I've already had that in mind... 
C4 Suggestion & Resumal Thread! No progression/nothing happening.
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SurrealDolphin
Recruit
So I know that it is possible to have female nobles because of Ymira and companions. I am kind of leaning towards not having them, because there are still some differences in the spheres of "men" and "women" in the culture, with women being landowners/political decision makers, with men as the warriors. But some women in-game nobles might be cool. Opinions?
I have a new idea about Murond's army, submitted here as a suggestion.
Murond is still fresh from revolution, it has transitioned into a constitutional monarchy.
Murond is still fresh from revolution, it has transitioned into a constitutional monarchy.
Town Troops = "The People's Army"
With the revolution comes the creation of a professional army of the state as opposed to the feudal troops of the Kingdom of Murond. They are a fully equipped with arquebuses imported from, ironically, the Laurian Kingdom themselves.
Murond Militia - still fresh from the revolution, and with fire in their hearts, these young men are first to sign up for the People's Army;l taking their trusty arquebuses with them, they form together and become a company of Murond Militia, waiting for the day, their country calls for them to become trained and equipped to become real soldiers. Armed with arquebuses, and knives, assortment of "low class" garb of murond fashions, and red armbands on their right arms.
>>Murond People's Musketeer - The First professional soldiers of Murond. Given basic drill reminiscent of that, but a little inferior to that of the Kaiserlicher armies. Another difference is that they are also trained in close quarters combat, with every soldier tying crude bayonets to their arquebuses (knives, butcher knives, stakes). Their uniforms are a bit standard, the drab dark blue,or grey outfits reminiscent of the Black Hand soldiers (which wear black clothes) along with caps of course.
>>>>Murond People's Guard - Elite and Veteran musketeers. Unlike the darker colors of the musketeers, the Guard wear Light and bright uniforms exclusive to them. Complete with bandoliers and sashes, as well as a unique cap with a feather or two. While stylish, the uniform however is covered by a light breastplate offering the Guard some sort of protection. They are armed with the arquebus, that has been designed to be permanently fitted with a "sword" bayonet.
Murond Militia - still fresh from the revolution, and with fire in their hearts, these young men are first to sign up for the People's Army;l taking their trusty arquebuses with them, they form together and become a company of Murond Militia, waiting for the day, their country calls for them to become trained and equipped to become real soldiers. Armed with arquebuses, and knives, assortment of "low class" garb of murond fashions, and red armbands on their right arms.
>>Murond People's Musketeer - The First professional soldiers of Murond. Given basic drill reminiscent of that, but a little inferior to that of the Kaiserlicher armies. Another difference is that they are also trained in close quarters combat, with every soldier tying crude bayonets to their arquebuses (knives, butcher knives, stakes). Their uniforms are a bit standard, the drab dark blue,or grey outfits reminiscent of the Black Hand soldiers (which wear black clothes) along with caps of course.
>>>>Murond People's Guard - Elite and Veteran musketeers. Unlike the darker colors of the musketeers, the Guard wear Light and bright uniforms exclusive to them. Complete with bandoliers and sashes, as well as a unique cap with a feather or two. While stylish, the uniform however is covered by a light breastplate offering the Guard some sort of protection. They are armed with the arquebus, that has been designed to be permanently fitted with a "sword" bayonet.
City Troops = The Royal Remnants
While most power of the nobles have been taken away after the revolution, some supporters of the people have offered their feudal armies to become a part of the Murond armed forces offering old fashioned experienced troops to its new and untested People's army. These troops have been jokingly called by the people as the "royal remnants"
Royal Soldier - Murond's feudal armies have been dominated with Halberdiers and swordsmen, halberdiers being the elite, when the revolution ended, most of the remaining royal soldiers were halberdiers. The Royal Soldier wields the "long" halberd in the game, also sometimes attached with pinions on them. Like the rest of the Royal Army/Remnants they bear a yellow and red motiff ,yes they might be mistaken for Laurians, if it wasn't for their puffy clothes underneath their breasplate and headgear (see, War of the Roses english halberdier). They can form without the need for standard bearers. They are very experienced figthers.
Royal Yeoman - Supporting the body of troops were the Yeomanry, proficient users of the Long Bow, the remaining Yeoman were outfitted with decent armor, have buckler shields and and short swords, and their long bows. They have same color scheme as Royal Soldier. They are very good with the long bow rivaling those of Nirdamese a continent away. They also have enough skill with the sword and shield to fight well.
Murond Knight - Disgraced, most noblemen these days would usually take the life of a professional soldier, offering themselves to the army to become their cavalry arm. They ride on Hunter horses, perhaps the only good warhorse found in Murond. Still having a disdain for gunpowder weapons, they still fight with light lances, shields, sword or mace. They wear heraldic mail armor, still painted with the lords they have allegiance to, while the shields are painted with the colors of the Royal Remnants, yellow and red.
>>Murond Royal Knight - the fiercest knights often find themselves to become escorts and eventually the bodyguards of the King and Queen. They are the only ones well payed enough to afford heavy plate armor, similar to those worn by the knight orders of Lauria. They still ride on hunter horses, but they are armed with a heavy lance, bastard sword, or two handed axe. They have better fighting stats than Swadian Knights.
Royal Soldier - Murond's feudal armies have been dominated with Halberdiers and swordsmen, halberdiers being the elite, when the revolution ended, most of the remaining royal soldiers were halberdiers. The Royal Soldier wields the "long" halberd in the game, also sometimes attached with pinions on them. Like the rest of the Royal Army/Remnants they bear a yellow and red motiff ,yes they might be mistaken for Laurians, if it wasn't for their puffy clothes underneath their breasplate and headgear (see, War of the Roses english halberdier). They can form without the need for standard bearers. They are very experienced figthers.
Royal Yeoman - Supporting the body of troops were the Yeomanry, proficient users of the Long Bow, the remaining Yeoman were outfitted with decent armor, have buckler shields and and short swords, and their long bows. They have same color scheme as Royal Soldier. They are very good with the long bow rivaling those of Nirdamese a continent away. They also have enough skill with the sword and shield to fight well.
Murond Knight - Disgraced, most noblemen these days would usually take the life of a professional soldier, offering themselves to the army to become their cavalry arm. They ride on Hunter horses, perhaps the only good warhorse found in Murond. Still having a disdain for gunpowder weapons, they still fight with light lances, shields, sword or mace. They wear heraldic mail armor, still painted with the lords they have allegiance to, while the shields are painted with the colors of the Royal Remnants, yellow and red.
>>Murond Royal Knight - the fiercest knights often find themselves to become escorts and eventually the bodyguards of the King and Queen. They are the only ones well payed enough to afford heavy plate armor, similar to those worn by the knight orders of Lauria. They still ride on hunter horses, but they are armed with a heavy lance, bastard sword, or two handed axe. They have better fighting stats than Swadian Knights.
I like it...
Bunduqdari
Sergeant Knight
There have been countless suggestions for the Murond troop tree, but another one can't hurt, I guess, especially considering the fact that Murond is still far form being developed.
So you're going with the idea of making the revolutionists come from rural areas(villages, which you call towns) and them having most of the firearms, whereas the old nobility and non-firearm troops come from the cities?
This sounds rather counter-intuitive as one would expect to find the firearms+revolution thing to be going on in the cities and not in the villages. Also, Yeomans ought to originate from rural areas. And finally, I think you forgot to mention the famous billmen. So this leads me to advise you to shuffle some of the troops around to their appropriate places,
so we don't end up with the "revolutiontroop=villages and oldtroops=cities"-style of partition, but rather a partition like according to unit experience and power. This means knights would remain city troops while billmen would be village troops and most firearms troops would become city troops.
So you're going with the idea of making the revolutionists come from rural areas(villages, which you call towns) and them having most of the firearms, whereas the old nobility and non-firearm troops come from the cities?
This sounds rather counter-intuitive as one would expect to find the firearms+revolution thing to be going on in the cities and not in the villages. Also, Yeomans ought to originate from rural areas. And finally, I think you forgot to mention the famous billmen. So this leads me to advise you to shuffle some of the troops around to their appropriate places,
so we don't end up with the "revolutiontroop=villages and oldtroops=cities"-style of partition, but rather a partition like according to unit experience and power. This means knights would remain city troops while billmen would be village troops and most firearms troops would become city troops.
Venitius
Count
I dunno if the Royal Knights should be an upgrade if they're superior to Swadian Knights who are one of the heaviest cavalry units that is already in an army, as well as wearing Laurian plate. Perhaps the hunters might let them down but I dunno..
And an axe? How dastardly! Such tools are the weapons of the peasant masses that forced us to relinquish our huge estates! I say!
And an axe? How dastardly! Such tools are the weapons of the peasant masses that forced us to relinquish our huge estates! I say!
Toffey
Hunters work very well for the Grand Duchy.
I'd be careful about making the revolutionary army *too* focussed on guns. Their bayonets better be damned good.
After all, it's not much of a glorious revolution if the revolutionaries don't dare to fight in a melee.
After all, it's not much of a glorious revolution if the revolutionaries don't dare to fight in a melee.
As far as I'm concerned, you may also just give them some good rapiers or just plain old Schiavonas and be done with it.
In any case, they need melee weapons.
In any case, they need melee weapons.
Bunduqdari
Sergeant Knight
mor2 said:
Bayonets were planned for Murond from the beginning.
But you shouldn't think of it as a real bayonet, but more like a knife attached to a musket with thin rope/leather, because that's what it'll look like, someone(ithinksilverwolf)had even made a model for it already.
That...sounds like a very bad idea. I can't think of any way in which such a contraption would hold for very long.
Is the model still floating around somewhere?
Is the model still floating around somewhere?
Bunduqdari said:
No it wasn't me ... I believe that it was Nikephoros who made them... Or Venitius.
Aye, I know its far from development, but I'm trying to refocus the discussion to the guys in brown. I'm trying to rethink the flavor of these guys. While slightly living in "liberty" it still has some tension with its old ways.
Not peasant axe, my friend, real two handed WAR AXES, I got my inspiration from the many images of crusader knights, namely Richard the Lion Heart posing around with a war axe. So what if they "might" be superior to HSE knights, the fact that they're continents away mean a difficult affair of seeing those two against each other. Royal knights are very difficult to attain, (high experience needed to level up) making them few but deadly. Their shorter "heavy lances" (note: not Great lance as wielded by Swadian knights) still make them inferior lancers. Besides, the numbers of the royal remnants are supposed to be few especially the knights.
I prefer the former partition really, look at the IS or Lauria, of course (town) troops can also be drawn from the cities, its just that in EATRC, usually, the City troops are actually just very powerful soldiers that need more than 10 denars to recruit. The gunpowder troops are the masses that come from (towns). While the previous professional and experienced ones would have been drawn towards the city.
The only thing true now about the Yeoman is the name. Yes the were recruited as peasants during the feudal era of Murond, but the Royal Yeoman I am referring to now are the elite yeomen of the nobility that have survived the civil war. Professional, well payed and equip, (for skirmisher standards). I was envisioning these dudes, with a little more renaissance look.
Oh my goodness, I forgot about the Billboys.... hmmmm, truth be told I was never really one to approve of it. Of course my reshuffling version would be that, the Murond Militia are troops that will either spawn with an arquebus or a bill, (yes it is unheard of in EATRC, but I find it unique) and that it will branch off into the Musketeer tree and a Billmen tree...
Should we really add billdudes? Hope D or Nik, (who's putting his back to this project) comes along and decides and pitches in a suggestion.
The Aurora and them Swadian Giant Carts are contraptions that might not hold very long either, but hey this is EATRC, stranger things have happened
I'm still at odds on what Murond's "shootiness" should be. I was thinking that the musketeer be inferior to the IS firing line and HU marksmen, but they should be on par in skill as Laurian arquebusiers, however, they are lightly armored (remember the clothes) but in turn will have good melee skills.
For the People's Guard they should however match the janissaries.
What do you guys think?
Venitius said:
Not peasant axe, my friend, real two handed WAR AXES, I got my inspiration from the many images of crusader knights, namely Richard the Lion Heart posing around with a war axe. So what if they "might" be superior to HSE knights, the fact that they're continents away mean a difficult affair of seeing those two against each other. Royal knights are very difficult to attain, (high experience needed to level up) making them few but deadly. Their shorter "heavy lances" (note: not Great lance as wielded by Swadian knights) still make them inferior lancers. Besides, the numbers of the royal remnants are supposed to be few especially the knights.
Bunduqdari said:
I prefer the former partition really, look at the IS or Lauria, of course (town) troops can also be drawn from the cities, its just that in EATRC, usually, the City troops are actually just very powerful soldiers that need more than 10 denars to recruit. The gunpowder troops are the masses that come from (towns). While the previous professional and experienced ones would have been drawn towards the city.
The only thing true now about the Yeoman is the name. Yes the were recruited as peasants during the feudal era of Murond, but the Royal Yeoman I am referring to now are the elite yeomen of the nobility that have survived the civil war. Professional, well payed and equip, (for skirmisher standards). I was envisioning these dudes, with a little more renaissance look.
Oh my goodness, I forgot about the Billboys.... hmmmm, truth be told I was never really one to approve of it. Of course my reshuffling version would be that, the Murond Militia are troops that will either spawn with an arquebus or a bill, (yes it is unheard of in EATRC, but I find it unique) and that it will branch off into the Musketeer tree and a Billmen tree...
Should we really add billdudes? Hope D or Nik, (who's putting his back to this project) comes along and decides and pitches in a suggestion.
Shrugging Khan said:
The Aurora and them Swadian Giant Carts are contraptions that might not hold very long either, but hey this is EATRC, stranger things have happened
I'm still at odds on what Murond's "shootiness" should be. I was thinking that the musketeer be inferior to the IS firing line and HU marksmen, but they should be on par in skill as Laurian arquebusiers, however, they are lightly armored (remember the clothes) but in turn will have good melee skills.
For the People's Guard they should however match the janissaries.
What do you guys think?
Thing is, the carts and the cannon are large and have lots of experts constantly on the ready to fix them if anything happens. A bayonet held on by rope sounds like it's just waiting to slip away at the single most inopportune moment
Nah...bayonetted rifles are way shorter than pikes and very weak against lancers, and also inferior to any dedicated melee attack. Also, attaching a bayonet to a rifle makes it more difficult to shoot accurately, so...in the end, while they may be more flexible than most other troops, a strong attack will certainly make a mess of them.
Venitius
Count
I would suppose that glue and rope would be the only way unless they have nails that you can hammer into the gun without actually affecting the barrel. And can take the unbalanced weight of a cleaver, not to mention that said cleaver will make it rather hard to aim.
And erm.. we could lower reload rate too? I mean, Bob the Musketeer probably doesn't want to slice his arm while reloading.
And that generates the following question:
Where the hell do you put the ramrod? (seeing as the tube/hoops/whatever where you put it will be blocked by the crude bayonet...) Attach it to the belt? Tie it to a boot?
EDIT = No, it wasn't me who made them. Think it was Nikephoros.
And erm.. we could lower reload rate too? I mean, Bob the Musketeer probably doesn't want to slice his arm while reloading.
And that generates the following question:
Where the hell do you put the ramrod? (seeing as the tube/hoops/whatever where you put it will be blocked by the crude bayonet...) Attach it to the belt? Tie it to a boot?
EDIT = No, it wasn't me who made them. Think it was Nikephoros.
Bunduqdari
Sergeant Knight
mor2 said:
No it won't. A line of murond musketmen with bayonets is not even to be compared to a line of pole-arm-wielding bad-asses when it comes to fending off cavalry. Their musket+bayonet would be too short to have such an effect, besides the lackluster melee damage that the home-brew bayonet has.
Murond musketmen would only be slightly more useful than Kaiserlicker foot soldiers in melee combat and only just because of the higher athletics and iron skin they would have.
So we still end up with mediocre ranged damage and bad melee damage for this troop, which balance things out.
@FuryFire: Billdudes are a must, Nikephoros (and I also) had planned this from the beginning
