Resolved Losing the castles I had before becoming vassal when quitting a kingdom

[Zakyrel]

Hello there,

I don't know if it is intended. I'm thinking it isn't :

In my new 1.4.3 campaign, I managed to get 2 castles while still being independant (I didn't join any Kingdom). And now I'm seeing Sturgia getting rekt by all the other kingdoms. So I decided maybe I should become a vassal to help him, and I could quit Sturgia latter. I would still have my holds to rely on.

Now I tested this, making a specific save before :
1 - Joining Sturgia as a vassal
2 - Quit Sturgia

As a result I lost my 2 castles. The king of Sturgia just took them. But there weren't conquered while I was a vassal of Sturgia so... I guess this is not right. And again I belive this is not intended by the devs, right ?

 

[elysebluemoon]

I have contacted the developers, I'll update this thread when I hear back from them.

 

[elysebluemoon]

Hi, I've been informed that this is intended. There is a notifiaction that warns the player the all fiefs will be lost while leaving the kingdom. Marking this thread as solved.

 

[Zakyrel]

Are you sure about this ? I mean did you understand what I was asking about ? I must insist you ask the devs again, please.

I know there is a notification when you click the "Leave kingdom" icon in the Clan management page, but that's not the purpose of my question.

Right now in the game, there are two ways to leave a kingdom, that icon in the Clan management page, and talking to your liege lord.
- when using the icon in the Clan management page, the popup says : "Owned settlements are returned to the kingdom". To my understanding, these implies that those settlements need to have been properties of your liege lord in the first place to be able be "returned to the kingdom".
- when talking to your liege, he/she says : "Also, be aware that if you leave my services, you will be surrendering to me all the fiefs which you hold in my name." To me these sentence "the fiefs you hold in my name" means castles and cities that the liege lord gave to the player.

What I want to understand is this :
- Is it intended that the player loses his holdings he acquiered before he joined the kingdom when he is leaving it now ?
- Or maybe, do the fiefs the player owned by himself become properties of the liege lord when he join his/her kingdom ? (These don't seems normal to me)

From my point of view. It seems correct to give back castles and cities you gained control while being vassal of this kingdom. But holdings you owned before joining this kingdom should not be lost. Historicaly, counties and duchies bring with them their lands and holdings when joining a kingdom, but they keep their lands and holdings when leaving too. Except if the crown seize their lands and titles. There are good examples throught history, like in western Europe medieval periode for instance, with the duchy of Normandie, the duchy of Aquitaine, the duchy of Bretagne, the duchy of Provence, the duchy/kingdom of Burgondy, the duchy of Flandres, and so on... when joining and leaving the Frankish kingdom, the kingdom of England, the Holly Roman Empire, or simply being independant, their bring with them in and out their lands.

If after that, the devs answer is still the same, I guess I have to create a new threat in the Feedback and Suggestions section.

Take care.

 

[Stromming]

When you join a kingdom you pledge yourself to the king and he has absolute power to do whatever he wants. He is, and would be historically, in his right to take the cities if you choose to leave the kingdom after you pledged them to him.

What would be good is an alliance feature

 

[Zakyrel]

Historically, this is not the case. In the medieval periode, feudalism worked like I said above. Duchies had great power and even if they pledged loyalty to the king, then pay homage to him, bring their armies to war for him, give a part of their collected taxes to him, and so on... The king still doesn't own their lands.

 

[elysebluemoon]

That is what I asked when I asked the developers if this situation is by design. It is intended that the fiefs you owned previously are left to the kingdom you are leaving.

 

[Zakyrel]

@elysebluemoon Ok. Thanks for your confirmation. Take care.