Sand & Sword | Classical Duel Tournament - Congratulations Arni!

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Tardet said:
The quarter final bewteen Maximou and Arni will be taking place tomorow at 6:00pm GMT, for anyone interested. Will also be recording it for those who missed it but would still like to watch.
That is great, man. Thanks for the effort.

[M] said:
I won 7-5 vs LeRoux, gfs as always
Gfs! Wish it was recorded
 

🐝 M

Marquis
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Golodir said:
Can you explain how your character is at this angle? It looked odd to me so I tried to reproduce it - on a 1920x1080 screen, same as yours, I couldn't make a character's foot be below the scoreboard without the angle being completely different - the 'view outfit' button drops the camera much lower:


Is there an innocent explanation for this or are you using a zoom hack equivalent to this?
 

Gorlock

Knight at Arms
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[M] said:
Golodir said:
Can you explain how your character is at this angle? It looked odd to me so I tried to reproduce it - on a 1920x1080 screen, same as yours, I couldn't make a character's foot be below the scoreboard without the angle being completely different - the 'view outfit' button drops the camera much lower:


Is there an innocent explanation for this or are you using a zoom hack equivalent to this?
Yeah that looked funny to me too,

This was as close as I could get it, 1920x1080 and fully zoomed out.
 

Volshen

Master Knight
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[M] said:
Golodir said:
Can you explain how your character is at this angle? It looked odd to me so I tried to reproduce it - on a 1920x1080 screen, same as yours, I couldn't make a character's foot be below the scoreboard without the angle being completely different - the 'view outfit' button drops the camera much lower:


Is there an innocent explanation for this or are you using a zoom hack equivalent to this?
Actually, you could make such screenshot, its just quite hard. You would find yourself in such position, if you were runing and swinging, then when you stop(but continue swinging), your left leg for a moment behaves quite weirdly and goes below the scoreboard. I tried to make a screenshot, but pressing all 4 keys and keeping right angle is not an easy, so I guess you would need a luck for that.
 

🐝 M

Marquis
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Volshen said:
[M] said:
Golodir said:
Can you explain how your character is at this angle? It looked odd to me so I tried to reproduce it - on a 1920x1080 screen, same as yours, I couldn't make a character's foot be below the scoreboard without the angle being completely different - the 'view outfit' button drops the camera much lower:


Is there an innocent explanation for this or are you using a zoom hack equivalent to this?
Actually, you could make such screenshot, its just quite hard. You would find yourself in such position, if you were runing and swinging, then when you stop(but continue swinging), your left leg for a moment behaves quite weirdly and goes below the scoreboard. I tried to make a screenshot, but pressing all 4 keys and keeping right angle is not an easy, so I guess you would need a luck for that.
Thanks for this information. I recorded a video so I could try this way without struggling with key combinations. This is the closest I could get in light of your possible explanation:


Here is an animated comparison, I think the angle difference is clear:



edit: Arni's been in and out of this thread several times and hasn't offered an explanation or even recognition of the strangeness of the screenshot. I don't want to consider that an admission of guilt but in his place I'd definitely be looking to defend myself :/


edit: I was linked another of the screenshots Arni posted earlier in the tournament, neither myself or the person who linked it to me can reproduce this angle either:



Unless anyone has any more explanations I think we can only conclude Arni's using zoom hacks in this tournament. Doing my duel for this each week is the only warband I'm playing so I'm not invested in other tournaments but I hardly consider it a stretch that he's cheating in those as well. Sad.
 

Volshen

Master Knight
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[M] said:
Volshen said:
[M] said:
Golodir said:
Can you explain how your character is at this angle? It looked odd to me so I tried to reproduce it - on a 1920x1080 screen, same as yours, I couldn't make a character's foot be below the scoreboard without the angle being completely different - the 'view outfit' button drops the camera much lower:


Is there an innocent explanation for this or are you using a zoom hack equivalent to this?
Actually, you could make such screenshot, its just quite hard. You would find yourself in such position, if you were runing and swinging, then when you stop(but continue swinging), your left leg for a moment behaves quite weirdly and goes below the scoreboard. I tried to make a screenshot, but pressing all 4 keys and keeping right angle is not an easy, so I guess you would need a luck for that.
Thanks for this information. I recorded a video so I could try this way without struggling with key combinations. This is the closest I could get in light of your possible explanation:


Here is an animated comparison, I think the angle difference is clear:



edit: Arni's been in and out of this thread several times and hasn't offered an explanation or even recognition of the strangeness of the screenshot. I don't want to consider that an admission of guilt but in his place I'd definitely be looking to defend myself :/


edit: I was linked another of the screenshots Arni posted earlier in the tournament, neither myself or the person who linked it to me can reproduce this angle either:



Unless anyone has any more explanations I think we can only conclude Arni's using zoom hacks in this tournament. Doing my duel for this each week is the only warband I'm playing so I'm not invested in other tournaments but I hardly consider it a stretch that he's cheating in those as well. Sad.
For the 1st screenshot - well, I guess you have to spend a lot of time to catch that leg movement at the right moment(and with the right pre-movement). I still think it's possible, but just needs a lot of luck and tries.

For the 2nd screenshot:
This looks pretty close for me.
 

Golodir

Count
WBM&BWF&SNWVC
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Nice to see you paying attention to all my screenshots in order to find out a 0,0001 difference in angles, Jesus Christ. But as much as you wouldn't like to hear it - no, I'm not using hacks. I don't know how i did it; yea, sorry, I don't pay attention to the way i'm making screens. Probably if you try for some time, you will be lucky to get the same angle and position. Seems like you have plenty of free time, so you can dedicate yourself to this case till the morning.
 

🐝 M

Marquis
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If someone can match it I'll retract the accusation but your behaviour over the last x years deserves this tiny amount of scrutiny. I work full time but it's really not taking me "till morning"...

Volshen said:
For the 2nd screenshot:
This looks pretty close for me.
Your attempt to match it looks good - your resolution is different but it's the same aspect ratio so FOV is the same. I tried using your method to get as close as I could to Arni's screenshot (foot off bottom, ass on bottom of scoreboard), you can yet again see the too high angle in this comparison:


A clear indication of the higher angle, if you lack eyes, is that you can't see the blade in either mine or Volshen's attempts.


Golodir said:
I don't know how i did it
Unless I'm shown otherwise, like this is my assumption
 

Golodir

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WBM&BWF&SNWVC
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the great and almighty warband sage sotamursu who knows everything about the game, almost instantly recognized the camera angle and how to get your camera to move like that.

Sota gladly agreed to help me, because honestly I have no clue how I did it, so here's his explanation and example of a screen that shows that this is possible



SotaMursu: you can get this (and any angle between regular and the fully locked view outfit" position) by tapping the "view outfit" button and taking a screenshot before it's locked in the actual "view outfit" position, while it's still transitioning to the other camera position.
SotaMursu: my screen is not a 100% perfect replicate of the position but that's just cuz it's pretty hard to simulate an accidental "view outfit" while taking a screenshot
SotaMursu: but that's how you can get that angle for a single screenshot
SotaMursu: like you have in that screenshot you posted
SotaMursu: also worth mentioning is how arni's character has a slightly weird position cuz of the "winning an ft7" animation starting up and my swing is not as far into the animation

 

🐝 M

Marquis
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Golodir said:
the great and almighty warband sage sotamursu who knows everything about the game, almost instantly recognized the camera angle and how to get your camera to move like that.

Sota gladly agreed to help me, because honestly I have no clue how I did it, so here's his explanation and example of a screen that shows that this is possible



SotaMursu: you can get this (and any angle between regular and the fully locked view outfit" position) by tapping the "view outfit" button and taking a screenshot before it's locked in the actual "view outfit" position, while it's still transitioning to the other camera position.
SotaMursu: my screen is not a 100% perfect replicate of the position but that's just cuz it's pretty hard to simulate an accidental "view outfit" while taking a screenshot
SotaMursu: but that's how you can get that angle for a single screenshot
SotaMursu: like you have in that screenshot you posted
SotaMursu: also worth mentioning is how arni's character has a slightly weird position cuz of the "winning an ft7" animation starting up and my swing is not as far into the animation
Appreciate the effort Sota. I'm aware of this "technique", catching the screenshot in the transition between view outfit and normal camera. It's the only way I could get anything close to Arni's camera angle in the 2nd screenshot.

Yours is definitely the closest I've seen but is unfortunately not the answer.


To use this technique tapping the view outfit button, you need to raise the camera very high and look down on your character. When doing a horizontal swing in warband, vertical movement is unlocked meaning raising the camera to that height causes your character to bend over when you release the view outfit button, as in your screenshot. Aside from the angle still not being correct, that's not the case in Arni's screenshot, his character is standing straight.

Unless this difference is because of the cheer animation, which I'm not in a position to test right now, and we're expected to believe Arni routinely takes his screenshots while frantically tapping his view outfit button to achieve rare, unreproducible angles, this isn't really good enough.

Obviously I'd rather the little corner of warband I have the deepest affection for doesn't have cheating snakes in it, so I'm still happy to be proven wrong if anyone is able. This explanation and the ramblings he's been doing on steam that it's because of his FPS cap or monitor Hz are making an innocent explanation less and less plausible though :/
 

Alene

The Queen of Diamonds
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Just noting that links that link to cheats get removed. Like that youtube link.
 

Tardet

French Toast
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Here is the recording of the match.

I added some music because I know many people have sometimes difficulties watching warband. If you don't like it, just mute the video. If you miss the in-game sounds, just go on Ludus while watching the video, relatively the same :wink:


The video isn't posted as an evidence or anything of that sort, I've talked to Belendor and he told me to post it, and some people requested it aswell so here it is. Apologizes for the miniature aswell, the one for Native isn't quite ready yet but should be within the evening.

Gfs both.
 

Golodir

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WBM&BWF&SNWVC
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To M:

SotaMursu: if you accidentally press Β§ while pressing tab for the scoreboard when taking the screenshot, you'll get an angle that looks different. Replicating an accidental tap to get the exact same character position and camera angle isn't exactly the easiest thing to do, which would take loads of time and effort.
 

🐝 M

Marquis
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Golodir said:
Replicating an accidental tap to get the exact same character position and camera angle isn't exactly the easiest thing to do, which would take loads of time and effort.
If it's possible it can be reproduced and some of us are willing to go to the effort to make sure the tournament is clean. Belendor has kindly made an attempt to reproduce the camera position:




A quick note about aspect ratios for those who are unaware: when the aspect ratio is the same, the camera works the same way and presentation meshes are scaled proportionally. As an example, for two 16:9 ratio screens of different resolutions, such as 1280x720 and 1920x1080, when scaled to the same size the HP bar and weapon icon will be in the same place. You can see an example of this below, a screenshot at 1280x720 and one of 1920x1080 match perfectly when resized uniformly:





Unfortunately in Belendor's screenshot this isn't the case as he's either testing with his game not at 16:9 or has manually stretched the image in Photoshop:





After returning the image to its proper aspect ratio by aligning the gold and weapon/hp bar presentation meshes, this is the final comparison:





So unfortunately I'm still at square 1 when it comes to finding an adequate innocent explanation for the camera positions in these screenshots.
 
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