Two-Handed Speed Nerf When?

[BigBoiBeast]

Well, I always knew Two-Handed Weapons were kinda broken due to the range/damage ratio [No 2h in the world should be able to deal 75+ dmg to a fully armored heavy inf], but now with 1.6.0 and the duel mode being released, it just became even more obvious. Some Two-Handers, such as the Great Axe, that the Berserker has or the Bastard Sword for the Vlandians need to be nerfed! At this moment, a Bastard Sword of a Vlandian Sergeant will kill any Heavy Infantry with 2 well-placed hits or 3 random hits, is longer than any 1h weapon in the game and has a faster swing speed than any decent 1h.

So it's basically 1h = Decent damage, decent speed, decent range
2h = Better damage, better speed, better range

While I totally support that Two-Handers should deal more damage and should be a bit longer, they should NEVER be faster than One-Handed Weapons, which is the case right now.

The speed that, for example, the Great Sword in Warband had was perfect, because while you did have a range and damage advantage over most 1h weapons, the speed made it kinda balanced. On Bannerlord, due to the sometimes quite ridiculous angles a weapon can hit you from, you will always have the disadvantage as a 1h player.

A semi-decent player, who knows how to spam, will be able to beat pretty much anyone [except maybe the absolute sweats, which make up like 2% of the community] due to the speed of the weapon. I just tried out 1h vs. 2h speed on the duel server, and in the time I was able to swing once, a friend of mine who was using a 2h, swung almost 3 times. I am factoring in physics of course, but even with the proper angle, the 2h is still faster than the 1h, which should not be the case, and would certainly have not been the case irl.

So for the love of butter, pleaaaase fix the swing speed of 2h weapons, cuz whats the point of people duelling, if the majority is using totally overpowered 2h weapons, that let even the newest of player land a few hits on Warband- and/or Bannerlord-Vets?



P.S.: Duel Mode is fun tho... I am wasting my life on it rn!

 

[Adderall]

If you lose duels against a person with 2h you would lose against him with a 1h

 

[Humphrey]

+1

 

[BigBoiBeast]

If you lose duels against a person with 2h you would lose against him with a 1h

That literally doesn't make sense. Have u even read what I wrote? 1h v 1h is totally balanced, while 2h v 1h will like 90% of the time be won by the person with a 2h, as it is faster, longer and deals more dmg. Speed is the problem here.

+1

Ty MrHumphrey

 

[Adderall]

That literally doesn't make sense. Have u even read what I wrote? 1h v 1h is totally balanced, while 2h v 1h will like 90% of the time be won by the person with a 2h, as it is faster, longer and deals more dmg. Speed is the problem here.

2h are not faster. Bastard swords are half and half btw.

 

[BigBoiBeast]

2h are not faster? Please load up Bannerlord, go on the duel server and play against someone with a 2h. They might not be "faster" stat wise, but they sure as hell move faster.

 

[Kripaz]

Also let's remember that most of the classes that use 2h weapons as a default weapon are also faster than other infantry units. Two-handed weapons already cause larger stun to the opponent that uses lighter weapons, so two-handed weapons really don't need to be also faster than one-handed weapons. Apparently stuns are going to be addressed in 1.6.1, but we'll need to see first how it will actually work.

 

[BigBoiBeast]

Good point @Kripaz

 

[Tylerb7]

I have never been one of the better players in either Warband or Bannerlord, so someone please correct me if this is wrong, but my experience is that any weapon can be arbitrarily fast as long as you turn into the swing. This means that, except for wind-up time, every weapon is the same speed. I can't see them changing this.

 

[BigBoiBeast]

I have never been one of the better players in either Warband or Bannerlord, so someone please correct me if this is wrong, but my experience is that any weapon can be arbitrarily fast as long as you turn into the swing. This means that, except for wind-up time, every weapon is the same speed. I can't see them changing this.

That's correct, but if u turn into the swing with a 1h, it's still decently balanced and actually easily blockable... With a 2h however, it gets to the point, where it's an actual effort to block it, because the speed difference between 1h and 2h just isn't enough. Also, if u get hit with a 1h on full speed, it takes like 30-40 dmg on heavy inf (depending on the weapon), while a 2h, with basically the same or more speed and more range, does like 65-75 dmg per hit, which wouldn't be a problem, if the speed was actually counterable.

 

[Jesus__is__Lord]

large 2 handed weapons like great axe have lower speed, relative to a 1 h long sword
so if close the distance and turn with your hits and the 1h weapon should be fine

the only fast 2 handed weapons are: falx, bastard weapons,

those weapons have less range then a long sword or any long 1 h weapon except the spartha, if im not mistaken

so yea it is annoying that you have to maintain some distance when fighting against 2h fast weapons but you have kick to punish those that get too close

but even if it wasn't "balanced"

given how much damage arrows do, anyone who has to fight without a shield deserves that little bit of speed advantage

at least until arrow damage is lowered a little

 

[Hans 77]

I have never been one of the better players in either Warband or Bannerlord, so someone please correct me if this is wrong, but my experience is that any weapon can be arbitrarily fast as long as you turn into the swing. This means that, except for wind-up time, every weapon is the same speed. I can't see them changing this.

The lack of turncap in Bannerlord definitely allows for you to turn into your swing faster (much more so than Warband), but the actual speed stat of a weapon still plays a big factor, considering it affects the appearance of your feints, how fast your overheads swing, and is very important in bait-outs, attacking from awkward angles, and out-timing your opponent's swing.

 

[BigBoiBeast]

large 2 handed weapons like great axe have lower speed, relative to a 1 h long sword
so if close the distance and turn with your hits and the 1h weapon should be fine

the only fast 2 handed weapons are: falx, bastard weapons,

those weapons have less range then a long sword or any long 1 h weapon except the spartha, if im not mistaken

so yea it is annoying that you have to maintain some distance when fighting against 2h fast weapons but you have kick to punish those that get too close

but even if it wasn't "balanced"

given how much damage arrows do, anyone who has to fight without a shield deserves that little bit of speed advantage

at least until arrow damage is lowered a little

That: "those weapons have less range then a long sword or any long 1 h weapon except the spartha, if im not mistaken" actually isn't true. The Bastard Sword is longer than all 1h weapons, as is the falx for that matter. Also, I was talking about melee combat, as on a duel server, you don't really have anything (like arrows) to counter someone with a 2h.

 

[DeathBG]

Don't worry next patch 2h will get passive buffs like 20% more damage to their current state. It will be broken unless they changed them, but from what I saw in the beta 2h is OP strong and makes heavy infantry irrelevant to play.

 

[Askey]

Wouldn't increasing the handling of one-handed weapons help, buffing the handling further especially if they are equipped with no shield.

 

[greedogre]

speed on movement and weapon stats and turn cap all add up, it's pretty obvious in duel especially when they can almost stun lock you from fighting back with shield.

you cant fight 2 hand with shield that's about it.

 

[hoonii]

you can run in circles like an autist and swing continuously like a monkey and get kills easy enough because 2h usually one hit to head and shock troops are considerably faster than other inf
i dont see the problem here!

 

[BigBoiBeast]

you can run in circles like an autist and swing continuously like a monkey and get kills easy enough because 2h usually one hit to head and shock troops are considerably faster than other inf
i dont see the problem here!

xD

I found this in the patch notes of 1.6.1 btw, so for everyone who is doubting or denying that there is a problem with 2h, read it:

Gyazo

gyazo.com

I doubt TW would say something like that, if there was no speed problem with bastard weapons @Adderall

 

[Hax.]

a Bastard Sword of a Vlandian Sergeant will kill any Heavy Infantry with 2 well-placed hits or 3 random hits, is longer than any 1h weapon in the game and has a faster swing speed than any decent 1h.

I don’t see a issue there. Giving up your shield as a sergeant in exchange for a damage boost is fine. 2h is easy to counter with a shield and a free kill for archers.

On a side note you will also take massive dmg as an berseker/savage/voulgier and find yourself in a coffin within 2 hits or arrows. Let alone how often you get shot as a 2h class. 80% of all melee fights end by an arrow in the back due the lack of ff.

Arguably there are better ways to bring up heavy axes/bardiches and so on at a later stage in the battle but once again here we are back at the main issue: stuck with this horrible bastard of a misconceptional class system.

If you lose duels against a person with 2h you would lose against him with a 1h

+1

 

[BigBoiBeast]

I don’t see a issue there. Giving up your shield as a sergeant in exchange for a damage boost is fine. 2h is easy to counter with a shield and a free kill for archers.

On a side note you will also take massive dmg as an berseker/savage/voulgier and find yourself in a coffin within 2 hits or arrows. Let alone how often you get shot as a 2h class. 80% of all melee fights end by an arrow in the back due the lack of ff.

Arguably there are better ways to bring up heavy axes/bardiches and so on at a later stage in the battle but once again here we are back at the main issue: stuck with this horrible bastard of a misconceptional class system.

+1

I am not on about the damage boost tho, am I? Also, where did u get the fact that 2h is easy to counter by shields? Shields aren't nearly as strong here, as they were in Warband. A Berserker Axe literally destroys a heavy shield in 3 hits. And archery isn't really that great either, as it isn't hard for anyone to evade arrows... Also, do you actually agree with a Bastard Sword having a speed rating of 96 ^^? That's faster than 99% of all 1h weps.

Oh and as a side note, no you don't die of two arrows as a Berserker, except they are headshots (and I doubt the majority of the community has Legolas-Aim). Berserkers have a 2h speed bonus due to higher proficiency, have a faster running speed than most other classes, and 110 hp. Means, they can tank like 3-4 semi-well placed arrows.

And that talk about "If u lose to someone with a 2h, you would lose to them with a 1h"... How does that even make sense? Someone could have a certain swing technique with a 1h, that doesn't work on a 2h. Or they aren't used to the range and speed of a 1h, while being pro at a 2h... The choice of weapon has a lot to do with your chance of success, except ur like top 10 best players.