarre. I haven't looked too closely on their stats/equipment, but I think the lack of two-handed weapons (with good reach and punch) and over-use of spears (which the AI sucks at) and low armour on medium-tier troops is the main reason -they can't grind it out on the top of the ladder compared to anyone else.

On a side note, I've had to reconsider my opinion: dismounted top-tier Khergits may be better archers than Vaegirs. Equal rate of fire, and better equipment. Not sure about low/mid-tier troops though, there I still thing Vaegirs have the edge.

 

[18Zulukiller]

King Ragnar made the unwise decision of denying me the third castle that I single-handedly ransacked. The first few times I figured there was only so many Lords he could give castles away to before me, but it seemed like I wasn't going to get one for quite awhile. So I accepted the castle and now I'm in need of some units other than the dozens of Huscarls I have. Which faction has the best archers?

Mate here's a suggestion for you, if you've cranked up the size of battles (around a couple of hundred). All you need to defend any castle is around 20 to 30 top tier cavalry/infantry (your preference what type/faction) and hundreds of basic rhodeck crossbow men. All you do is command your infantry/cavalry to block the top of the ladder/siege ramp and leave the crossbowmen scattered around the walls were they originally spawn. The top tier troops will stop anything getting on the walls and the basic crossbow men will shot them down.

Honestly basic rhodeck crossbow men might be ****, but because there so cheap you can have loads. Think it this way (i don't know the numbers in the new version yet so this is a guess/hypothetical)  if say a Rhodek sharpshoter does 40 damage per shot but a basic rhodek crossbow men does 10 damage per shot you only need 4 basic rhodek crossbow men to equal 1 rhodek sharpshoter. And because of the price difference you can actually recruit more, and because there's more of them your actually increasing your rate of fire as well.       

 

[ttsec]

It's not a "bow" it's a crossbow. Archers use bows. NOT crossbows.

A crossbow is a bow, that's why there's the word bow in it. Just like a machinegun is a gun. However, a bow is not neccessarily a crossbow and a gun is not neccesarily a machinegun.  If you define an archer as someone who uses a bow, then that includes crossbow, because crossbow is a bow.  However, that doesn't mean an archer neccessarily uses a crossbow. Hence, rhodok sharpshooters are archers.

Don't turn this into a semantics arguement.  The word crossbow speaks for itself. It is a bow.

A machinegun is a gun, but a gun is not neccesarily a machinegun.
A gunman is a man, but a man is not neccesarily a gunman.
A fruitcake is a cake, but a cake is not neccesarily a fruitcake.
A crossbow is a bow, but a bow is not neccesarily a crossbow.

Think of "bow" as a set, and "crossbow" as a smallers set. The set "crossbow" is in the set "bow", but the set "bow" is not in set "crossbow". All objects in set "crossbow" are in set "bow" as well, but not the other way around.

If you don't understand and insist crossbows are not bows, then you are beyond my help.

 

[Maan]

Really? Anyone else seen this? I've allways had problems sieging with the khergs. It was always a pain in the butt. Specially in close quarters.

Have to say, I'm not playing a lot these days (work, you know )... that was one of the few sieges I've seen.

The Khergs had quite a few things in their favour... mostly top-tier troops (their veteran horse archers have high archery skill, other troops are not that good), they outnumbered the defenders (5:1, I think) and they held ground shooting, rather than rushing up the siege tower.

Still, I took a close look with my character at the brawl on the battlements, and those scimitar wielding Khergs were giving a good thrashing to Vaegirs with two-handers...

Meh, maybe it was just the Khergits lucky day...

 

[Taateli]

Archers? If you're Nord, go for Nords.

But, if you want mixed troops, here comes my opinion:

For siege defence: Rhodoks. Rhodok sharpshooters does hilarious kills in only one blows, and are quite spicy on melee also

For Skirmish: Well, Khergits may do, but they lack a ****ing lot on sieges.

For siege attacks and skirmish: Vaegir. Vaegir Marksmen at least used to have evil axes, and they mean fast rain of arrows.


But I still would go for Nords

 

[killer-blead]

Vaegirs have two-handed weapons. There's a reason you arm your heroes with two-handed weapons instead of one-handed, because they deal more damage and kill more stuff.

Marksmen would slaughter Rhodok Sharpshooters.

hey nardill i got a qeustion i've been wondering for some time, it says you've been watched. what does that mean?

 

[Ruthven]

It's not a "bow" it's a crossbow. Archers use bows. NOT crossbows.

A crossbow is a bow, that's why there's the word bow in it. Just like a machinegun is a gun. However, a bow is not neccessarily a crossbow and a gun is not neccesarily a machinegun.  If you define an archer as someone who uses a bow, then that includes crossbow, because crossbow is a bow.  However, that doesn't mean an archer neccessarily uses a crossbow. Hence, rhodok sharpshooters are archers.

Don't turn this into a semantics arguement.  The word crossbow speaks for itself. It is a bow.

A machinegun is a gun, but a gun is not neccesarily a machinegun.
A gunman is a man, but a man is not neccesarily a gunman.
A fruitcake is a cake, but a cake is not neccesarily a fruitcake.
A crossbow is a bow, but a bow is not neccesarily a crossbow.

Think of "bow" as a set, and "crossbow" as a smallers set. The set "crossbow" is in the set "bow", but the set "bow" is not in set "crossbow". All objects in set "crossbow" are in set "bow" as well, but not the other way around.

If you don't understand and insist crossbows are not bows, then you are beyond my help.

Any respect I may have had for you has now been lost. A crossbow, is not a type of bow, in my eyes. A bow, requires skill and training to use. A crossbow, to me, is a piece of technology, where it is the weapon, not the man, that makes the kill. Call me Spartan, I don't care, but the use of a crossbow does not make one an "archer". archer, archery, means the use of the bow and arrow. not the crossbow and bolt. So the vaegir marksmen are the best archers in calradia.

 

[killer-blead]

a crossbow is more like a secondairy weapon to me, i use sword+ shield and crossbow(+bolts) to fill the rest.
a bow is more like a primairy weapon. i carry a bow, 2 sets of arrows and a sword/mace/axe/hammer/dagger/spear (w/e)

veagir are definitly the best archers everyone deniying  it has clearly never seen one in action.

rhodoks known for there spearman.
khergits known for the horse archers.
norse known for there infantry.
swadia known for there heavy cavelery.
and veagir known for the outstanding archers

 

[mrcrotch]

It means he has been a bad boy and the admins will spank him if naughty.


But I think the Nords have the best archers - they even hit me when I'm in the same team!

 

[Wraithcat]

Any respect I may have had for you has now been lost. A crossbow, is not a type of bow, in my eyes. A bow, requires skill and training to use. A crossbow, to me, is a piece of technology, where it is the weapon, not the man, that makes the kill. Call me Spartan, I don't care, but the use of a crossbow does not make one an "archer". archer, archery, means the use of the bow and arrow. not the crossbow and bolt. So the vaegir marksmen are the best archers in calradia.

Oh dear.

You'd better tell Armagan that we want another key on the keyboard.

1. Everyone
2. Infantry.
3. Archers
4. Horsemen
5. People with implements that aren't really bows afterall.



http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/crossbow

 

[lilyeti]

I do! Check out my Mercanary Longbowmen in my thread.

 

[ttsec]

Any respect I may have had for you has now been lost. A crossbow, is not a type of bow, in my eyes. A bow, requires skill and training to use. A crossbow, to me, is a piece of technology, where it is the weapon, not the man, that makes the kill. Call me Spartan, I don't care, but the use of a crossbow does not make one an "archer". archer, archery, means the use of the bow and arrow. not the crossbow and bolt. So the vaegir marksmen are the best archers in calradia.

Oh dear.

You'd better tell Armagan that we want another key on the keyboard.

1. Everyone
2. Infantry.
3. Archers
4. Horsemen
5. People with implements that aren't really bows afterall.



http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/crossbow

Haha, yeah, I guess he better stop playing M&B, as he wouldn't have any respect for M&B and Armagan either.

 

[killer-blead]

the pistol merged out of the crossbow.
and since your suggesting a crossbow is a bow.

does that make a pisol a bow 2?