MP Modern Iron Europe - WWI Mod (RELEASED)

[Patchouli Knowledge]

They did, but they put up a pretty stiff resistance, and in doing so bought the French a good deal of time to prepare for the German invasion.

The French would have been in a very bad position had the Belgians simply allowed to the Germans to march through the country unopposed, as they Germans had hoped they would.

That said, there's almost no justification to include Belgium in a game set in 1917.

 

[N3XuS]

They did, but they put up a pretty stiff resistance, and in doing so bought the French a good deal of time to prepare for the German invasion.

The French would have been in a very bad position had the Belgians simply allowed to the Germans to march through the country unopposed, as they Germans had hoped they would.

That said, there's almost no justification to include Belgium in a game set in 1917.

It would have been like WW2 if they werent there and if fast tanks were already existing.

 

[Rigadoon]

Hello! Since Update 15 is taking quite a bit of time, I decided to release this little preview. You may see more of these in the future and they'll be bundled up into the full Update 15. Hopefully, that will mean more frequent updates for you guys to enjoy. Here is the M1915 Bluse modeled and textured by myself. This is what most of the German soldiers will be wearing. It was introduced in late 1915 and was similar to the older 1910 tunic, but was much less visible due to the lack of piping and hidden buttons.

In the next few weeks you can expect more Update 15 previews showing the M15 Greatcoat, various hats and boots, and the 1910 tunic(and simplified version), which, while outdated, was still used quite frequently.

 

[Mandible]

Looks good.

 

[Windbusche]

Gorgeous!

 

[Patchouli Knowledge]

The colour of Feldgrau varied significantly, but it was never straight grey like that. It was usually a brownish green colour on troopers' uniforms, and slightly bluer for higher quality officers' coats.

I've probably linked this before, but see here.

The trousers should be darker and bluer than the blouse, as well. Only Bavarians wore Feldgrau trousers, and even then only for a time.

 

[Rigadoon]

The colour of Feldgrau varied significantly, but it was never straight grey like that. It was usually a brownish green colour on troopers' uniforms, and slightly bluer for higher quality officers' coats.

I've probably linked this before, but see here.

The trousers should be darker and bluer than the blouse, as well. Only Bavarians wore Feldgrau trousers, and even then only for a time.

Thanks for the info Docm!

 

[Duke Daniel Milutin]

It would probably be better to bump the sleeves like the landwehr or freikorps have in NW. As it seems to be same kind of sleeves if compared to pictures of m1915.

 

[Bluehawk]

Here's a good contemporary postcard that demonstrates a cross-section of hues, all Feldgrau.

Spoiler

 

[DoloxoB]

When this mod out?

 

[romicus]

When its ready for a realease. Also, don't ask such questions, the modders usualy don't know either.

 

[Skot the Sanguine]

The trousers should be darker and bluer than the blouse, as well. Only Bavarians wore Feldgrau trousers, and even then only for a time.

Incorrect.  Feldgrau was commonly used for trousers.  You are, however, right about the shade of Feldgrau being different.  It is really a green-grey as seen in below's picture.  Also, mind that the collars in the M1915 tunic are dark green.  This was not the case for the M1910 and M1910 Simplified tunics which had feldgrau collars as well.

If you want a closeup of the color I will photograph my tunic and send you it.

Spoiler

 

[Patchouli Knowledge]

Perhaps you're right about it being worn, but I'm pretty sure regulations specify Grau and not Feldgrau for the trousers, except in the case of the Bavarians.

That said, I realise regulations were rarely followed closely.

 

[Skot the Sanguine]

If you look at photographs of good quality closely the shades are typically the same for both the tunic and trousers.  Although that doesn't confirm it in itself, typically when these are "colorized" either for photos or in video (such as the World War I in color series) you can see that most often they are of the same color.  Many original examples are also of the color, and from units that are not Bavarian.  Whether or not the regulation called for the darker shade of grey I don't know, as I have never seen a copy of it, but in practice it wasn't the case.  Interestingly, what I have seen Bavarians wear sometimes were corduroy trousers, but not common enough to bother placing in the game, in my opinion.

Edit:  I do want to clarify that the grey you are referring to, typically called stone grey in English, was commonly used as well.  So both stone grey and field grey were used often.

 

[Patchouli Knowledge]

It's just that almost every illustration I've ever seen shows the post-1916 Germans in bluish grey trousers. Knötel, for example. That example was done by an artist working in 1930's Germany who probably had access to official documents and surviving examples.

It seems to me that no one can actually say what the ratio of Grau to Feldgrau was. It's just my understanding that plain Grau was regulation, so I'd go with that for the mod. I'm no expert, though.

Also, judging by the huge variations in Feldgrau, we may both be saying the same thing. It may have just been that the Feldgrau used for trousers was of the bluish sort, as opposed to the brown or green kinds.

 

[asagek]

When its ready for a realease. Also, don't ask such questions, the modders usualy don't know either.

wy asking euronymous remember me he its timo

 

[Skot the Sanguine]

It's just that almost every illustration I've ever seen shows the post-1916 Germans in bluish grey trousers. Knötel, for example. That example was done by an artist working in 1930's Germany who probably had access to official documents and surviving examples.

Also, judging by the huge variations in Feldgrau, we may both be saying the same thing. It may have just been that the Feldgrau used for trousers was of the bluish sort, as opposed to the brown or green kinds.

Honestly, from what I have seen there isn't really a huge variation in Feldgrau.  What often happens is either that modern photos improperly show its color due to the sensitivity to lighting or that old examples have faded with time.  For example, my own tunic and trousers can look rather different based on what the lighting situation is and varies from a yellowish green to a grey color based on lighting conditions.  However, it is definitely of the same green-grey mix rather well shown in the photo I linked on the last post.  Another issue is that some people use a survey of modern reproduction uniforms or reenactors to get a feel for the shade of the material, but as we all know not all modern manufacturers are as stringent in their historical accuracy as others.

Do you have any sources stating they were produced in a wide variety of shades?  It would be interesting to read that, as from what I have seen the material itself is relative standard (ignoring some possible variations from privately tailored uniforms that were popular just before and in the early part of the war, especially by officers).

As for the illustrations, although useful they can often be biased by the illustrator.  For example, Knötel might have liked the way the stone grey trousers looked and preferred to illustrate German soldiers in them.  Photographic evidence would be better in getting a feel for how common either were.  Unfortunately it is hard to really be certain of these ratios as opposed to the ratios of tunic types I reported to Rigadoon because these can only be distinguished via shade, which isn't easy in old black and white photos whereas the tunics are easy to recognize if you know what to look for.

Finally, Feldgrau never had a bluish hue, but the deep grey of stone grey sometimes did have a bluish hue.

 

[Patchouli Knowledge]

Just look at the caps shown here. They're all photographed under the same conditions and the colour varies significantly. I've seen quite a few surviving uniforms and they range from straight grey to very green to brown. Sometimes they even have a slight blue tinge.

It's just that almost every illustration I've ever seen shows the post-1916 Germans in bluish grey trousers. Knötel, for example. That example was done by an artist working in 1930's Germany who probably had access to official documents and surviving examples.

Also, judging by the huge variations in Feldgrau, we may both be saying the same thing. It may have just been that the Feldgrau used for trousers was of the bluish sort, as opposed to the brown or green kinds.

...Knötel might have liked the way the stone grey trousers looked and preferred to illustrate German soldiers in them.

That's just not something respected military illustrators do. They make errors based on lack of knowledge or misinformation, but to suggest they make inaccuracies intentionally is pretty baseless unless you can prove otherwise.

 

[Bluehawk]

The plate isn't even by Knötel, whom died in 1914, but by Georg Schäfer.

According to these reenactors, "The wool trousers introduced with the 1907 field uniform were made of Feldgrau wool. They had slanting side pockets, a watch pocket, a strap at the back with a buckle to adjust the fit, and 4mm red wool piping down the outside seams. The trousers were worn tucked into the boots with the field uniform, and ironed creases were strictly forbidden.

It soon became clear that it was almost impossible to match the colors of tunic and trousers. Different batches of dye, and the varied amount of wear meant that there was soon a large variety of shades of Feldgrau spoiling the homogenous look of the army. In August 1914, a new universal grey cloth, Steingrau, was introduced for the trousers, which contrasted with the Feldgrau of the tunic and on September 21 1915, by Army order, the Steingrau trousers were authorized for wear with both the field uniform. Actually procuring the grey trousers turned out to be quite difficult as dealers could not supply large quantities of grey wool. By the end of 1917, trousers were again being made in Feldgrau with and without the red piping."

I can't presently be bothered to follow up those dates with better source.

 

[Patchouli Knowledge]

Ah, I thought the plate was by Herbert Knötel (not Richard). Didn't bother to look at the signature.

Anyway, what you say agrees with my opinion that the trousers shouldn't be Feldgrau in the mod.