This "lance thing" has got old..as did quite a few other issues.

[Mhydrian]

Oh okay, never actuallly paid attention if it moves up or down, (not that important for me anyways) but then the "problem" that you can aim left or right (even slightly), without turning your horse, still remains.

Uh, that's realistic. The whole point of a couched lance is to put all your FORWARD momentum into the blow. The recoil force you feel is straight into the body which the saddle is designed to take (so you don't fall backwards off the horse). Move it to the side, even slightly, and not only do you not get the same amount of force, you'd probably get your lance twisted out of your hand or, worse, be pushed sideways off your horse.

Couched lances hit straight ahead only, this is not a problem, it's exactly how they should work.

No, its not, the western style lancers usually couched the lance across the horse's neck.

Spoiler

I'd like to point oiut that jousting is quite different from the battlefield.

From wikipedia:

"Medieval European knights attacked in several different ways, implementing shock tactics if possible, but always in formations of several knights, not individually. For defense and mêlée a formation of horsemen was as tight as possible next to each other in a line. This preventing their enemy from charging, and also from surrounding them individually. With their heavy and armoured chargers knights trampled through the enemy infantry. The most devastating charging method was to ride in a looser formation fast into attack. This attack was often protected by simultaneous or shortly preceding ranged attacks of archers or crossbowmen. The attack began from a distance of about 350 metres and took about 15-20 seconds to cross the contemporary long range weapon's effective distance. A most important element, and one not easily mastered, was to stay in one line with fixed spaces while accelerating and having the maximum speed at impact. Often knights would come in several waves, with the first being the best equipped and armored. The lance as primary weapon pierced the enemy. If an enemy soldier was hit in full gallop by a knight's lance embedded under the armpit, he was thrown backwards with such a momentum that he knocked over several of his compatriots. The heavy lances were dropped after the attack and the battle was continued with secondary weapons (sword, axe, mace or likewise). Then the troops of a scara regrouped into the tighter formation mentioned above."



Notice hoe they drop lances after the first charge. That's the one thing that annoyed me about this game, we never lose our lances or spears. And that's the reason why couched lancing is so overpowered in M&B

 

[Pongo]

Ya no weapons are damages in M&B, but that is because the objectives and intensity of combat require so much killing by the PC. If you were only fighting one battle a month, you could expend the lance, but the tempo of the game would be alot different.

 

[supraliminal]

Oh okay, never actuallly paid attention if it moves up or down, (not that important for me anyways) but then the "problem" that you can aim left or right (even slightly), without turning your horse, still remains.

Uh, that's realistic. The whole point of a couched lance is to put all your FORWARD momentum into the blow. The recoil force you feel is straight into the body which the saddle is designed to take (so you don't fall backwards off the horse). Move it to the side, even slightly, and not only do you not get the same amount of force, you'd probably get your lance twisted out of your hand or, worse, be pushed sideways off your horse.

Couched lances hit straight ahead only, this is not a problem, it's exactly how they should work.

No, its not, the western style lancers usually couched the lance across the horse's neck.

Spoiler

I'd like to point oiut that jousting is quite different from the battlefield.

From wikipedia:

"Medieval European knights attacked in several different ways, implementing shock tactics if possible, but always in formations of several knights, not individually. For defense and mêlée a formation of horsemen was as tight as possible next to each other in a line. This preventing their enemy from charging, and also from surrounding them individually. With their heavy and armoured chargers knights trampled through the enemy infantry. The most devastating charging method was to ride in a looser formation fast into attack. This attack was often protected by simultaneous or shortly preceding ranged attacks of archers or crossbowmen. The attack began from a distance of about 350 metres and took about 15-20 seconds to cross the contemporary long range weapon's effective distance. A most important element, and one not easily mastered, was to stay in one line with fixed spaces while accelerating and having the maximum speed at impact. Often knights would come in several waves, with the first being the best equipped and armored. The lance as primary weapon pierced the enemy. If an enemy soldier was hit in full gallop by a knight's lance embedded under the armpit, he was thrown backwards with such a momentum that he knocked over several of his compatriots. The heavy lances were dropped after the attack and the battle was continued with secondary weapons (sword, axe, mace or likewise). Then the troops of a scara regrouped into the tighter formation mentioned above."



Notice hoe they drop lances after the first charge. That's the one thing that annoyed me about this game, we never lose our lances or spears. And that's the reason why couched lancing is so overpowered in M&B

I'd agree if the thrown backwards effect were actually in place.  As it is, one shotting is one shotting, and couched lances are one of the slowest ways to do it.  I wouldn't consider that overpowered in game terms, although getting +3 weapon proficiency almost every time you successfully couch is probably a bit too fast.  Plus, it's one of the only ways YOU can get one shotted (other than a totally random thrown axe to the face, it IS the only way that I can think of) no matter how high level you are.

Actually what I think is totally underpowered is infantry "couching", or setting, not being present.  There should really be a mechanic that will one shot and obliterate the horse/knight if he charges into that firmly set pike.

 

[Jericho]

...
...
Notice hoe they drop lances after the first charge. That's the one thing that annoyed me about this game, we never lose our lances or spears. And that's the reason why couched lancing is so overpowered in M&B

About a year ago when Armagan released beta .89? he made a statement that there would not be breakable weapons.
There had been some very long and heated debates about incorporating breakable lances into the game and how
overpowering the couched lance was, etc. etc. - Nonetheless the devs decided not to include breakable weapons.

SO, we who feel that lances should not survive numerous couched attacks are left with other ways to SIMULATE
this effect...after two or three couch hits...STOP USING THE LANCE for the rest of that battle, unless you go and access
your inventory chest to simulate getting another lance. 

~ Ultimately this game is great, but it can't do it all for you no matter how much we want it to! 

 

[Robrecht]

Ya no weapons are damages in M&B, but that is because the objectives and intensity of combat require so much killing by the PC. If you were only fighting one battle a month, you could expend the lance, but the tempo of the game would be alot different.

Really?

Because my force of Nprd Veterans/Huscarls doesn't need me to help them at all.

All I need to do is tell them to hold a position, place my PC behind them and wait for the enemy to crush itself against the wall of Nords.

For that matter it doesn't seem to make any difference whether my enemies are mounted, archers or infantry, Huscarls with their shields can just stand there and stop whatever tries to attack them.

 

[Tiberius]

I really don't know why people say couching lances is overpowered... couching makes you lower your shield for a period of time, thus making you really vulnerable to anything, especially ranged weapons.

 

[pentagathus]

And pikemen, and men in formation.

 

[Pongo]

Ya no weapons are damages in M&B, but that is because the objectives and intensity of combat require so much killing by the PC. If you were only fighting one battle a month, you could expend the lance, but the tempo of the game would be alot different.

Really?

Because my force of Nprd Veterans/Huscarls doesn't need me to help them at all.

All I need to do is tell them to hold a position, place my PC behind them and wait for the enemy to crush itself against the wall of Nords.

For that matter it doesn't seem to make any difference whether my enemies are mounted, archers or infantry, Huscarls with their shields can just stand there and stop whatever tries to attack them.

Really?
you have never been involved in any fight as the PC? You got nords to level 28 without involving yourself in their battles? 

 

[SPD_Phoenix]

He said Veteran/Huscarl, not Recruits.

And yes, I let my 14 heroes and higher level troops babysit all of my new recruits sometimes. And sometimes we fight against equal number of sea raiders.

 

[lumikant]

I don't know how much this relates, but it would be ****ING INCREDIBLE if when you lanced someone, the lance stuck out of them like arrows do. It'd be worth losing your lance just for the animation.

 

[Pongo]

He said Veteran/Huscarl, not Recruits.

And yes, I let my 14 heroes and higher level troops babysit all of my new recruits sometimes. And sometimes we fight against equal number of sea raiders.

Ya and how did they get to be veterans and huscarls. By him fighting very hard indeed. So him saying "you dont have to fight in M&B" is silly. No one is handing you huscarls. You have to get your first crappy troops and keep them alive to get your first core of elites.  Then maybe you can sit back in easy battles and let them win. On easy battles. So as a counter to my point his is very weak. The reason why weapons dont degrade in M&B is because we as the player are expected to do a great deal of fighting. Far more then is realistic. So weapons damage isnt realistic.

 

[SPD_Phoenix]

You don't have to even fight to get your new recruits to mid tier. All you need is a few heroes with high Training skill. When your new recruits are at mid tier, you can start letting them fight easier opponent to get more experience.

Again, he just said that he can let his troops fight without his help. It doesn't mean that he has never fought from the start of his game.