Which Infantry to use?

[Seekster]

Ive always been fond of using alot of cavalry in battles for many reasons (survivability, speed, couched lance damage is amazing...) but sometimes I end up in fights on hilly or forested terrain where my cavalry cannot maneuver so I always like to bring along some infantry units to help the cavalry out in those situations. I used to use Swadian Sergeants since I tend to end up playing as the swadians due to their geographic location and the fact that they have Swadian Knights, but while Sergeants are good it means that I have to divert Footmen to Infantry rather than Man at Arms when I have a casualty among the cavalry. For this and other reasons im considering using the Rhodok Sharpshooter (which someone on this board once called "The Space Marines of Calradia") as a substitute. My reasoning for this is that their melee stats are comparable to the Sergeants, they are easier to train, they allow me to specialize all my swadian units into cavalry and to top it all off they have some amazing ranged capabilities which the Sergeants lack.

With an army of 40 I would like to ideally have, 10 Swadian Knights ( or 5 Knights and 5 Men at Arms if im tight on cash), 5 heros (including myself, Lezalit and Artimmener are mounted while Metheld and Deshavi are on foot) and 10/15 Rhodok Sharpshooters with 10/15 Swadian Footmen to round it out.

The cavalry usually end up doing most of the killing while the footmen and sharpshooters are there to come in and help clean up. I like to keep at least 10 footmen around on the off chance that one of my knights or men at arms is killed so I can replace him quickly. On maps where the terrain makes it hard for my cavalry to move around, the Sharpshooters will stay on the top of a hill and pick off the attackers while the footmen and knights support them. This also means that they are less helpless when fighting Khergits because sharpshooters can fire back and ive seen these guys do amazing things with crossbows.

Any feedback?

 

[Tzsak]

...Why do you keep comparing Sharpshooters to Space Marines? They're not particularly good, their strength lies in being easy to train.

 

[Gabeed]

I'm against your strategy, as it centers around the making of a mixed-faction army.

 

[Durandal]

Ive always been fond of using alot of cavalry in battles for many reasons (survivability, speed, couched lance damage is amazing...) but sometimes I end up in fights on hilly or forested terrain where my cavalry cannot maneuver so I always like to bring along some infantry units to help the cavalry out in those situations. I used to use Swadian Sergeants since I tend to end up playing as the swadians due to their geographic location and the fact that they have Swadian Knights, but while Sergeants are good it means that I have to divert Footmen to Infantry rather than Man at Arms when I have a casualty among the cavalry. For this and other reasons im considering using the Rhodok Sharpshooter (which someone on this board once called "The Space Marines of Calradia") as a substitute. My reasoning for this is that their melee stats are comparable to the Sergeants, they are easier to train, they allow me to specialize all my swadian units into cavalry and to top it all off they have some amazing ranged capabilities which the Sergeants lack.

With an army of 40 I would like to ideally have, 10 Swadian Knights ( or 5 Knights and 5 Men at Arms if im tight on cash), 5 heros (including myself, Lezalit and Artimmener are mounted while Metheld and Deshavi are on foot) and 10/15 Rhodok Sharpshooters with 10/15 Swadian Footmen to round it out.

The cavalry usually end up doing most of the killing while the footmen and sharpshooters are there to come in and help clean up. I like to keep at least 10 footmen around on the off chance that one of my knights or men at arms is killed so I can replace him quickly. On maps where the terrain makes it hard for my cavalry to move around, the Sharpshooters will stay on the top of a hill and pick off the attackers while the footmen and knights support them. This also means that they are less helpless when fighting Khergits because sharpshooters can fire back and ive seen these guys do amazing things with crossbows.

Any feedback?

Why do you not have your NPCs as cavalry? Just curious, but I've always thought it's best to keep them with horses. Better mobility, possibility of couched lances, survivability, etc... Plus, Matheld really can kick some butt on a horse.

 

[DanAngleland]

Rhodok Sharpshooters do tend to perform well in hand to hand combat, and of course do have good ranged capability. Plus for a Swadian lord (if indeed you are a Swadian lord) the Rhodok villages are probably the most accessible due to the fact that Swadia has a long border with Rhodok territory, so as long as you are at peace with them you should have a ready supply of troops. Personally though I, like Gabeed, don't like using these mixed faction armies. I prefer to stick with one faction's troops. Apart from keeping the game a bit more challenging, it's more realistic and I think it looks better on the battlefield to have a consistent troop composition, plus it's easier to get recruits and there's no confusion over whose soldiers are whose (I like to play with the troop names off in battle).

Hmm, I just noticed something strange- Spellcheck doesn't seem to have a problem with 'Rhodok', but 'Swadia' isn't recognised.

 

[Gabeed]

I think you should keep making Swadian Sergeants, because they're **** and die like flies and that amuses me.

Yeah, it is refreshing.  I remember when the bastards used two-handed swords and cut through my .890 Rhodoks with ease.  Fortunately, things change.

 

[LetsBeCivil]

I think you should keep making Swadian Sergeants, because they're **** and die like flies and that amuses me.

Honestly, Nords are the way to go if you want strong, durable infantry.

I've been rebelling against the Nords for quite some time now. I was getting my butt kicked until i starting switching over to a heavy mix of Rhodok Sharpshooters. Even with their high athletics, the nords can't close the distance to the sharpshooters before taking a lot of casualties and damage. At that point, the sharpshooter's half-way-decent melee + held positions are more than enough to make quick work of the survivors.

Against Cavalry factions, I would have to change it up, but that isn't an issue right now.

The sharpshooters really excel in sieging castles. I've been able to whittle down 400 army towns by repeatedly sieging with Rhodok Sharpshooters and having them hold position outside the castle (Nords smile and take the abuse). Any loses I take are replaced quickly with the easily trained sharpshooters.

My Difficulty = Full damage to troops, Full damage to player.

 

[Seekster]

Hmm I i guess ill just stick with Seargents, they actually do perform fairly well, not nearly as good as Nords though. I love the Nords but I havnt played them much recently because like I said im a cavalry person and the Nords not only lack cavalry but the AI is stupid and will charge cavalry with Infantry which usually doesnt end well, plus on the world map cavalry armies seem to move much much faster than foot armies. Dont believe me? Try catching a Khergit army. Those bastards are fast.

 

[Durandal]

Hmm I i guess ill just stick with Seargents, they actually do perform fairly well, not nearly as good as Nords though. I love the Nords but I havnt played them much recently because like I said im a cavalry person and the Nords not only lack cavalry but the AI is stupid and will charge cavalry with Infantry which usually doesnt end well, plus on the world map cavalry armies seem to move much much faster than foot armies. Dont believe me? Try catching a Khergit army. Those bastards are fast.

Yeah, cavalry armies do move faster on the map than infantry armies. One big advantage of playing Khergit.

 

[Kasnar]

im a die hard cavalry member but i suggest Nord Huscarls and Hired blades..

(just cause im a khergit kinda guy doesnt mean i havent tried some others 

 

[your nightmare]

Best infantry ? Nords , only thing , they are SOO hard to train .I usually use swadian sergeants because they aren't that hard to train and there my faction.

Because I'm at war with rhodoks I can't recruit there and I wouldn't want to either and when discussing infantry talking about khergits is as helpfull as having a penis up your ear .

 

[Calanor]

Hmm I i guess ill just stick with Seargents, they actually do perform fairly well, not nearly as good as Nords though. I love the Nords but I havnt played them much recently because like I said im a cavalry person and the Nords not only lack cavalry but the AI is stupid and will charge cavalry with Infantry which usually doesnt end well, plus on the world map cavalry armies seem to move much much faster than foot armies. Dont believe me? Try catching a Khergit army. Those bastards are fast.

Nords is what I'd generally pick if I'd go for infantry. My "Nord" character uses Nord infantry only, with the exception of three Swadian Knights accompanying some of my mounted companions in order to create a diversion (as for myself, I ride to the battlefield and then dismount ). I don't use Nord Hunters/etc either, even though it's possible that they'd be useful - however, I control my foot soldiers constantly by using Hold, Follow, Hold Fire/Fire at Will, and Charge commands. This will do a whole lot of difference, so don't trust the AI in this case. Hold the line until the enemy cavalry gets close enough, then order them to throw their axes/javelins (and it's more than likely that a number of enemy steeds will bite the dust due to this) and then charge when battle is joined. Then regroup when the infantry is spreading out too much and so forth and so on. You need to use the terrain to your advantage as well, if possible - it does work, it is often quite effective and can be a quite rewarding experience.

[Edit] Oh and as a side-note, I am not too keen on mixing cavalry and infantry either. At least not a few foot soldiers mixed in with a whole bunch of cavalrymen. If you want flexibility, I'd say ease down on the cavalry a bit and use them as a shock troop (preferably to the flank) and let your infantry advance while the enemy archers pepper their shields with arrows. Just a few foot soldiers isn't something I'd really recommend.

 

[Master BOB]

I think you should keep making Swadian Sergeants, because they're **** and die like flies and that amuses me.

Honestly, Nords are the way to go if you want strong, durable infantry.

Hah, there we have someone who finally understands the fine details. Really, nothing compares to Nords!
Well, for strength that is.

Against Cavalry factions, I would have to change it up, but that isn't an issue right now.

Thats weird, since my Leo Windblade loves to fight cavalry with his Rhodok army. Seriously, just do the hammer-anvil-tactic and there won't be serious problems. Well, except when fighting against a 5:1 overpowered enemy who leads only Khergit lancers into battle, that is really tricky.

So what do you really seek? If it is really strong and durable infantry the decision is easy: Nords.
If Durability is more important than strength, go for Rhodok Seargants. They can survive almost everything if you know how to use them. If you use terrain, I still suggest Nords, since the even better defence of the Rhodoks does not give you a big advantage over the Huscarls.
If it's ranged infantry you seek, go for Rhodok Sharpshooters. They have good armour, good aim, good damage (both ranged and melee) and not to forget the damn big shield. If there are no bolts left, you practically have heavy armoured infantry.

And for everyone who doesn't know basic infantry tactics, here the hammer and the anvil:
Take the hardest guys you have, preferably Rhodok Seargants, let them mop trogether as close as your tactics skill allows, and put them on an advantegeous position:
[list type=decimal]
[*]short behind the top of a hill: your troops are safe from missiles, since enemy cant's see you. As soon as he can, he has a problem, since you are only feets away
[*]on top of hills: obviously a good choice against cavalry; can be combined with 1.
[*]between trees/rocks: gives minor protection against cavalry and missiles
[*]in a river if the terrain builds natural walls around this river; like 1. but with additional protection against cavalry
[*]If you cannot find any of the above, don't try to find a good place four you. Instead search for places that are disadvantageous for the enemy. Think about the difference.
[/list]

That is your anvil. Something that won't break, no matter how hard you smash it. Have as many prople here as possible, everything that is not part of the hammer. The hammer is build of a small heavy mounted elite force. The kind of guys that let scatter the earth long before they reach enemy troops. I suggest characters for that job, since once they have a decent level, they become killing machines.

Now the battle behaviour. Seek a good position for the anvil, and seek it FAST. You have limited time, especially when fighting against cavalry. If neccessary, order your men to their positions and immediately save them some time by luring the enemy around by yourself. Lead the hammer around a flank. Important: do NOT attack! If you - like me and some others - don't like the "radar system", make sure to watch enemy movements carefully withoud getting their attention to you.
Now wait. Wait for the enemy cavalry to run into your anvil and die. Then wait even more. The enemy archers will start to shoot - ignore them, they won't do much damage (since your anvil has shields and you and the hammer are far away from being in danger). When the enemy is close to your anvil, charge from the flank, or from behind if you managed to get there. You'll need a bit experience to get the right timing, but you'll learn fast. Lead the hammer into the enemy while your anvil is blocking them; and crush them. They won't have much of a chance, even if they outnumbered you by far. As long as you have a real anvil (meaning more than 10 people standing around stupidly), enemy numbers are irrelevant up to really big scales. Of course your 30-men-anvil will not hold against 3000 enemies. But I think you know what I mean.

With that I laugh at Swadians.


EDIT: There is the possibility of softening the anvil by mixing it with missile troops. Rhodok Sharpshooters still make a good defense, but are able to do ranged damage as well (and not that little). Very good against Khergits. Not so good if your 30 Sharpshooters must face 90 Khergit Lancers.

 

[Kasnar]

talking about khergits is as helpfull as having a penis up your ear .

was i talking about khergits? plz quote me....where was i talking about them? i said i was a khergit kinda guy not that i was speaking about units...so shut the **** up and quit trying to act like a smartass.

 

[The Mercenary]

Who needs tactics?

@ Master BOB

I get my elite force of heavy Knights and heavy Infantry, order a full charge, gallop in with lance couched, axe, sword, and shield ready, and smash the crap out of six hundred man war parties.

 

[your nightmare]

talking about khergits is as helpfull as having a penis up your ear .

was i talking about khergits? plz quote me....where was i talking about them? i said i was a khergit kinda guy not that i was speaking about units...so shut the **** up and quit trying to act like a smartass.

If you' d have quoted the entire post , then you would have known that my post had nothing to do with yours .

Best infantry ? Nords , only thing , they are SOO hard to train .I usually use swadian sergeants because they aren't that hard to train and there my faction.

Because I'm at war with rhodoks I can't recruit there and I wouldn't want to either and when discussing infantry talking about khergits is as helpfull as having a penis up your ear .

 

[Cilcain]

My cavalry army is mainly mercenary cavalry (promoted from caravan guards) and Swadian/Vaegir knights with a few sword sisters, the mix comes from the fact that I only recruit from my own villages or from people I rescue or capture, i.e. no mercs hired from taverns and no one recruited from AI-owned villages (and since I'm busy conquering Rhodok territory so far, all of my cavalry comes from captives/rescues).

In rough terrain, I dismount everyone and place them in a good defensive position. If the AI decides to defend, I ride forward and pick them off until they lose patience and attack.

The dismounted cavalry invariably kick seven kinds of sh*t out of any AI force including Nords. It's not as if the Nords bring many Huscarls to battle, mainly they rely on low-order troops. I'm short of missile troops of course, but my companions and main character can plug that hole.

The only thing I rely on infantry for is to take castles and towns.

 

[Master BOB]

I get my elite force of heavy Knights and heavy Infantry, order a full charge, gallop in with lance couched, axe, sword, and shield ready, and smash the crap out of six hundred man war parties.

As far as I remember, we were discussing about using infantry because of hilly terrain. Maybe you can help me - what exactly is the connection to your posting?

But indeed, dismounting is a welcome option for hilly terrain.

 

[The Mercenary]

I get my elite force of heavy Knights and heavy Infantry, order a full charge, gallop in with lance couched, axe, sword, and shield ready, and smash the crap out of six hundred man war parties.

As far as I remember, we were discussing about using infantry because of hilly terrain. Maybe you can help me - what exactly is the connection to your posting?

But indeed, dismounting is a welcome option for hilly terrain.

With infantry, it's the same strategy. Except you're on foot and using a bow and arrows instead of a lance and axe.

 

[LordMutaz]

not even close.

I've tried horse combat and i've tried charging with my men as infantry and I see a massive difference from just using an axe / lance and then using an axe and bow.