Heavy Cav Has No Impact

[MojoJojoGR]

Sending my 50 imperial elite cataphracts over a group of infantry doesn't seem to do anything at any angle i send them in (usually from behind). So now i just let them charge on their own, which results in them just scattering around the battlefield and fighting solo at which point they just become infantry on horses. Heavy cav should be used to strategically trample over the enemy, as of now it doesn't seem to work.

 

[King Yngvar]

Horses are still OP. Horses don't stop up or die by running into spears as of now, you're not supposed to just charge into infantry unless they are peasant tier rabble. Formations aren't working properly in this game, it is still better to just click everyone charge and a disorganized group of cavalry will easily plow through a wall of shields and spears.

 

[YariAshigaru]

Horses are still OP. Horses don't stop up or die by running into spears as of now, you're not supposed to just charge into infantry unless they are peasant tier rabble. Formations aren't working properly in this game, it is still better to just click everyone charge and a disorganized group of cavalry will easily plow through a wall of shields and spears.

Well they do but the AI normally never gets a chance to stab at the front of the horse because they either have their swords out for whatever reason or they dont manage to get a stab in becuz the thrust speed is so bad for most spears.

The AI just cant even pick 1 target to focus on their too busy switching targets every second.

 

[YariAshigaru]

Sending my 50 imperial elite cataphracts over a group of infantry doesn't seem to do anything at any angle i send them in (usually from behind). So now i just let them charge on their own, which results in them just scattering around the battlefield and fighting solo at which point they just become infantry on horses. Heavy cav should be used to strategically trample over the enemy, as of now it doesn't seem to work.

Most of the horses the soldiers are using have low charge damage so at most their doing like 5 dmg when they smash their horse into someone.

 

[Clsy]

Most of the horses the soldiers are using have low charge damage so at most their doing like 5 dmg when they smash their horse into someone.

5000 pounds or 2500kgs of pressure hitting you? i will say it would only deal 7 damage at most tbh

 

[Pandajacket]

Try the delegate command to let the better AI take over then call them back when you are ready to pull out.

 

[YariAshigaru]

5000 pounds or 2500kgs of pressure hitting you? i will say it would only deal 7 damage at most tbh

yeaaah hahaha the horses with high charge dmg exist in the game but i dont know which unit uses them so far none ive seen. nice kaguya avatar

 

[hruza]

Sending my 50 imperial elite cataphracts over a group of infantry doesn't seem to do anything...

What do you mean "sending in"? You need to tell them to charge.
So far cavalry it totally OP, as infantry isn't able to stop them.

 

[Maximum997]

Cavalry is kinda OP becouse it seems they have just infinite mass. They can pull through blob of infantry ezpz.

Try to do this in warband and you will stuck.

So far cavalry it totally OP, as infantry isn't able to stop them.

And archers OP, becouse they are only way(exept your own cavalry) to kill cav.
And cav OP, becouse archers can kite infantry forever so you need cav to counter them.

And it is not easy to see, becouse lords has 90% pesants in army.

 

[YariAshigaru]

Cavalry is kinda OP becouse it seems they have just infinite mass. They can pull through blob of infantry ezpz.

Try to do this in warband and you will stuck.


And archers OP, becouse they are only way(exept your own cavalry) to kill cav.
And cav OP, becouse archers can kite infantry forever so you need cav to counter them.

And it is not easy to see, becouse lords has 90% pesants in army.

Yeah pretty much, Infantry practically only has a purpose in sieges and are just walking arrow sponges on the fields.

 

[Maximum997]

Yeah pretty much, Infantry practically only has a purpose in sieges and are just walking arrow sponges on the fields.

I started this campaign as a roleplay foot army with some archers and little cav. And right now i have only archers and cav.

Becouse it was laways like this:

1. AI like a moron send cav and infantry in front
2. We cut them to pieces and now AI has tons of archers
3. We are going forward, they are going backward and constantly shooting
4. We are taking casualties, but pushing, then we start to cut the archers. And boom - 200 men just silently spawn behind my back, cut my archers to pieces, and charge to my back. And my reinforsments like a mile away.

I recorded some stats after another battle:
60 archers 288 kills 1 dead
15 cav 90 kills 0 dead
120 infantry 170 kills 50 dead (and it was almost all t5 troops)

So i just disbanded them and now i play with 50 50 cav archers and can beat army like 4 times more without any casualtes.
And i even can cut archers too, becouse they are toaly useless in sieges, I guess TW made them dumb as hell in siege atacks (so player cant just shoot all defenders like you can do it in warband)

Just command your archers to fall back and go cut enemy cavalry and archers. And after that may be you can go and kill runing infantry, but usually archers can deal with it ezpz witohut you.

 

[blackfang]

Ìn the very earliest parts of the beta, i am 90% sure but can't confirm due to having a break in between then and now that cavalry charging infantry actually encountered mass, it made cavalry very useless in some cases when they knocked down one or two people before they were just outright stuck in the middle of the formation of infantry. It made it so you used the cavalry for attacking archers or flanking enemy units or charging into an ongoing melee, because just charging infantry formations deeper than two men (like a square or circle formation) was a literal death sentence. Your imperial cataphracts charging into a square of sturgian variags just died because they got stuck and beat down from all sides instead of how it is now where they are just slowly wittled down, faster if the player is good at catching cav. Of course most people didn't really use formations properly back then so it was rarely seen and they still ran down a couple people so a line formation could be shredded.

Anyways, if you want to reenact this in multiplayer, find a crevice and put your units in there. Its literally the best way to kill cav, even better than putting your archers on a ledge and letting the cav charge off the edge because the ai is getting better and they just don't run off the edge as much as they used to, and besides, they don't often die doing that, they usually just get dehorsed and you are sacrificing a full charge from a cav unit on your archers so you will take quite a bit of damage anyways.

 

[TheCalradian]

I think spears do cause damage to horses and spearmen do know how to use them. It's not insta-kill, but it is insta-halt. And I can ride up on an isolated spearman and he can just turn and the skewer my horse.


Pikemen should PLANT their spears and it should really cause damge.
If horse dies, it could die with an impact like a catapult boulder.

There are no formations today. And there is no cavalry charge.

A formation with archers and footsoldiers should have orders like "swords in front" or "pikes in front". Today, when the archers are too close to enemy, they pull their swords and attack. In a composite formation, that is the moment when the footman/pikeman should step in front of the archer.

Formations should have a maximum and minimum desired distance. If you were further away, you should close in. If the enemy is too close, you should back off. You should design groups.

Cavalry charge should be a single event. Cavalry captain does ONE charge in formation and then prepare for another. Todays "charge" is basically a "break formation and attack" and has little to do with "charge".

 

[SavatageRoyo]

which results in them just scattering around the battlefield and fighting solo at which point they just become infantry on horses.

I oberved the cav-Ai a few times, they take a insane amount of "preperation" for each attempt of attack. They maybe bumped into something a friendly or enemy and fail to attack essentially. After that they often ride off forever, away from the battle pretty much, for another charge which they may or may not succeed in. They either miss or bump into something again - maybe they land a attack!
They seem to be very ineffective other than making the battlefield a huge mess and chaotic which is a plus I guess?
Cav should stay in formation alot more, they generally scatter all over the map doing their own thing.
However I don`t think they should be more powerful when it comes to crushing through and trampling over enemys on foot, that seems a bit too powerful at the moment. But I would agree charging cavalery into the back of a line has also little effect at the moment compared to the time it takes to "navigate" them around etc. the result doesn`t seem worth it all that much.
The AI as somebody already mentioned most of the time seems ill prepared. There are so many units on food with a spear or javelin in the game never making good use of it against enemys on horse.

 

[XT-ended_2L]

Just play Khuzaits. Army of horse archers is OP atm. They just run in circles like choo-choo train keeping unreachable distance and shooting everyone like a minigun. You succeed at every simulated battle in the game with them. Another advantage is your map speed.

 

[Doktor Barber]

Horses are still OP. Horses don't stop up or die by running into spears as of now, you're not supposed to just charge into infantry unless they are peasant tier rabble. Formations aren't working properly in this game, it is still better to just click everyone charge and a disorganized group of cavalry will easily plow through a wall of shields and spears.

a spear poke brings any horse to a dead stop

 

[Doktor Barber]

Just play Khuzaits. Army of horse archers is OP atm. They just run in circles like choo-choo train keeping unreachable distance and shooting everyone like a minigun. You succeed at every simulated battle in the game with them. Another advantage is your map speed.

crossbows seem to kill them no problem

 

[JaffalAllaYourMum]

Manual control seems fine for the time being for me.

Infantry - Shield wall -> Advance
Archers - Wait for infantry to get ahead and then charge them
Cav - Wedge formation -> Advance ->(Close to Enemy) Charge ->Run my hero through the other side with lance -> Follow commander -> advance again and charge cycle

The correct way to charge through enemy ranks is -
Face direction -> Charge
the cav will stick together in a wedge and plow right through.

Just tested in a 500 cav vs 500 infantry custom.
200 kills on cav and 2 deaths before i stopped

So yeah, no problems here.

Only issue is pikes need an option for 'Brace' to counter those cav charges

 

[XT-ended_2L]

crossbows seem to kill them no problem

Yeah, I agree. While I haven't seen too much crossbows in parties.

 

[iimstevo]

Cavalry are good. They break infantry morale with significant ease...
The problem I have with them is there's no way to prevent your army from chasing routed soldiers when the battle is still ongoing - this is what needs fixing.