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archers should not have direct access to twohanded weapons.
- Thread starter Namakan
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Don't want to comment on skirmish balance...But in cap mode archers AI need to be way way better. Faster movement, higher fire rate, more damage...
180!
fian is good just nerf his sword speed it's bloody faster than sonic the hedhehog
Spottswoode
Veteran
I know your talking Skirmish...
My 2 cents, DONT make this change effect Captain please.
Khans w/ Glaives double as a Shock Troop option for Kz and they need that option! Its a great compromise. If you take the 2h axe away from Sturgian archers then that would not be great either on captain.
We have to be careful balancing one game mode and effecting the other. If there was a way to split it that would be great.
could they just make Palatines, Fians and Khans more expensive on skirmish?
My 2 cents, DONT make this change effect Captain please.
Khans w/ Glaives double as a Shock Troop option for Kz and they need that option! Its a great compromise. If you take the 2h axe away from Sturgian archers then that would not be great either on captain.
We have to be careful balancing one game mode and effecting the other. If there was a way to split it that would be great.
could they just make Palatines, Fians and Khans more expensive on skirmish?
arockstar2
Recruit
It’s so annoying dealing with all these changes they’ve made to cater to the skirmish folks. Captain’s mode had a far better balance months ago than it does now. Balance between the modes ought to be separated.
Archers with 2 handed weapons are fine in captain’s mode, please don’t change this.
as I said in OP, I don't mind the other gamemodes, but for Skirmish it's bs.
I also don't like just increasing cost because the fact remains that the class design is pure bull****, and just making it so that people will be able to afford it slightly rarer doesn't change that.
Aprikosenmann
Knight
Even if he had a 1h mace he would be a strenght. But the Fian is so awesome I would even say that the Seargant is alot weaker in melee 1v1.
Spottswoode
Veteran
I don't know if this game can be balanced for 1v1 fighting without messing up other parts of the game. The core of this game is about fighting in teams, made up of units with different roles, strengths and weaknesses, working together. Kzuait and Battania have powerful archers and depending on how you play, this is a pro or a con.
Split the balance between modes and have at it. But even still I don't know if there is supposed to be this immaculate balance between same unit types from opposing factions. Balance is found through strategy and adjusting your play style for the weapon you wield, the team mate next to you and the enemy in front of you.
The archers we're talking about here are pretty much the most elite units from those factions. They are supposed to be as dangerous as hell.
Split the balance between modes and have at it. But even still I don't know if there is supposed to be this immaculate balance between same unit types from opposing factions. Balance is found through strategy and adjusting your play style for the weapon you wield, the team mate next to you and the enemy in front of you.
The archers we're talking about here are pretty much the most elite units from those factions. They are supposed to be as dangerous as hell.
Spottswoode
Veteran
That kind of comparison is problematic though...
A sargeant is not designed to be a dueling, high damage dealing unit and shouldn't be balanced around that at all. He is elite yes, but by how he survives longer than other units with his armor, and how he is protected from arrows with a shield... but he is not elite because he is a fast moving damage machine. His voulg's and his xbows and cav are the damage units. If it is a heavy defensive shield unit vs a damage unit 1v1 in a fight with absolute equal skill... Then the harder hitting, faster damage unit would be expected to out perform the defensive unit right up until still of the player is introduced into the equation. And then it is anyone's game.
I find it unbelievable how anyone can think an archer class having more DPS in melee than a heavy infantry is okay and good for the game. Making classes more expensive doesn't fix the inherent problem of a class either, just restricts access. Imagine if you still had crush-through glaive cav in 1.5.5 for 300g, the class is still broken even if you can use it only once.
Spottswoode
Veteran
This game is not just about dueling 1v1. Plus
I think restricting or limiting access is the exact purpose of raising the cost on a unit.
Anyways.. I can understand why it makes someone frustrated that their mele orientated unit is able to be out skilled by another ranged and mele class. But if that mele unit they are comparing is a slow, lumbering shield man encased in armor with a massive full face helm... Yeah... He is going to be crushed by a faster unit 1v1. Full armor and a massive shield is not the greatest dueling kit...
Bringing cav up is interesting, clearly the fastest units, dangerous weapon, but an easy shot for archers because their direction is predictable, easy to kill with a spear too, but you have to have those weapons in your kit to do it they would feel very op if none of your team is using the right weapon to counter them and they are a cake walk if you all have pikes right?
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Quite so, a Fiann whipping out his 2h and joining the infantry groupfight as a resident sleeper shock inf is not okay.
Spottswoode
Veteran
Personally, I think you are describing their role perfectly
Yeah sure, they have one of the highest damage when shooting and also when figthing in melee...
If that's their role then what's the point in playing any other class lmao, it's completely superior to most if not all other classes in the game.
Spottswoode
Veteran
We're just looking at it from different perspectives and I do understand your point when you talk about their advantages.
I guess I see Fians strength balanced in other sections of Battania's roster. That's all I'm saying.
I don't think i'm getting your point honestly firu, if you don't push him he shoots and deals top damage, if you push him in melee and he is competent he can easily kill you.
The only way to take him out is usually focusing him with multiple people as for the voulgier. On skirmish there's usually more than 1, so it becomes even harder to play against it because you have to dedicate multiple people to 1/2 players.
If you compare this class to any aserai class per-say, the gap imo is quite big.
