five bucks
Knight at Arms
They definitely need to have a look at the excessive strength/speed of glaives and unrealistic slowness/weakness of pikes/mid-length spears.
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Five troops whose equipment I look at and just ask "why?"
- Thread starter anoddhermit
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Knight at Arms
LyonExodus
Veteran
that sounds very odd. have you any test to prove it since mine shows this very two to be worst than anything else as far as the base game is concerned.
Their weapons are simply too slow in the case of the Veteran and don't do enough DMG to reliably one shot in the case of the Menavliaton. the Voulgier is better than both and the Axe boys from desert and snow are the most versatile overall
five bucks
Knight at Arms
Here you go:
Now that you mention it, the Elite Menavliaton does indeed lose to the Voulgier. But they beat desert and snow axe bois.
It should be kept in mind that's infantry vs. infantry.
The Menavliaton has higher armor and can thrust vs. cavalry to halt them, which means it's probably the actual best for general use.
The Menavliaton has higher armor and can thrust vs. cavalry to halt them, which means it's probably the actual best for general use.
LyonExodus
Veteran
those videoa are T5 Vs T5 which is very much not what happens in the game. also i can link my tests that show this reflection: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...Lq6mbpEhuI-Dr63avu5W72e34/edit#gid=1876861364
LyonExodus
Veteran
well yes, the ability to be effective against cav is also important but their inefficiency at fighting your average infantry guy should take priority over anything since a knight that has nothing to support will sooner or later end up dead. Generally cavalry just feels too weak to really build an army that counters it effectively.
As far as my experience with the game goes there hasn't been shock troop that felt better than the Palace Guard. that may change now after they changed their armor.
I played very recently with a full imperial army ,with Catas excluded, and i can tell you that rarely the Menavliatons took the spotlight.
If i have to rank the Empire they have 1st/2nd Best frontline Infantry. only thing that doesn't make the Legioanry a clear tier 1 is the lack of a throwing weapon. Best (or not) crossbowman (mace makes all the difference and more in melee, but this is subjective), 2nd to last shock infantry and weakest both archer and horse archer.
five bucks
Knight at Arms
Sturgian Veteran Bowman is worse than Palatine Guard
LyonExodus
Veteran
They are both terrible in melee and the palatine is a better shot but lacks ammo. i would say the Veteran is far better and i am also experiencing that myself while playing both.
I understand the Veteran Bowman is far from the best archers but encyclopedia and stats don't tell all the story.
Pair the Bowman up with a good captain and you'll see the difference in potential between the two.
No point in using an archer who can't hold ground for long and isn't good a fighting over a crossbowman who also can't hold ground but it's better at fighting when needed.
also if i remember correctly the Platine may have recived a nerf to Bow in the latest patch
HalfMetalJacket
Knight
I think its really simple to even things out for archer dynamics.
Aserai: Best overall common archer, but to get them you have to grind through mediocre skirmishers.
Battania: Best total package... but they're nobles.
Empire: Most heavily armoured archer, but all that weight makes it a little hard for them to carry around a second quiver.
Khuzaits: Baseline. Utterly average in every respect, but not a bad pick at all.
Sturgia: Mediocre archers, but they have big shields and can actually fight well in close quarters.
Vlandia: Most easily accessible ranged troops- you will have your crossbowman very early compared to everyone else.
I'd also give almost all the archers daggers and crappy melee weapons instead of real ones- that way there is actually a noticeable difference in close quarters.
Aserai: Best overall common archer, but to get them you have to grind through mediocre skirmishers.
Battania: Best total package... but they're nobles.
Empire: Most heavily armoured archer, but all that weight makes it a little hard for them to carry around a second quiver.
Khuzaits: Baseline. Utterly average in every respect, but not a bad pick at all.
Sturgia: Mediocre archers, but they have big shields and can actually fight well in close quarters.
Vlandia: Most easily accessible ranged troops- you will have your crossbowman very early compared to everyone else.
I'd also give almost all the archers daggers and crappy melee weapons instead of real ones- that way there is actually a noticeable difference in close quarters.
LyonExodus
Veteran
if you play with mods the archer meta can shift for sure, maybe for people playing RBM or troop mods things are wildly different but as far as my experience and knowledge goes of the main game the list would be something like this:
ARCHERS 1.7.2
1) Fian
2) Marksman (recieved a buff to armor)
3) Master Archer (recived a nerf)
4) Veteran Bowman
5) Palatine (recived a nerf -20 Bow, and didn't deserve it)
The crossbow are interchangeable, it really depends on what you are looking for. Want somebody to protect the archers? then go Sergeant. Want somebody to make a big difference early? Then go Sharpy. they are balanced in my eyes and both would probably be better than Palatine and Bowman.
Altough the new reinforcement system kinda nerfed the Foot archers in general. so it's hard to asses the meta right now
But if they would give the Palatine something like 1xStacked Bodkins than it would play it out with the Master archer
I think the easiest way is -
1. Be Empire culture (they have far more towns and villages than anyone and are centrally located)
2. Have Combat Tips perk to boost level of recruited troops sharing your culture (25 Leadership)
3. Get lots of rep with Empire notables (do quests, leave high charm heroes in taverns, at 100+ smithing do orders, etc.)
All this applies for other culture choices, but it's way easier to manage as Empire w/Empire troops.
It also always helps to have a high level party, use good tactics, have high medicine or a good medic - these all reduce the amount of troops you lose in battle.
JedSlater
Recruit
Ahh good point didn't take that into consideration.
LyonExodus
Veteran
i generally use garrisons for it.
i have the most food heavy town on auto recruitment and if i need troops i go back there and grab some.
for the towns that don't get as much food i keep a garrison of around 200 T6 troops to keep security above 80 and consume the least amount of food possible. as long as you have more than 80/85 loyalty and security you get passive relations with notables in town and bounded villages, that means more recruitment and also extra influence from supporters.
I am currently playing a sturgian campaign and i can keep me and my parties filled with Sturgian boys that way
Also Combat tips like already said is great for any culture in my opinion, even if the Empire gets the most value out of it.