Why Power strike with Polearms?

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A_Stranger

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I'm a relatively new player, but am I missing something here with Polearms? Why would I put points in Power strike if I intend to use Polearms? With higher proficiency, my hits should be one hit kills, no? And even with lower, it's 1-2 swings anyway. Im referring to fighting on foot, and I mostly use poleaxes in that case. Power strike should give me only higher dmg? Which basically means I could use Power strike to smack kings and lords, but that's about it?


ps: One question so I don't open a new thread - weight of my character depends on all weapons on me or only those I have in hand? In other words - wouldn't it be better to use less weapons as pure melee fighter (dismounted) since that would make me faster?
 
You should get powerstrike if you're using melee weapons no matter what. If you're using polearms (poleaxes i assume?) then all the better, because if you invest enough into Powerstrike you'll be 1-hit-killing light-medium soldiers in no time. Wheras it's not that easy to 1.H.K. someone without powerstrike...
 
Hmm alright, and two more things :smile:

I prefer to see my heroes charge with me since that way party has less casualties. Are they going to do better with poleaxes or glaives, or definitely twohanded? I know what works for me, but not familiar with AI.

And what's up with Leadership? I want to be able to take over castles or towns alone. I desperately need Leadership, or high renown might work alone? Or for high enough renown I'd need to play way too long to achieve it? In other words, recommended stats for foot melee? 30 agility I find useful for Athletics, 12 str should be enough so rest would be more useful in Cha or Int? I know my heroes can use Int skills, but I provide bonus points and such, if need be. Seems like I'm just going to end up with character export/import in the end.
 
If you're going for a leader role, Agility and Strength in the 12+ region should suffice. Leadership provides an excellent early boost to party size, and it allows you to punch above your weight if you have the funds to maintain them near your size limit. Deliberately 'farming' for renown is bloody slow unless you like to take on huge enemy parties at 10 battlesize. When you're a few hundred days into the game, renown will contribute a great deal to your party limit, but it's not much use at the start. It tends to accumulate naturally when you get into fights, so there's not much point obssessing over it.

And yes, weight refers the total weight of all items carried on your character. Generally, most weapons are light enough that the hit to your move speed isn't noticeable, but try carrying a warhammer or a maul around. :razz:
 
I'm not going for a leader role in a way that I'd play tactical commander who will sit behind and basically do whatever one does in Total War. I want to fight in this game, that's what it offers best. But unless I have a bigger army my freedom of action is smaller no? I'm not going to take over town or castle with 25 troops. My battlesize is at 50 (I think that's default) and lowering it to 10 would be like cheating no? Maybe Tactics skill would help but no one showed me how exactly that works yet (as in, what exactly do I get with each point).

As for farming renown, hell no, I can't stand the word farming and run like a madmen away from farming/grinding games. The reason this game is good is that it's good from lvl1 and it's damn fun. I don't have to wait till lvl256 to have fun.
 
Swadius said:
I think he means couch lancing and not the swingable pole arms like pole axes or glaives.

No, I mean exactly that - poleaxes/glaives on foot. Dunno, I was just testing it for few min not entire day, but damage seemed good even without power strike (ok there was like few points but that's difficult to avoid at char startup anyway).
Although, I did not test it on heavily armored opponents, true.
 
Well, I use the pole axe quite a lot in my games and similar weapons like halberds in mods, and, like what's said, I've noticed that once I fight higher tiered troops who are sufficiently armored or that there isn't enough of my men to hold them back, killing them would become difficult as cutting damage isn't the best against the heavier armors.
 
1. Always invest in power strike. Under ideal conditions (fighting against someone at a decent range while they're lightly armoured), polearms will kill easily without much investment. But in real conditions where you're fighting against many foes, where some of them may be close enough to negate most of the damage of your polearm, or when you're fighting against heavily armoured foes, power strike will make a difference. When heavily outnumbered on foot, you want to consistently one-shot enemies no matter the situation to prevent them from aggregating around you.

2. At the start, focus on your personal fighting skills. Get yourself to the point where you can comfortably take out enemies, both armoured and unarmoured by being both fast-hitting and hard-hitting with your weapons and are able to wear decent armour without too much slowdown. The more you're able to kill in a battle, the faster you'll be able to level up. Party skills are for your companions.
What I usually do is get my charisma up to 12 and my leadership up to 4 near the start. Find and buy a book of (i think) life of alixenus the great, which will give you an extra point in leadership. That should give you a decent head start. Pick and choose your battles, etc and eventually the reknown will come to you.
 
personally I'd say, go full fighter, the renown will handle the party size, just takes some time, in Native, a big army is not really needed anyway, ya can practically solo the sieges (Yes on hardest settings).
 
Powerstrike is very useful when you start fighting High-tier troops like Swadian Knights or Nord Huscarls. Their armour is very heavy and you will need ps to do good damage to them.

For your companions I would recommend using the shorter 2handed weapons like Great Axe and then give them very heavy armour (you did mean infantry companions eh?). I gave Firentis, Borcha and Marnid different types of axes and hammers and they kill very easily. AI is not very good with polearms, they won't back up when enemies come too close and their damage will quickly be negated because of their too long range for close quarters.
 
K thanks, I was debating whether axes would be better, especially since I'm playing on Vaegir side this time, but exclusively using foot troops. I want to see which fits me better - Rodok sharpshooters or marksmen. Personally for style I prefer Vaegir.

But what of Mauls and such? vs axes? Would my companions be better off with them?

Right now I was considering giving (foot) companions something like:
Weapon (still thinking)
Jarid
Jarid
Shield

If that makes any sense. I'm not sure if they properly switch to 'weapon' when enemy is close or keep hitting with Jarid.

Kraven said:
personally I'd say, go full fighter, the renown will handle the party size, just takes some time, in Native, a big army is not really needed anyway, ya can practically solo the sieges (Yes on hardest settings).

Ok so how high Leadership would you advise then? None? 2-3 points?

The other guy said Renown this way would take too long and I don't feel like waiting a year to be able to do sieges on my own. Although with high Surgery and First Aid I suppose smaller army could do it in waves? Don't have much experience yet with that.


The trade off is this:

If I don't have to invest in Charisma to have big enough army, then I can put points in IQ instead. Which means I can get high Surgery and Pathfinding easily (I know heroes can have em but they level slower and plus i can always give a bonus) while still keeping up my fighting skills (Athletics, Power Strike, Power Throw). Rare point in weapon mastery and I'm not sure Iron is worth it if I'm running in light armor because if I get hit I get hit for a lot anyway. Anything else I'm missing here?
Btw, why I am considering pathfinding on myself as well is this: foot army. For RP. No horses even on companions and none in inventory. Last time I used horses on companions and dismounted on the left of my archers to protect them against charge.. seemed to work, but I'd like to RP more :smile:



ps: Is there a hotkey that will center the map around my character? Like, sometimes I search for places on the map and scroll around. Then I have to get back to my character which I do with clicking anywhere then hitting space fast, which makes the map view slowly return to my character. But is there instant and easier way to do it?
 
you will still require leadership for the morale .Else your morale will be like around 20~30 with a army of 90 with most of the foods with you unless you mod and then even 1 leadership will be enough to have and sustain a huge army(required later in game else is just too hard for a 60 vs 1000khergits battle)
anyways  a leadership of 6 should be good.

a leadership gives a -1 morale each so is indeed unneeded after your army is big enough for you to feel comfortable


leadership also decides the chance your recruited prisoners flee hence the importance(66-5*ls)I think
 
But do I need army of 90? I was aiming more at an army of 50 or so, perhaps 70. Whatever the size I need to comfortably invade a castle on my own, occasionally.

Of course, I've no problem having Leadership of 2 for instance, if I start with charisma of 6 when creating a character. So it's not like I'd have Leadership at zero. Just am not sure about investing in Charisma because I lack experience to know the effects in lategame.
 
higher than 90 troops give a huge moral drop.(not the max)
I do like you to try taking a town with a lord in it or my own nightmare of trying to take the last settlement to eradicate a faction and you do understand that although 90 troops will be enough in regular battles,you do need about 300~400 troops to bite that last one.

And then ,the lords will be like 150+each so getting ganged by the swift khergits is a total nightmare

I am talking about full difficulty of course
 
you need leadership for morale bost, it is impossoble to keep a 100+ army only whit renown whitout having to constalty win battles.
 
Power Strike is one of those things you get regardless really of what kind of player you want to be. No matter what you do, melee-wise, you will be more capable against all threats. Weaker foes will get clocked in 1 to 2 good strikes and you won't have to sit there beating that Lancer 5 times just to reunite him with the ground.
(PROTIP:Remember always to move at the enemy while striking, for moving toward them amplifies the damage, whereas moving back even a little when you connect will weaken it. Never attack standing still.)
Athletics is very important as well. It may not be that inticing when looking to ride a better horse or more power and HP, but when your horsey gets ripped in half while you plummet to the ground and now you have to tell 6 Nord Warriors and a Mr.Huscarl why that wasn't very nice with your Masterwork Heavy Bastard Sword, being slightly faster than their Battle Axes and unshaven faces will pay off.
 
Here's what I've found:

Leadership is good for Moral at high levels and that's about it, it isn't useful for building army size once you are decently into a campaign.  For example.  I think I have about 30 troops from leadership and 260 from renown, you fight so much and gain so much renown that the leadership just pales in comparison.  If I'm out picking fights I carry 140 or so knights with me, if I'm castle crashing it's 280 sergeants.  Either way moral drops at such a rate that you have to keep fighting every 3-4 days just to stay above average(which means your gaining more renown).  So that being said I wouldn't bother getting your leadership up past 5 or 6, it just isn't worth the massive commitment for charisma at the expense of so many other points and abilities that Int brings.

The most important thing for you as you move up higher and higher and fight bigger and bigger battles is not how many troops you personally can kill, it's a much bigger picture than that.  First and foremost the most important thing for you is simply staying alive.  If I am able to simple be on the field with my troops in battle I can take 150 knights and wipe out a force of 450 with loosing maybe 10-15 of them and having 30 or 40 knocked unconscious.  If I'm knocked out and I have to order my troops to attack without me forget about it, I'd loose the whole 150 knights without making a big dent on the enemy.  Hell 150vs150 and I'd be lucky to break even and win that one.  So first thing is stay alive, put points into str and 4-5 into ironflesh.  Sure get your leadership up to 4 or 5 to start so you can have some troops but after that build your ironflesh

Next you want to make money, god money becomes an important thing at mid-level, for this you'll want prisoner management and looting and trade.  You want to adjust these as you level so they keep up with how much loot you're pulling and how many prisoners you're taking.. Spot the bottleneck and adjust based on that, so if on a regular basis you win a battle and you can capture 5 prisoners but there are 10-12 of them regularly available then add another point there.  My sweet spot is 30 prisoners, more than that and it isn't worth the points(i'd rather get an extra 10% money from looting than the pesky 250 gold for prisoners)

If you're in open battle you shouldn't bother with worrying about anything on foot.  It really doesn't make sense.. On heavy charger with a lance or sword you'll be inflicting 10 times more damage than you will ever on foot.  I use the lance because of couched damage and the big speed bonus I get but the horse is really the most dangerous weapon you'll ever get.  Consider this:  when the battle first starts the enemy comes at you in a nice pretty line, I have the best heavy charger, insanely heavy armor and enough riding skill to gain speed.  I can charge through an entire line of 50 troops with my shield down 2-3 times before my horse is low on health.  I'm doing 5-20 points of damage to every enemy I run down just from charging and I'm hitting about 70% of them.  The first run I'll do a total of 300+ hp of damage, the second time through maybe 200+ and another 200+ on the 3rd run.  That's up to 700hp of dealt damage, there's simple nothing else in the game that can even come remotely close to dealing that amount of damage in that short of a time.  Plus when I finally send in my troops the enemy are soo weakened that they drop like flies reducing the amount of fatalities my troops suffer.

If you're not on horse(sieging) stick with your bow and let your troops do the fighting.  I can take out 7 bandits with my strong bow before they can even get to me(headshot, headshot, headshot), but in a siege it is even more critical.  Again if you get knocked out you're troops are going to start dying in mass so staying alive is priority number one and you aren't going to do that with a sword on the front lines.  But with a bow you can just put 3 quivers in your slots to have close to 100 arrows on hand and you should be doing headshots 30% of the time at least.  That means you're going to do 1800-2200 hp of damage in a single siege but the best part is when you run out of arrows you just go pick some up off a dead forest bandit or archer and you're reloaded.  All the while you let your shock troops get killed while you sit back and peg em off.  Once you get good with a bow there's nothing that can compare to the amount of damage you can deal out in a fight without putting yourself in direct risk of getting knocked out, especially when you are defending.. Hell they just line up on the ladder trying to get through your shield wall and you just pop em off one after another after another.

Hope that helps, it's important to plan out your game for what it will become as apposed to simply reacting to what it is now, which it won't be for long :smile:
 
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