I received this PM from
sapped, which I allow myself to reproduce here, since I think the discussion and remarks could benefit everyone interested in this project.
sapped said:
hey there Lord Samuel
I have been following u guys' work for some time now and I wanna give a HUUUGGE thanks
to u and Carnivorious for u guys' hard work on the project!!! especially the testing, which u
mentioned is really painful to do, therefore I wanna give another big thanks for all ur hard
work!!!
I have seen some of the screens u posted and they look absolutely amazing!!! it adds so
much to the gameplay. no longer does everyone have to stand on one crowded ladder!!!
I have always used the siege pack addon for original M&B and I just can't believe a mod
like this hasn't even been made lol.
Thank you, sapped, although you should know that there are already some Warband SSPs (Siege Scenes Packs) out there, like Smarmellow's, which is quite fine. The difference between Smarmellow's Pack and ours being that we will try to make a "lighter" version of his scenes, since he added quite much, like double walls in City Sieges, etc.
sapped said:
However there are a few things I'm really concerned of, some of the scenes u decided not
to add extra ladders, like those with siege towers included or scenes like Praven. I really
think u shouldn't do it this way, as I always thought the main objective of this mod is to make
the siege battle less crowded with large battle size!!!
Although I like what u had in idea with those, the actual gameplay can be very different, Siege
towers can still get crowded very easily , and city sieges like Praven will be even more frustrating especially
with mods featuring gunpowders like Eagle and the Radiant Cross. The Siege Pack mod for original M&B added
extra ladders to all scenes even if its already siege towered, and it works out perfectly. Battles will also be more
epic and fluid with less frustrations this way.
Okay, I will look into adding ladders to Siege-Towered Scenes.
Praven will be more difficult, but I'll try.
sapped said:
Also about the scene props like siege camps, I really like how it looks and all, but I would still suggest
not to include them, siege performance are already pretty demanding for many even on high end systems, adding
those extra props can really effect the gameplay performance, like the fire effects, all the extra model polygon
that the CPU need to load in etc. And also people won't really notice it in battle cos they are usually busy fighting,
the archer AI won't use the siege shield for cover, so I really don't think it should be included.
U can also think about it this way, no one would build their siege camp this close to the besieged castle, with this
distance archers on the wall can literally shoot over the tiny little barracade and kill anyone thats in the siege camp
without problem, a few volleys and they will be dead, so there's not much sense in it. Also u should consider cultural
differences, Eg. the Khergits uses Mongolian style Yurt, not those square tents, and it also wouln't be making much
sense that Nords use these European style tents as well, so I think its much better not to include them.
I know this is probably very different from what u have in mind but I think this will work out better, So I really hope
that u can do it like this. If not, I really hope that u can make a simplified version with just extra ladders added, it
should be easier for u then when the mod is already released as u can just move the ladder over to the simplfied
version.
I understand your remarks about siege camps props.
Maybe we will release a 'lighter' version after the SSP is completed, with less smokes and fires and siege camps.
About cultural differences (european style square tents), it's true. But you could also say that the Besieging army has adapted to local techniques?
All factions, except maybe Khergits, would naturally use them, anyway (including Sarranids). Normans also know what a tent is in the year 1257, in my opinion!
sapped said:
Anyway, I wish u guys the best of luck on this project, the whole Warband Community will be greatly benefited by u
guy's actions.
PS. Is it possible for 2 ladders to be facing the same way in some scenes, I don't know how to describe it but I think
it looks kinda wierd when they are diagonal to each other
Yeah, diagonal ladders. I chose this option only in very small castles (with only 1 wall facing the Besieger), whenever I felt that there wasn't enough slot space anywhere else to lodge the extra ladder without shrinking it to fit the non-destroed crenels and embrasures.
If I didn't, the scenes would also have looked kinda weird, with the 1st ladder arriving naturally on the destroyed battlement, but the 2nd ladder arriving on a much higher level, onto the non-destroyed part of the wall.
Then one would have wondered why the Besieging Army had even bothered to make a single hole in the battlement at all in the first place.
This also kind of apply to Siege-Towered Scenes as well... Why an army would have ever built a siege tower if ladders could be easily deployed somewhere else?
I know it looks kinda weird, though. I'll try to avoid that situation whenever I can.
Thank you again for your remarks and suggestions ! They are very much helping.