Statement regarding Singleplayer IV

[Mallard]

There was a guy over here a couple of days ago demanding that sex scenes be put on the highest priority.

Lotta people, lotta flavors. Cant blend them all together.

Not asking for as new flavor. We're asking them to finish making the ice cream in whatever flavor they want. We just don't want a puddle of cream and a bucket of sugar.

 

[MRay]

In regards to the OOB, do you think we would be able to get categories in the party selection screen?

Probably not. At least not in the current plans.

Party screen selections would conflict and be useless when the player starts an encounter with other allied parties(army encounters, helping other parties on the campaign map etc.) Because compared to before, OoB allows players to control troops coming from other allied parties before the battle starts. That was not the case before.

 

[Lord Grindelvald]

Not asking for as new flavor. We're asking them to finish making the ice cream in whatever flavor they want. We just don't want a puddle of cream and a bucket of sugar.

They're doing just that but the flavour is vanilla. Its -a flavour-. Now, everyone likes vanilla but nobody loves vanilla. We love banana, chocolate, strawberry or sex scenes to be put on the highest priority. But while I love banana and we both like vanilla, you want chocolate. So I go to the mod shop and sprinkle my vanilla ice cream with some banana on top while you do the same with chocolate.

They're gonna finish the game at some point. Will it be tailored? No, its vanilla. Its a good base flavour.

 

[Mallard]

They're doing just that but the flavour is vanilla. Its -a flavour-. Now, everyone likes vanilla but nobody loves vanilla. We love banana, chocolate, strawberry or sex scenes to be put on the highest priority. But while I love banana and we both like vanilla, you want chocolate. So I go to the mod shop and sprinkle my vanilla ice cream with some banana on top while you do the same with chocolate.

They're gonna finish the game at some point. Will it be tailored? No, its vanilla. Its a good base flavour.

That's our point. That's so many peoples point. It's not even complete to what was originally promised. Where is my criminal empire? Where are the characters personalities?

When there's thread upon thread asking for something, it's not a niche flavor.

I'll say it again. Warband mods were so successful because warband itself was great and they were making better an already great game. That is much different than using the free labor of the modding community to finish your game.

There are 15,000 current steam players. Nexus mods Mod Menu (a basic mod to get an idea of how many are modding) has been downloaded 1.3 MILLION times. While the game is STILL IN BETA. Approximately 1/3 of the OWNERS and likely every current player. Thinks the game needs to be modded to be played. While it's still in beta. Your "vanilla" is so bad nobody wants it. Which isn't the case with any of their other games. So it's a purposeful decision on this one.

 

[AxiosXiphos]

That's our point. That's so many peoples point. It's not even complete to what was originally promised. Where is my criminal empire? Where are the characters personalities?

When there's thread upon thread asking for something, it's not a niche flavor.

I'll say it again. Warband mods were so successful because warband itself was great and they were making better an already great game. That is much different than using the free labor of the modding community to finish your game.

There are 15,000 current steam players. Nexus mods Mod Menu (a basic mod to get an idea of how many are modding) has been downloaded 1.3 MILLION times. While the game is STILL IN BETA. Approximately 1/3 of the OWNERS and likely every current player. Thinks the game needs to be modded to be played. While it's still in beta. Your "vanilla" is so bad nobody wants it. Which isn't the case with any of their other games. So it's a purposeful decision on this one.

This assumes that the majority of Warband players didn't mod the game... and they 100% did. In fact of my 1-2k SP playtime on that game; probably 30-40 hours of it would be on vanilla warband. I love warband - but let's not pretend vanilla Warband was perfect and modding wasn't extremely commonplace.

Let's not forget Warband didn't even have battle continuation after K.O....

 

[Mallard]

This assumes that the majority of Warband players didn't mod the game... and they 100% did. In fact of my 1-2k SP playtime on that game; probably 30-40 hours of it would be on vanilla warband. I love warband - but let's not pretend vanilla Warband was perfect and modding wasn't extremely commonplace.

Let's not forget Warband didn't even have battle continuation after K.O.... And those things

AFTER they enjoyed vanilla. To improve an already great game....

Floris had been downloaded 300,000 times. There are 5.6M estimated owners of Warban much less.

 

[AxiosXiphos]

AFTER they enjoyed vanilla. To improve an already great game....

Floris had been downloaded 300,000 times. There are 5.6M estimated owners of Warban much less.

Again you are suggesting that people downloaded bannerlord; played it - didn't like it and THEN decided to search mods out? I'm sure many of the hardcore community members did... but not the majority . Far from. You are also suggesting that a large majority of later warband players were not introduced because of a mod. I've aware of many users who bought the game just to play PoP.

You are making up facts to support your cause...

The only truth of the matter is both games were/are modded heavily. If you must criticise the game - you could suggest that Bannerlord should have done better then relying on it's mods (like Warband did). Because Warband's long life was heavily due to the modding community.

P.S. Floris is but one of many overhaul mods; and is available on multiple platforms.

 

[Mallard]

Again you are suggesting that people downloaded bannerlord; played it - didn't like it and THEN decided to search mods out?

That's the standard process for nearly every body for a new game. Not "new to them new" but a game still in early access.

I'm sure many of the hardcore community members did... but not the majority . Far from

That is a clearly made up or speculative statement.

You are also suggesting that a large majority of later warband players were not introduced because of a mod. I've aware of many users who bought the game just to play PoP.

LATER, when the game was old. When PoP was complete.

You are making up facts to support your cause...

No. My facts come from straight numbers. 1/3 of steam owners of Bannerlord downloaded at least one mod from Nexus. 1/10 of Warband owners downloaded Floris (one of the biggest mods)

The only truth of the matter is both games were/are modded heavily. If you must criticise the game - you could suggest that Bannerlord should have done better then relying on it's mods (like Warband did). Because Warband's long life was heavily due to the modding community.

Bannerlord is a sequel and the most common mods should have been included in the base game. That's the point of sequels. But that's not even one of the biggest complaints.

P.S. Floris is but one of many overhaul mods; and is available on multiple platforms.

Admittedly my "mods download to steam owners" is a sketchy way to correlate players to moded players. But it's one way to visualize. If instead you look at the amount of people who have decided to come up this forum to comment on it. Many, many, many threads detail the SAME basic suggests. Many more gripe about the incomplete feel of the game...

I remember hating lord's Nelag and Knudarr through our multiple play throughs.

I don't want to diminish the fact that they have made this game so moddable in the first place. That's awesome. That means even more, and better, mods like PoP or Brittenwalda (maybe even another VC dlc!!)

Where are the boats? Brittenwalda was such a great mod it spawned VC, but they can't add boats to the base Bannerlord game? Where's my criminal empire? Why can't I ask characters any questions? Where are my feasts? Where's my camp? Where's my fort? Why can't I control my clan members? A bland hard limit on companions instead of them getting along or not? Lifeless companions without storylines?

Edit: I'm sorry of hijacking this thread, when I just meant to get the frustrations of so many people to the front page. I'm, personally, not angry or upset. But disappointed, that a game I've been waiting 10 years for. Isn't even a continuation, or on par with, the game that made me dream for it on the first place.

I will ABSOLUTELY continue to play, and enjoy, the game. Because it's the only game of it's type. We all had such high hopes. Only for them to be routinely crushed. And now I'm downloading 44 mods to hopefully add character to the game.

 

[Bjorn The Dead]

I'm sure many of the hardcore community members did... but not the majority

I've aware of many users who bought the game just to play PoP.

Where is your number or data on that?

You are making up facts to support your cause...

I could make the same argument about you if you are going to say these without any real data.

I do believe, however, the life span of Warband among players is depended on mods. I have played 300 hours vanilla then 300 hours with Diplomacy Litdum.

Right now, we know Bannerlord sold 3 millions copies. Bannerlord have 41.8 millions downloads on Nexus. This number is not unique downloads but still it is 14 times bigger than 3 million. If we sort the mods with respect to unique downloads, we could see Harmony has 538,081 unique downloads. (538081/3000000)*100 makes 17,94% of the player base. Admittedly, there are considerable amount of mods out there depended on Harmony, that is one of the reason it has most unique downloads. But also there are lots of mods which does not. So just one mod has 17,94% of the player base.

I'm sure many of the hardcore community members did... but not the majority . Far from.

So the information above is making your statement here doubtful.

 

[AxiosXiphos]

That's the standard process for nearly every body for a new game. Not "new to them new" but a game still in early access.


That is a clearly made up or speculative statement.



LATER, when the game was old. When PoP was complete.

No. My facts come from straight numbers. 1/3 of steam owners of Bannerlord downloaded at least one mod from Nexus. 1/10 of Warband owners downloaded Floris (one of the biggest mods)

Bannerlord is a sequel and the most common mods should have been included in the base game. That's the point of sequels. But that's not even one of the biggest complaints.


Admittedly my "mods download to steam owners" is a sketchy way to correlate players to moded players. But it's one way to visualize.

That's a terrible comparison and you acknowledge this...

And again I'm not seeing what this conversation is trying to achieve? The vast majority of players of Warband; played the vast majority of their hours on modded games. That adds nothing to the conversation.

I might install a Cosmetic pack to bannerlord - that neither proves nor denies any quality of the existing content.

Basically - this argument doesn't add any context or value to the conversation beyond conjecture. Both games will have a large modding community; the popularity of this does nothing to diminish either game.

Floris, Diplomacy, PoP etc were all amazing mods that added much value to Warband; their existence does not mean Warband was a worse game. You would be better off sticking to more traditional measures (Reviews, PlayerCounts, SteamScore etc) as these give a much better indication of community opinion.

 

[Mallard]

That's a terrible comparison and you acknowledge this...

I said it's not the best comparison, but it's what we have.

And again I'm not seeing what this conversation is trying to achieve?

Are you willfully blind? I've said it multiple times. The game is incomplete, there are many suggestions to compete it. But they are ignored, and their future plans are also incomplete. There is a huge plethora of threads with common suggestions that aren't address, which we are told means they are being ignored and won't be added. It's morally objectionable to leave the completion of the game to the free labor of modders.

The vast majority of players of Warband; played the vast majority of their hours on modded games.

Not verifiably true as we have all admitted.

That adds nothing to the conversation.

It's the crux of the conversation? If these mods were so important to Warband, the basics of those mods should be included in the sequel.

I might install a Cosmetic pack to bannerlord - that neither proves nor denies any quality of the existing content.

THAT'S EVEN WORSE.. It's a new modern game, if anything their graphics should be the BASIC simplest and best of any.

Basically - this argument doesn't add any context or value to the conversation beyond conjecture.

No, there are so many threads with suggestions to complete the game. The game isn't complete.

Both games will have a large modding community; the popularity of this does nothing to diminish either game.

Absolutely not. The mods improve the game. And in the case of Warband give it new life.

Floris, Diplomacy, PoP etc were all amazing mods that added much value to Warband; their existence does not mean Warband was a worse game.

Nobody says warband is a worse game. We're saying it's an amazing game made BETTER by mods. Bannerlord is currently, and planned to be, an incomplete game that Taleworlds is basically forcing the free labor of the modding community to complete. I want a new warband. Everyone wants a new Warband. What we got is an incomplete mod engine, that changes so little so often the mods can't even keep up to complete it. And when a huge list from many people with multiple crossovers is suggested, it's ignored.

 

[AxiosXiphos]

I said it's not the best comparison, but it's what we have.

Are you willfully blind? I've said it multiple times. The game is incomplete, there are many suggestions to compete it. But they are ignored, and their future plans are also incomplete. There is a huge plethora of threads with common suggestions that aren't address, which we are told means they are being ignored and won't be added. It's morally objectionable to leave the completion of the game to the free labor of modders.

Not verifiably true as we have all admitted.

It's the crux of the conversation? If these mods were so important to Warband, the basics of those mods should be included in the sequel.

THAT'S EVEN WORSE.. It's a new modern game, if anything their graphics should be the BASIC simplest and best of any.

No, there are so many threads with suggestions to complete the game. The game isn't complete.

Absolutely not. The mods improve the game. And in the case of Warband give it new life.

Nobody says warband is a worse game. We're saying it's an amazing game made BETTER by mods. Bannerlord is currently, and planned to be, an incomplete game that Taleworlds is basically forcing the free labor of the modding community to complete. I want a new warband. Everyone wants a new Warband. What we got is an incomplete mod engine, that changes so little so often the mods can't even keep up to complete it. And when a huge list from many people with multiple crossovers is suggested, it's ignored.

It has become clear that really all you want to do is complain about Bannerlord... I don't have any wish to take part in that conversation.

 

[Mallard]

It has become clear that really all you want to do is complain about Bannerlord... I don't have any wish to take part in that conversation.

No, you don't like what I have to say so you are writing me off.

Bannerlord is incomplete.

Where are the boats? Brittenwalda was such a great mod it spawned VC, but they can't add boats to the base Bannerlord game? Where's my criminal empire? Why can't I ask characters any questions? Where are my feasts? Where's my camp? Where's my fort? Why can't I control my clan members? A bland hard limit on companions instead of them getting along or not? Lifeless companions without storylines?

 

[AxiosXiphos]

No, you don't like what I have to say so you are writing me off.

Bannerlord is incomplete.

Where are the boats? Brittenwalda was such a great mod it spawned VC, but they can't add boats to the base Bannerlord game? Where's my criminal empire? Why can't I ask characters any questions? Where are my feasts? Where's my camp? Where's my fort? Why can't I control my clan members? A bland hard limit on companions instead of them getting along or not? Lifeless companions without storylines?

I'm not here to answer your complaints; nor care to. I was interested in speaking about the mod figures - you quickly moved off that. Our conversation is done. There are many other users here that will provide you a suitable echo chamber.

 

[Mallard]

This assumes that the majority of Warband players didn't mod the game... and they 100% did. In fact of my 1-2k SP playtime on that game; probably 30-40 hours of it would be on vanilla warband. I love warband - but let's not pretend vanilla Warband was perfect and modding wasn't extremely commonplace.

Let's not forget Warband didn't even have battle continuation after K.O....

I'm not here to answer your complaints; nor care to. I was interested in speaking about the mod figures - you quickly moved off that. Our conversation is done. There are many other users here that will provide you a suitable echo chamber.

The mod figures were brought up to talk about the game being incomplete. If you're talking about them, you're talking about the game being incomplete.

I don't want an echo chamber. I want to know why Taleworlds is making an incomplete game. Everyone wants to know why it's incomplete. Why are you being so obstinate about this?

Is the game incomplete? Yes, nearly everyone agrees. Using mods to complete the game is morally objectionable, and isn't a solution. Wasn't done in Warband. Why is it done here?

Why is that not being address while the game is still in EA?

Why are the long lists of suggestions, which are all almost identical, not being added to the game to make it complete? Why are the things promised to us not being added?

 

[AxiosXiphos]

The mod figures were brought up to talk about the game being incomplete. If you're talking about them, you're talking about the game being incomplete.

I don't want an echo chamber. I want to know why Taleworlds is making an incomplete game. Everyone wants to know why it's incomplete. Why are you being so obstinate about this?

Is the game incomplete? Yes, nearly everyone agrees. Using mods to complete the game is morally objectionable, and isn't a solution. Wasn't done in Warband. Why is it done here?

Why is that not being address while the game is still in EA?

Why are the long lists of suggestions, which are all almost identical, not being added to the game to make it complete? Why are the things promised to us not being added?

....Has all been discussed to death; and I have no further wish to talk about it here. Nothing I say will change your mind - so what's even the point of the conversation?

Once again - I'm not here to provide you an outlet. I really don't care what you think about the game.

 

[Mallard]

....Has all been discussed to death; and I have no further wish to talk about it here. Nothing I say will change your mind - so what's even the point of the conversation?

Because I hope we come to a conclusion on where the game needs additions? Or where it is complete and I'm projecting desires. I'm sure the truth lies somewhere between me and you. It's great, more than great, that they focused so heavily on moddability. That's like. #1 requirement of the sequel (after it being complete)

Once again - I'm not here to provide you an outlet. I really don't care what you think about the game.

Then why did you engage in conversation to begin?

 

[Consul_Kaiser]

Where is your number or data on that?

I could make the same argument about you if you are going to say these without any real data.

I do believe, however, the life span of Warband among players is depended on mods. I have played 300 hours vanilla then 300 hours with Diplomacy Litdum.

Right now, we know Bannerlord sold 3 millions copies. Bannerlord have 41.8 millions downloads on Nexus. This number is not unique downloads but still it is 14 times bigger than 3 million. If we sort the mods with respect to unique downloads, we could see Harmony has 538,081 unique downloads. (538081/3000000)*100 makes 17,94% of the player base. Admittedly, there are considerable amount of mods out there depended on Harmony, that is one of the reason it has most unique downloads. But also there are lots of mods which does not. So just one mod has 17,94% of the player base.

So the information above is making your statement here doubtful.

Without mods this game would be the most lackluster game ever. That is a fact

 

[Consul_Kaiser]

Probably not. At least not in the current plans.

Party screen selections would conflict and be useless when the player starts an encounter with other allied parties(army encounters, helping other parties on the campaign map etc.) Because compared to before, OoB allows players to control troops coming from other allied parties before the battle starts. That was not the case before.

So then how would we separate skirmishers (primarily javelin throwers) from those like the imperial legionary (throws pila as secondary) and the sturgian top tier infantry who throws an axe.

The OOB does not distinguish between the two so how would this be possible?

 

[Ananda_The_Destroyer]

So then how would we separate skirmishers (primarily javelin throwers) from those like the imperial legionary (throws pila as secondary) and the sturgian top tier infantry who throws an axe.

>>>from those like the imperial legionary (throws pila as secondary)
> legionary (throws)
How do we break the news to you......
But this is a concern. For now you might try marking the helmet icon on one infantry group and sliding hopefully the heavy axemen into it, leaving the less armored skirmishers in the other. However I admit I don't know if this works (infantry lol) or exactly how sensitive it is to armor differences.