Think I can become Independent?

[BadOreo]

I'm about 1,100 days in and I feel I'm capable of being independent almost. I've always been around 350k-450k Denars. I have around 3,500 renown, can support an army of 270, have 2 Saphire rune weapons, 2 knight hood orders and a custom one, part of the empire I own the richest 4 cities in Pendor, Ishkoman, Singal, Torbah and Windholm.

Each city has around 400 men garrisoning, currently losing 3-5k each week.

My game has no saves, so I want to make sure before I jump into it. Think I can survive?

 

[Egaldor]

Uh yeah you totally can... I usually yolo it at day 100 with 100 man army and no relations with any lord. Just sieging a castle i like and holding to it for dear life until war is over.

 

[Styxt]

I'm about 1,100 days in and I feel I'm capable of being independent almost. I've always been around 350k-450k Denars. I have around 3,500 renown, can support an army of 270, have 2 Saphire rune weapons, 2 knight hood orders and a custom one, part of the empire I own the richest 4 cities in Pendor, Ishkoman, Singal, Torbah and Windholm.

Each city has around 400 men garrisoning, currently losing 3-5k each week.

My game has no saves, so I want to make sure before I jump into it. Think I can survive?

If you can't, no one can ...

most of the people (myself included) go for it after owning 1 town (or a castle in the noldor forest).

so enjoy destroying everything in your path 

You should still check if you have a decent amount of right to rule since good relations with monarchs 
doesn't prevent them from trying to beat the s*** out of you with a 3k host.... 

 

[Lazy Buttons]

I don't know if you can. I never played a pendor game to 1,100 days, I usually get bored by about day 500 when I control half the map and only have 1 or 2 factions left, and the game becomes just a slog until the finish.

I think you should wait and gather up some more forces, just to be sure

 

[Korvyr]

I don't know if you can. I never played a pendor game to 1,100 days, I usually get bored by about day 500 when I control half the map and only have 1 or 2 factions left, and the game becomes just a slog until the finish.

I think you should wait and gather up some more forces, just to be sure

TBH if you're killing half the map at 500 days, you're doing something along the lines of cheating, or making the difficulty slider point toward the "easy" side.

 

[Bankoleva]

I don't know if you can. I never played a pendor game to 1,100 days, I usually get bored by about day 500 when I control half the map and only have 1 or 2 factions left, and the game becomes just a slog until the finish.

I think you should wait and gather up some more forces, just to be sure

TBH if you're killing half the map at 500 days, you're doing something along the lines of cheating, or making the difficulty slider point toward the "easy" side.

More like a Warband/PoP vet that knows how to play. If you ignore CKO (which is a time sink).... really could conquer the map that fast. I could find all companions, level to 25, earn enough money to have top quality gear and support an elite army in 100 days. Add an extra 100 days for knighthood quests, some unique spawns and just suring up my force, I can start conquering Pendor by day 200. If I just make all my companions lords.... no need to waste time building relations and recruiting.

Now I don't play like that, I rather take my time and enjoy the game. But you can beat this mod in under 500 days if you ignore some features and just go straight for the win.

 

[Alavaria]

The CKO is a rather amusing diversion From the early days of  people barely able to use their bows and wearing nothing but a breastplate...

 

[Serazu]

The thing with CKOs is that they necessitate the acquisition of a fief, ergo they're off-limits in the first part of the game. Once a chapter is created, they take too long to train, forcing the players who want to see their knights the way they envisioned, to hit the breaks and, ultimately, not play the game they wanted to play. And by the time their knights are to their liking, the game is almost over and said knights make zero difference.

I'd suggest to cut times in half, both the training one, but especially that of the equipment upgrade. Give players the chance to enjoy their CKO for a while.

 

[lconracl]

In the next version gradual equipment upgrades will be properly implemented and as a result player will waste only 10% time and money of the old item.

 

[Serazu]

In the next version gradual equipment upgrades will be properly implemented and as a result player will waste only 10% time and money of the old item.

That's definitely good, but will base times remain as they are now? Because acquiring the DG Leather for instance takes a whopping 90 days, if memory serves. Add the times to acquire all additional weapons and pieces of armor and you'll see that it takes a helluva lot of time to equip a CKO.

Can't you just reduce base times in half or, at least, allow each knight and sergeant to acquire 2-3 different items simultaneously?

 

[lconracl]

The point is that you don't have to go for top tier items straight away (in 3.8.5). Select some with 40 defence, which takes ~15 days. Use your CKO. Then upgrade to 55 in 35. Use your CKO. Then 60 ...

You don't have to wait for the top tier equipment as during upgrade you will recover 90% of time and money.

Going from 10-40-55-60 will take only 10% resources more than 10-60.

Edit:
Actual example:

Leather_Armor (2 - starting gear
|
Lamellar_Armor (4 - 3 days
|
Coat_of_Plates_-_Yellow (55) - 24 days
|
Noldor_Ancient_Plate (66) - 66 days

Within 3 days solders get quite good armour; in 24 - comparable with some KO and should be able to survive battles. Then 2 months for end one.

 

[Serazu]

Yes, but the ultimate point is that you come up with two choices, neither of them being satisfacfory:

Sub-optimaly equip your CKO

or

Equip them in a pleasing manner and have fun, but spend an awfully short amount of time in the game with your knights as you envisioned them. Unless you deliberately drag your time that is. Which isn't satisfactory either.

At least make it so that each knight and sergeant can be equipped with two items simultaneously. That will reduce times.

 

[Bankoleva]

You could always just cheat your CKO to perfection and enjoy the show. I did a play through like that a while back.

CKO is awesome, it's only weakness is player satisfaction and reality. And those are things modders can't bug fix.

If there was 1 thing I would like to see though is an end game baddy or event that makes CKO almost a necessity or godsend. As it stands CKO is just an awesome feature to enjoy but not really needed. And in agreement that by the time their worth it, I'm usually over the hump of End game. Anyway just my 2 cents.

This topic has been derailed enough.

 

[lconracl]

Yes, but the ultimate point is that you come up with two choices, neither of them being satisfacfory:

Sub-optimaly equip your CKO

or

Equip them in a pleasing manner and have fun, but spend an awfully short amount of time in the game with your knights as you envisioned them. Unless you deliberately drag your time that is. Which isn't satisfactory either.

I see it from the different side.
3 days will take your knights to get 48 body armour, which is good enough to take them with you and "have fun" almost straight away. They don't need to wait years for upgrades straight to the top tier stuff, hidden behind walls.

It is good to remember that CKO send warparties and patrols - the sooner they get some equipment, the more helpful they will be.

 

[Fearghus The Killer]

I don't know if you can. I never played a pendor game to 1,100 days, I usually get bored by about day 500 when I control half the map and only have 1 or 2 factions left, and the game becomes just a slog until the finish.

I think you should wait and gather up some more forces, just to be sure

TBH if you're killing half the map at 500 days, you're doing something along the lines of cheating, or making the difficulty slider point toward the "easy" side.

I wrap things up around day 900 on my playthroughs at normal settings. Half the map in 500 days seems typical to me. There's a guy here on the boards (bakters?) who conquered Calradia in 162 days on hard settings.

 

[RacerBG]

I usually spend the first 200-300 days in getting honour, renown and relations, and then I'm choosing the strongest faction, conquer for myself the best cities and never really help them for the other sieges. My style of playing is secure and boring but in this way I can make almost the best army in Pendor without too much resistance. That's my goal.

By the way, k0nr@d, when we can expect a Dev Diary about version 3.8.5?

 

[Serazu]

Yes, but the ultimate point is that you come up with two choices, neither of them being satisfacfory:

Sub-optimaly equip your CKO

or

Equip them in a pleasing manner and have fun, but spend an awfully short amount of time in the game with your knights as you envisioned them. Unless you deliberately drag your time that is. Which isn't satisfactory either.

I see it from the different side.
3 days will take your knights to get 48 body armour, which is good enough to take them with you and "have fun" almost straight away. They don't need to wait years for upgrades straight to the top tier stuff, hidden behind walls.

It is good to remember that CKO send warparties and patrols - the sooner they get some equipment, the more helpful they will be.

It's not a big deal though to allow them to acquire gloves and boots simultaneously. Or swords and shields simultaneously. I don't know about you, but I'd neved send my troops out on plate armor and... leather boots. They'd look like clowns.

 

[lconracl]

RacerBG Info about 3.8.5 "leaks" all the time - treat this as a dev blog.

Serazu It won't be easy (for me) to implement several upgrades at the time, so it is not the way.

 

[Serazu]

Makes sense. Reducing upgrade times by a little bit might do the trick then, I think. It won't really upset the game balance, as we all agree CKOs are by and large redundant. The existing units are adequate to crush all opposition. It all comes from the desire to spend more time with our knights the way we envisioned them, not powergaming.

Anyway, that's my thinking. The CKO is an excellent aspect, but it can be improved even further. If there's not time or willingness to do it, that's understandable. You guys have already done more than enough.

 

[sher]

Serazu It won't be easy (for me) to implement several upgrades at the time, so it is not the way.

You shouldn't do it at all - CKO troops can get decent equipment long before they will be combat ready, and they can have good equipment when they are. With discounts it'll be even faster due to cheaper starting gloves and maybe helmets. It's already fine and in line with starting stats and training speed. If some players cannot plan it right - it's their problem not system's.