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Idea: A Comprehensive, Polite and Well Reasoned Letter of Dissatisfaction to Taleworlds?
- Thread starter stevepine
- Start date
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I only play 8-bit indie games developed in eco-neutral basements by avacoda-juiced up manbuns.
Guys, this thread highlights the question: what CAN we (the community) do then?
So far I have:
1) Tried to press Mexxico (when he was around) for answers as well as positive commitment to make real changes
2) Re-written my review on Steam, changing it from positive to negative
2) Stopped playing the game until there is a real substantive update with new content
3) Tried to suggest that a collective voice almost certainly does much more than just individual complaining
The other things we can do seem to be really limited:
> Never ever buy another TW game
> Stop recommending the game to others
> Give up on this game in general for at least the next year ... and just wait for the mods
My whole thrust or point with this thread was to say " Come on guys, there must be something more we can do?"
Your thoughts?
So far I have:
1) Tried to press Mexxico (when he was around) for answers as well as positive commitment to make real changes
2) Re-written my review on Steam, changing it from positive to negative
2) Stopped playing the game until there is a real substantive update with new content
3) Tried to suggest that a collective voice almost certainly does much more than just individual complaining
The other things we can do seem to be really limited:
> Never ever buy another TW game
> Stop recommending the game to others
> Give up on this game in general for at least the next year ... and just wait for the mods
My whole thrust or point with this thread was to say " Come on guys, there must be something more we can do?"
Your thoughts?
Ulfhedinn_
Sergeant at Arms
+1
I feel your pain, friend. I created this account just to try to help and in this topic I received some answers...
However, they do not make it very clear which way they will go and that is what drives us crazy.
My last idea was to think about creating a topic as a "petition" where the community could request the official implementation of the content brought by the Freelancer mod. With a mention on the mod page, we could reach several people beyond this forum.
There is a special place in hell for Steam reviewers who give a thumbs up based on the game's "potential" or say things like "Well there are serious problems with the latest release and it's nearly unplayable, but the devs deserve to be praised for making such a great effort!"
Most of the positive reviews are memes. Most of the rest specifically mention how the game sucks and they're looking forward to it not sucking. Only a couple are detailed and those are filled with flat-out lies. Almost all of them are from short-timers.
Here's an example of an actual positive Steam review:
"I don't know. I love this game, and I literally hate it at the same time. One year it's been release, and crashes are still there. It shouldn't be.
But, this is not the main issue with this game.
The AI. My god. The AI. The AI in that game, is the utterly most moronic AI I've ever encountered. The stupidity of the AI is beyond human comprehension. It is unfathomable, and in that kind of game, I can't possibly understand why the AI is so bad. After all these hours playing, I feel empty when I see my own troops doing stupid things beyond stupidity and I don't wanna play anymore. But I continue playing anyway...I just don't know why, FFS. I guess the game is good and addictive enough."
I think an open letter works. Happy to help draft one. I may be an abrasive f*** but I happen to be a professional writer.
As I've said before, blackpill wisdom tells me that they won't respond until they're afraid of negative press. We need to make noise and an open letter is how you do it.
Create our own Bannerlord, with blackjack and hookers.
Or: Bannerlord Online - I dont know anything about it other then its a mod, but if people play on Bannerlord Online, do they show up in Bannerlords Player/Multiplayer stats? Since it also has its own launcher? A lot of question marks from my end?
If we advocate its "legal/illegal/grey" competetion and in doing so tank playerstats they might be tempted to take a look at the plebs and why they're diverting to these type of mods.
LOL we could do a GoFundMe or Kickstarter to raise money for "Making Bannerlord not suck".
Proceeds would either go to TW if they actually do their jobs, or it'd go to modders who do their jobs for them.
This is something I did. I was on a break on forums and the game. When I returned, all I saw was a shallow game. All of that devblogs was in vain, an unfulfilled promise.
What we can do? I don't know. Go to Ankara, enter Metu campus and raid TW building, steal all of the game code and give it to modding community, maybe?
When multiplayer beta announced and veteran MP community played the game, almost all of them started to complain about the game constructively or destuructively. From what I(I am not active on MP forums) see from time to time when they post on this side of the forum, it seems nothing have changed. This is somewhat similar to SP as well.
When I started to read older threads which are posted while I was absent, all I fell was dissapointment. If this kind of attitude from TW did not change for almost two years despite all of high quality posts from veteran players, I don't know what can we do more to change that.
That's just the start. In order to truly make BL great again, we need to invade Ankara + reclaim Constantinople and the ERE + usurp the Pope to restore the Pentarchy.
I think that an open letter with specific issues listed and formatted in a logical and concise way would work. The problem is that those most in favor are going to be sarcastic and unpleasant, and already had voiced harsh criticism in their rant threads. It's not someone I would listen to, if I'm a TW guy secretly following the forums, because if my answer is not what they want to hear they would use it to start more rant threads.
So we need a calm and knowledgeable person to pen the letter. Who is this person? @five bucks did it once, and could do it again.
So we need a calm and knowledgeable person to pen the letter. Who is this person? @five bucks did it once, and could do it again.
Skatan
Regular
I would sign it. The over-zelous ranting and whining is the reason I don't post much even though I lurk a decent amount. I just find all that negativity so incredibly boring. Constructive criticism, on the other hand, is sexy as f.. great. I gave TW the benefit of the doubt the first 6 months, tried to be positive, then I just grew uninterested.
I have not yet written a review since I find the idea of writing a review on a game that have not been released to be utterly moronic. It's like writing a review after watching a trailer for a movie (well, maybe not.. I'm joking a bit to make a point). I have also remained offline since around patch.. 1.5.whatever after not seeing much progress I decided to uninstall and wait. And rather than complaining I would guess silence works as well. If no one is talking about the game, the forums were dead, no one wrote reviews and no one played the game on steam I think it would send a pretty strong signal to any future buyer to wait a bit, do some research etc, and for the company to perhaps work more on their communication with their fans to increase passion/engagement. But maybe not, who knows. All we do here is speculate, some to the point where they think their speculation becomes truth after it has echoed back to them again from someone else.
@Dabos37 summed it up quite well, but as said I am not keen on going full retard on the negativity in the forums myself. I mean the list that it seems most of us agree on. It's that list that needs to be communicated, however, it already has and not much (if anything happened). I doubt a new open letter would change much, but I'd sign it anyways as said. Nothing to loose by doing so of course.
I have not yet written a review since I find the idea of writing a review on a game that have not been released to be utterly moronic. It's like writing a review after watching a trailer for a movie (well, maybe not.. I'm joking a bit to make a point). I have also remained offline since around patch.. 1.5.whatever after not seeing much progress I decided to uninstall and wait. And rather than complaining I would guess silence works as well. If no one is talking about the game, the forums were dead, no one wrote reviews and no one played the game on steam I think it would send a pretty strong signal to any future buyer to wait a bit, do some research etc, and for the company to perhaps work more on their communication with their fans to increase passion/engagement. But maybe not, who knows. All we do here is speculate, some to the point where they think their speculation becomes truth after it has echoed back to them again from someone else.
@Dabos37 summed it up quite well, but as said I am not keen on going full retard on the negativity in the forums myself. I mean the list that it seems most of us agree on. It's that list that needs to be communicated, however, it already has and not much (if anything happened). I doubt a new open letter would change much, but I'd sign it anyways as said. Nothing to loose by doing so of course.
In my opinion it's better for players to keep focusing on improving what's in the game and being changed with updates with acute feedback on issues and reporting bugs.
However I would agree and sign a polite, constructive letter like this. It needs to be concise descriptions of problems though, not just "it's boring" or "siege lol".
However I would agree and sign a polite, constructive letter like this. It needs to be concise descriptions of problems though, not just "it's boring" or "siege lol".
Dear Taleworlds,
its boring
Kind regards,
Your beloved forum members
[quote with your name and signature]
LOL I wouldn't dream of taking credit for a letter; not with my established history of flame-adjacent negativity here. But I'd happily help a more reasonable person post a more reasonable letter than I would put forward myself.
I agree that it is a problem that I and others have used statements from @Duh_TaleWorlds and @mexxico and @Callum to pile hate on the devs, which disincentivizes them from being straight with us in the future.
With that said, it's not like we've had better options. Every white knight for TW here or on Reddit or Steam has their own headcanon for how the devs are diligently working to make the game of their dreams complete with cocaine and hooker feasts... and the only way to burst their bubbles is to be like "Nah. Devs already said that (YOUR FAVORITE FEATURE) is not even on their radar."
I dig that but honestly I have few problems with what's been introduced in the game (except for new stuttering/CTD issues and gratuitous nerfs to caravans/workshops etc). Most of the problem is with what hasn't been and apparently won't be implemented, namely RPG features and "unbalanced"-but-realistic fixes to things like sieges + spear combat.
There are only so many ways that you can give "acute feedback" about sieges not working for over a year. At a certain point, regular feedback of "sieges don't work" becomes a meme regardless of how constructive you're trying to be... which means that playing nice eventually means ignoring gaping holes in the development process.
Sometimes you just have to ask nicely. You don't need to stay for breakfast though.
WhyAmIHere
We've already asked nicely for a year now. Nothing comes of asking nicely. The only thing that gets their attention is when the complaining reaches a fever pitch. At that point they throw us something in the vague shape of a bone and then **** off for another 2-3 months
There are forum members who have been providing feedback for years in a quite polite manner.
We also have dozens of well-structured posts with the changes that most of us want, groupings of suggestions of incredible quality and depth ...
What Taleworlds wants to change they will, and what they don't, they won't. At this point I don't think we can do anything more than warn about bugs and try to get them to accept minor suggestions while they finish their own roadmap.
We also have dozens of well-structured posts with the changes that most of us want, groupings of suggestions of incredible quality and depth ...
What Taleworlds wants to change they will, and what they don't, they won't. At this point I don't think we can do anything more than warn about bugs and try to get them to accept minor suggestions while they finish their own roadmap.
Unfortunately, this is true. The only thing that may ever "shake their asses" is the drop in sales...
Calabanar
Sergeant at Arms
Fair, it doesn’t hurt to try anyway.
