Most overpowered/underpowered weapon in Warband (Multiplayer)

[The Bowman]

Just saw some people sying that the Great lance is overpowered. I'd say no, they are slow enough and with its weight it can kill someone very easy (IRL). Also, when you are stuck somewhere, evemy infantry get you easy and + I say again it is very slow, you can't kill the entire enemy team with such low rate of use.

Overpowered: Great Axes.
Underpowered: Swords.

 

[Tancred_de_Houdan]

agree with shields
Overpowered: Huscarl shield, c'mon, Mike Loades demonstrated how easily shields brake!

The lenticular shield he used took would require three times the force of his strike to break. No prizes for guessing what a huscarl shield is.

Also, you want shields to break even faster? Really?

I might've spoken too hastily, but atleast it could bend and wobble... the thing is human factor, if you're struck hard enough you'd be more likely to drop the shield (if it's held by a boss-handle not the enarmes as in MB)

 

[Ronan]

The great long axe and the great long bardiche are the most overpowered weapons imo. They eat through shields really fast, have a lot of reach and are quite fast. This  means that it is sometimes possible to break your opponents shield before he can even retaliate. Now of course there's manual blocking, but even there the 2H weapons have incredible advantage because of the reach and damage. Even more importantly it is really easy to spam, but consistent manual blocking -which is usually needed to beat the spammer- is quite hard.

 

[Bloodsent]

The only weapons I currently have a problem with are the 2H swords and the Pike. The former, because it's hard to see where the sword is going. There's very little return animation (ESPECIALLY on the thrust), and so even when an opponent feints, it looks like they're continuing their swing, as opposed to other weapons which have a suitable return animation. The end effect is that, especially when they face hug you, it's very difficult to see where the swing on the giant sword is coming from, which seems a bit...Odd. Also, because it can thrust at point blank.

The pike I have a problem with because it's supposed to be the infantry's answer to the great lance. But it sucks, hard, in every way possible. The great lance's primary weakness is supposed to be its slowness, but I have found it to be the greatlance's greatest asset. You have no idea how many kills I have racked up on a greatlance because its active time is so very long. Yeah, it's slow, but that just means I have less reflex attack. If I'm using the greatlance correctly, I'm charging over open territory. Its long active time means that I'll have the greatlance active and deadly long before an enemy spearman has even chambered his attack, and he'll be dead even if he does attack correctly, because the slowness of the greatlance guarantees that when I time it correctly, I have a half second of fully extended death.

Conversely, infantry have no answers to this. Combined with the fact that 2h-polearms have garbage range, they also have faster attacks, which is awful for dealing with cav and their slow, long attacks. The single best anti-cav weapon is a bamboo spear paired with a shield (Though the long awlpike seems to have a longer range than its stats imply).

 

[Hamel]

For real? One handed axes are tough but I wouldn't call them overpowered. Almost any two-hander has the advantage against them.

We're discussing about whether Rock is OP because some people think it can beat other Rocks.

Interesting. What else are we discussing?

By my reckoning, we're discussing the relative strengths and weaknesses of each weapon (factoring cost etc. into the equation). I'd say the fact that one handed axes struggle to hold their own, against anyone with a two hander, is a pretty big weakness. Granted, they have the advantage when playing aganst shieldmongers that can't use the kick button but other than that, I don't see how they're overpowered. Certainly, at clan level, it doesn't seem so.

...Read what I said again. Also, I like how you quoted a section of the irrelevant clarification of my analogy, whilst ignoring the analogy itself.

Let me explain. The mocking usage of "Rock isn't OP because Paper beats it!" was to point out the flawed logic you were using. You were effectively stating that one-handed axes weren't overpowered because two-handed weapons have an advantage over them when the user has room to maneuver (like other one-handed weapons). When balancing something, you should compare it to items of a similar nature, instead of comparing it to something completely foreign.

In short: Just because one-handed axes share a weakness with many other one-handed weapons does not mean that it is on completely even terms with its peers.

(There may be some grammatical errors in this post, due to the writer not being particularly proficient with laptops.)

Edit:

Just saw some people sying that the Great lance is overpowered. I'd say no, they are slow enough and with its weight it can kill someone very easy (IRL). Also, when you are stuck somewhere, evemy infantry get you easy and + I say again it is very slow, you can't kill the entire enemy team with such low rate of use.

The idea with cavalry is not to be within the range of your enemies when they could hit you. So if someone is "stuck somewhere", or if they're in range of an enemy while they are in between stabs (slow RoF, as you said), they're doing it wrong. And with a great lance, it's easier than ever to stay out of your enemy's reach.

Also: OH WOW, you can't kill the entire enemy team with it!? Well, it must not be overpowered then! Ironically though, your statement is incorrect. I've seen many a time where someone managed to defeat an entire team with a great lance.

 

[HJKL]

I can't think of a weapon without a disadvantage or counter, really. I was going to say the great lance but two of the best cavalry players I know have told me they rarely bother with it even when they have the money because of how cumbersome it is at close range and its users have the same weakness to pikes and archers that all other cavalry do. I would probably have said the spiked staff too but only in 1v1 scenarios which aren't really important, and that was before it got toned down.

 

[The Bowman]

For real? One handed axes are tough but I wouldn't call them overpowered. Almost any two-hander has the advantage against them.

We're discussing about whether Rock is OP because some people think it can beat other Rocks.

Interesting. What else are we discussing?

By my reckoning, we're discussing the relative strengths and weaknesses of each weapon (factoring cost etc. into the equation). I'd say the fact that one handed axes struggle to hold their own, against anyone with a two hander, is a pretty big weakness. Granted, they have the advantage when playing aganst shieldmongers that can't use the kick button but other than that, I don't see how they're overpowered. Certainly, at clan level, it doesn't seem so.

...Read what I said again. Also, I like how you quoted a section of the irrelevant clarification of my analogy, whilst ignoring the analogy itself.

Let me explain. The mocking usage of "Rock isn't OP because Paper beats it!" was to point out the flawed logic you were using. You were effectively stating that one-handed axes weren't overpowered because two-handed weapons have an advantage over them when the user has room to maneuver (like other one-handed weapons). When balancing something, you should compare it to items of a similar nature, instead of comparing it to something completely foreign.

In short: Just because one-handed axes share a weakness with many other one-handed weapons does not mean that it is on completely even terms with its peers.

(There may be some grammatical errors in this post, due to the writer not being particularly proficient with laptops.)

Edit:

Just saw some people sying that the Great lance is overpowered. I'd say no, they are slow enough and with its weight it can kill someone very easy (IRL). Also, when you are stuck somewhere, evemy infantry get you easy and + I say again it is very slow, you can't kill the entire enemy team with such low rate of use.

The idea with cavalry is not to be within the range of your enemies when they could hit you. So if someone is "stuck somewhere", or if they're in range of an enemy while they are in between stabs (slow RoF, as you said), they're doing it wrong. And with a great lance, it's easier than ever to stay out of your enemy's reach.

Also: OH WOW, you can't kill the entire enemy team with it!? Well, it must not be overpowered then! Ironically though, your statement is incorrect. I've seen many a time where someone managed to defeat an entire team with a great lance.

I didn't saw. But nerfed, it will become useless.

 

[Bloodsent]

It doesn't need to be nerfed. Other weapons (Pikes) need to be brought up to speed to be useful against it.

 

[Hamel]

I didn't saw. But nerfed, it will become useless.

The key is figuring out a way to nerf it while keeping it useful. Maybe remove its thrust, but make couching generally more viable?

It doesn't need to be nerfed. Other weapons (Pikes) need to be brought up to speed to be useful against it.

Pikes already work great. The great lance is really only overpowered against other cavalry, which cannot use pikes.

 

[Frosty]

Overpowered: Rhodok Great hammer or w/e its called
Underpowered: One handed swords

 

[shades_o_grey]

Honestly, I don't think anyone's target will get nerfed in reply to this thread. This thread is about opinions, and everyone knows the classic saying about opinions. Now that that is off my chest, I absolutely hate the huscarl shield, unless I have one (yes, I'm honest about it) . It's uber strong. But remember that it still has no effect on their fighting, as strong as it is, it doesn't save them when they fall for a feint.

 

[Archonsod]

The great long axe and the great long bardiche are the most overpowered weapons imo. They eat through shields really fast, have a lot of reach and are quite fast. This  means that it is sometimes possible to break your opponents shield before he can even retaliate. Now of course there's manual blocking, but even there the 2H weapons have incredible advantage because of the reach and damage. Even more importantly it is really easy to spam, but consistent manual blocking -which is usually needed to beat the spammer- is quite hard.

Manual blocking is somewhat easier against two handed weapons because they telegraph the attack so well. The advantages tend to be dependent on the mode and the map though. Two handers are buggers to use in confined areas because you're usually limited in the attack directions thanks to the walls. Reach is also a non-issue in a team based mode, your opponent can just block until his team mate gets in behind you.

Although it really applies to all weapons. Some weapons can be incredibly useful against certain opponents, in certain modes or on certain maps, and completely useless on others.

 

[Draygo]

Overpowered: Arrow flight distance and accuracy (All bows), arrow cost (free! :/, calv have to buy their horses, even the default one, make arrows not free but reasonable.) In addition infantry/calv have to spend a decent amount of money purchasing weapons/shields archers only really have to buy a bow and can often stick with a free offhand allowing them to buy the highest level armors sooner.

Underpowered: Gravity and wind (vs all projectiles) Shoot a bow in real life and see how far it goes, compare to ingame. I haven't found a map yet where i can't stand at one corner and shoot past the opposite corner. By making gravity more powerful it also opens up the option for archers to shoot at the above 45 degree mark to try to fling one in the air then shoot your next lower to try to have both arrows hit at nearly the same time. 

Also there is never wind in M&B So you can count on your arrow falling at or below your recticule every time you shoot. 


1h swords are fine, often solid fients get you past shields, and their range is decent allowing you to get in some suprise hits on people who think they are just out of range. If you think 2h swords should be 'unbalanced' you would just be wrong. Most 2h swords have their center of mass located slightly above the guard, making them a rather balanced weapon. Axes should be unbalanced in 2h mode due to the fact that there is no counterwieght pushing their center of mass way up the shaft. If a counterweight was added to the model than the weapon being balanced could be justified.

 

[Archonsod]

Also there is never wind in M&B So you can count on your arrow falling at or below your recticule every time you shoot. 

Trajectory is randomised. If you're shooting long distance you can't even count on your arrow being within a few feet of the reticule, let alone falling at it.

As for the rest, cavalry don't have to buy a horse, they've got similar (in some cases identical) stats to infantry so they can fight just as effectively on foot. Shields too are not mandatory, some players prefer not to bother thanks to the 25% speed penalty they inflict.
In armour terms, archers have the worst selection in the game, with their top armours usually being the low - mid of the infantry or cavalry selections. Hand weapons are variable, the Nords and the Rhodocks get some good choices in their weapon selection, while for the Swadians the only difference between their free sword and the top sword is a couple of points of reach and around two points in damage, with slightly less speed to boot.

Then of course is the issue of infantry and cavalry having one hit kill weapons, while an archer can stick four arrows into his target and still see them walk away.

 

[Halcyon]

all axes, 1h and 2h. Weapon speed is simply too fast. For 2h axes +/- 95 is way too much when combined with 130+ 2h proficiency. 1h and 2h axes connect faster because of the shape, for 1h axes 98 speed is too much when the shape is not accounted for. Still, even with turn limitation rarely get glancing blows.

Underpowered: hafted maces (vaegir) 24b dmg and absolutely no knockdown.
                          1h maces still underpowered.

 

[Oyipggy]

The last time I played this game, 2H swords were unstoppable. Now it seems that only when a good player uses them, they are. I still have a problem with a 2H swinging faster than a 1H sword though. Most 1H weapons actually, not axes though.

 

[Skyrage]

This thread may be indeed about opinions, but then again, if enough people have the same opinion about a specific item then that's a sign that maybe something should be tweaked a bit. And so far the answers have been pretty clear when it comes to the longbow and the hafted maces being generally underpowered.

It's harder to pick out anything specific that people think is overpowered though. Everyone's got their playstyle and preferences. I myself am an avid hammer/pike lover who think that these weapons have more than enough weaknesses to compensate for their major advantages, but that's me anyway. As for overpowered weapons, I want to see the 2h axes getting an unba-tag slapped on them cause they should operate on a similar principle as the sledgehammers; lots of mass at the end of a long stick, maybe not as much, but on the other hand the longer stick more than makes up for it. Currently it's a swinghappy weapon with tremendous damage which is more or less unchanged across it's entire length (aka razor-stick) and to boot it's got different modes as well, giving it even more versatility. Top it all off with the shieldbonus. Bit too many advantages slapped on this weapon and no real disadvantages apart from being two-handed. Versatility should be a trait of swords, not axes who should only be about power and shieldbusting. Vaegir glaives may need a similar treatment, though these weapons are not really as strong as the axes as well as the fact that the headpiece is spread out a lot more across the stick, sort of mixing the sword and axe attributes into one.

As for spears used with two hands, they still need to have their damage seriously reduced. Say what you want about blunt sticks, but 3 hits whilst in full armor is still pretty ridiculous. Spears are pokey weapons, not bashing weapons.

Hafted maces should perhaps also end up with the same tag if they don't have it already, but on the other hand the maces do need a boost as well. I can agree with the longbow somewhat, but didn't it have a pretty nice range bonus compared to the shortbow? I am pretty certain that it was much easier to get relatively accurate long distance shots off with a longbow.

 

[doomsayer]

As for spears used with two hands, they still need to have their damage seriously reduced. Say what you want about blunt sticks, but 3 hits whilst in full armor is still pretty ridiculous. Spears are pokey weapons, not bashing weapons.

But as long as stabs are limited to one direction that can be indefinitely blocked by putting something on your mouse button and going for a smoke and easily chambered the other attacks need to be useful. Besides the spear is afaik the twohander that's worst against heavy armor when it comes to damage.

 

[guilemaster]

The last time I played this game, 2H swords were unstoppable. Now it seems that only when a good player uses them, they are. I still have a problem with a 2H swinging faster than a 1H sword though. Most 1H weapons actually, not axes though.

Why is there a problem with 2h swords swinging faster than 1 handed swords? Both are balanced weapons and the addition of a second hand ought to make your blows faster, not to mention more accurate. I've always marveled at that idea. It makes sense the way it is. Maybe not so much for weapons like the great long axe or the maces but for the swords, it's good.

 

[Skyrage]

As for spears used with two hands, they still need to have their damage seriously reduced. Say what you want about blunt sticks, but 3 hits whilst in full armor is still pretty ridiculous. Spears are pokey weapons, not bashing weapons.

But as long as stabs are limited to one direction that can be indefinitely blocked by putting something on your mouse button and going for a smoke and easily chambered the other attacks need to be useful. Besides the spear is afaik the twohander that's worst against heavy armor when it comes to damage.

Well, spears are generally a group weapon - even if it has one attack direction if used with a shield, it's still a weapon which will stop any player dead in his tracks if that player is alone, facing off a couple or more spearmen. And I would disagree with the damage as well. Good hits (being piercing) will deal a decent amount of damage. Granted, it is rather easy to get some really crappy hits as well, but that is why you have to keep your distance - hugging with the spear is just suicide. Just that once it is used with two hands it becomes a pretty ridiculous weapon and is probably the only weapon in the game which ends up going way outside it's intended role.