Why Is This Forum Section So Toxic?

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The game isn't released yet though, 8 years of development sure but it's still not finished, they're not claiming it's finished, so why are people treating it as if it's a finished product? Personally I think it was a mistake to put it out as EA but i'm kinda glad they did because i was dying for some new Mount and Blade, but at the same time i'm quite fine to wait a year until the game actually releases?
Early access is your release. It doesn't matter if you put an early access sticker onto it. You are selling a product to the public and are paying a full 50euro (where i live anyway) to it. People are going to review it, play it, put 100's of hours, make reviews, make mods, make guides, ...

EA = release. Except the small spike during "official release". The most sales for people who were going to buy the game have already bought it.
 
"its still in early access"
And at this rate its never gonna leave it

As if it matters. If you seriously think the game is gonna be in any way adequate or that anything will change by full release you're on a different world

Its TW's out of touch design decisions that people are upset with, not the fact that its not finished yet
 
The game isn't released yet though, 8 years of development sure but it's still not finished, they're not claiming it's finished, so why are people treating it as if it's a finished product? Personally I think it was a mistake to put it out as EA but i'm kinda glad they did because i was dying for some new Mount and Blade, but at the same time i'm quite fine to wait a year until the game actually releases?
If you have a minute, I recommend watching this(it's timestamped), he addresses the early access fiasco sufficiently:



Games are different, the principal stays the same. Basically, if you are going to release the game as early access, you must make sure that there is substantial amount of content in it and it needs to be ALMOST finished so player base won't just get bored and leave the game before even giving feedback. Did TW achieve this with single player? Eh kinda, it was there playable but lacked so much content, people got bored of the single player very quickly when it first came out because there were literally nothing to do other than fighting, it was sandbox, even the diplomacy was not included. They added new stuff throughout the year, yes, but that content should've been in the game from start.

What about multiplayer? Absolute failure, nothing else. An unbalanced skirmish that gets worse with each update, smells-of-cheese captain mode, crashing every time you join siege and a basically unfinished team deathmatch mode. Where is the battle mode? Where is the duel mode? Fyi I believe battle mode was the jewel of Warband for both casual and competitive side and TW decided to completely ignore it. A band aid duel mode is in, where is the real duel mode? Broken as well, after months and months of work on it. Majorly disregarding player feedback starting from Alpha stage and still continuing it is a big no no from the community. And there are still quite a lot of content that was promised maybe months ago that are not yet in the game.

We every time get a pat on the shoulder and see the words "soon" from the devs every time we talk to them, and understandably, people are tired of it.

If you are disregarding player feedback then what's the point of EA?

So basically;
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making it so that improving your armour cost 20 more respawn points etc etc, but overall I don't think it's a horrible system at all.
Improved armor is nothing but a cosmetic perk and sucks. You still take massive damage by everything. It literally does changes nothing.
The current class system is nothing but garbage.
Limited in every aspect. No light armor, no mid armor, no heavy armor, no combinations of said armor levels, same goes for weapons. There is literally no selection given. People chosing either cav or ranged weapons as they deal the most damage. It just sucks and it still leaves me with a fat question mark what mad person made that degenerated decision.
 
I agree with the OP.

For those saying that "early access is the release, and it was a buggy release etc" - they only released in early access because community has pressured them into doing so, increasingly more as time passed. Before that they kept saying "we will release it when we feel it's in a good state", but people turned deaf and kept asking for it NOW, and that was the result. Now the community is asking for content in the same manner (it's because they have been fed mods like candy during warband times - when they got bored of a mod, they immediately jumped to another - endless candy - forming this impatient community that always seeks something new NOW). Nothing has changed community-wise, from prerelease to postrelease. The only mistake devs have made was to announce the game so early. If they didn't mention it at all then everyone would have lived their lives normally, playing warband now and then. But since they made the mistake of leaking it now everyone is acting like they lived every moment of their life, survived and breathed solely for Bannerlord release during those 8 years, which is really silly.

Early access is not a full release by any means. This game has been in early access for a year and it's getting ripped to shreds on the forum like it's been so for 10 years, even though there are games that are in early access for multiple years and haven't made all that much progress at all. Games full of bugs and performance issues. It literally doesn't matter how much content a game has if the bugs destroy the experience anyway.

I bought some old games that have some bugs that were never even fixed, and those companies keep releasing new games to this day. And even though I liked the concept of some I had to give up on them because not even community fixes worked. So bannerlord devs fixing bugs and performance issues is good progress in itself, and they fixed a lot. Even Valheim devs stated that they will first focus on bugs and performance (and it was a smooth release, I didn't encounter any bugs). So even a smaller game like Valheim needs some time dedicated to performance and fixes (and it's a 1GB game with singleplayer and multiplayer shared - multiplayer only gets difficulty increase per player, and it has maximum 10 players per server, it has been developed for over 3 years as well, and they made it in Unity - an already existant engine). 1 year EA is really not that long for a game of Bannerlord's size (it's a 40+ GB game, with separate singleplayer and multiplayer, with over 1000 npcs on the screen at the same time in battles, a living world, and servers that have over 100
players, and they also created their own engine from scrap). There are still lots of improvements and fixes needed, and content, but it's a game on a bigger scale and more complex, and thus needs more time - logically.

If they stay in EA for the rest of 2021 and added some new content I bet people would be happy with it and all this negativity would look so silly, even with the design choices they don't agree with. But anyway, people should keep voicing their feedback, because maybe some things they don't like will change, but the negativity is not really helping, and may even deter developers from reading their feedback in the first place.

So with all that said, the "8 years in development" argument I see so often really doesn't impress me, personally... I'll give example of some games that have been in development for similar or longer time: Starcraft 2 (7 years), Prey (really cool game, 11 years), Diablo 3 (eh, but 11 years), Duke nukem forever (15 years?). You can safely say that development takes time. Some games have been in early access for so long too. 7 days to die, a game I own, has been EA for like 7-8+ years (and there have been some questionable changes and I don't even enjoy playing it at all anymore... and it only got like a big update each year pretty much, really slow progress.

I blame this idea that developers just snap their fingers and make a full-fledged game instantly on all of the Call of Duties and similar games which have been copy+pasted every year with just some different stories. Because of that kind of money-grabbing garbage people think that in 1-2 years you can make a full and perfect game easily - this company can do that, so why can't everyone else? Even if Bannerlord devs were inefficient in their work (and you can say that and it's perfectly fine), it already happened anyway, it's the past now. Let's move on to more constructive topics to discuss, better worded feedback, and let's wait and see what happens in time. I really hope the game will stay in EA for the rest of this year and we get more improvements like we have been. The game deserves a good memorable full release.
 
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You have to give this game another 8 years of development for a "memorable" full release, or 6 months if you want the memorable part in a ****ty way.
6 months would most likely include some good improvements, like fixed siege AI, multiplayer battle mode, full and working perk system and balanced leveling (maybe even reworked smithing), keep battles, the new terrain system for the campaign... Literally every month they keep working on the game is great. If they don't screw up in major ways I think the game will be good enough after 6 months (or ~5 more updates). But only time will tell
 
6 months would most likely include some good improvements, like fixed siege AI, multiplayer battle mode, full and working perk system and balanced leveling (maybe even reworked smithing), keep battles, the new terrain system for the campaign... Literally every month they keep working on the game is great. If they don't screw up in major ways I think the game will be good enough after 6 months (or ~5 more updates). But only time will tell
Nop, your wrong. You will see. After this "big" update, it will take at least 2 to 3 more months to clean it up. By then we will be almost by Q4. Why are people so willfully gullible? I do not understand.

Maybe its because people don't use Calendars very often? It is already almost the fifth month of the year. What's happening here? Help me understand, gullible people.
 
I agree with the OP.

For those saying that "early access is the release, and it was a buggy release etc" - they only released in early access because community has pressured them into doing so.
Yeah i remember pointing a gun at Armagan head and telling him each day to release bannerlord.

You're so deluded if you believe this. After 8 years of development they suddenly gave up on some imaginary pressure?
 
Wait, what progress?

Also, I wouldn't consider the sub-section toxic, but I gather you'd call any criticism of the game that you dislike toxic, so...

And to the one who brought up the community forcing an early access...no, we didn't. Yes, we wanted it, and we still do. Don't conflate disappointment in early access progress with the lack of a desire for it to exist now. We only want it to, you know, actually get better.
 
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Yeah i remember pointing a gun at Armagan head and telling him each day to release bannerlord.

You're so deluded if you believe this. After 8 years of development they suddenly gave up on some imaginary pressure?
there doesn't have to be a gun pointing at your head for you to feel pressured. Even an exaggerated hype and expectations can be pressure. Even on a small scale - someone expecting a lot from you like your parents can be a lot of pressure - you know in some parts of Asia, because of the amount of pressure and expectations parents have from their children, it oftentime leads to even suicide right? Maybe you're underestimating the effect pressure can have. People were spamming "Bannerlord release when?" as a meme everywhere (on streams on twitch), and eventually they started saying it's never going to be released, bannerlord is a lie etc. "I hope my grandchildren will be able to play bannerlord", etc. But besides the obvious memes, I remember it clearly that before the release was announced people were starting to be negative and say they give up on the game. I remember toxic comments starting to pour once people's patience "reached their limits", so probably devs saw that people are the end of the rope and decided let's release beta, then early access, since it's starting to look bad. Before that though, they kept saying they don't want to give a release date, yet then they complied because of the pressure. It wasn't really imaginary at all;
 
There is NO monthly sub and for every squishie you squish with your cav menav, a kitten is saved. Enjoy.
 
It's perfect really, avoid complete communication with the community = the community will turn on themselves and bicker on who's right or wrong. = expectation's of the game are subverted indefinitely = success?
 
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