Turkey Right Now

[ancalimon]

It does at least partially, because the alcohol and public affection laws could be considered a positive thing by a largely religious community. I have nothing to say about that, so I opt out.

Duh gets points for best explanation of his thoughts.

From what I observe, it seems like these unwritten public affection laws are opposite of each other when it comes to Turkey vs Europe.

In Turkey usually the more elite people want more freedom about this subject while in Europe it's the opposite. Usually elite people are very careful about these kind of things in Europe.

 

[Duh]

In Turkey usually the more elite people want more freedom about this subject while in Europe it's the opposite.

Germany makes people drink horse *** in the jungle camp show. I believe we have broken all standards.

 

[pentagathus]

I'm fairly sure they (in Turkey) haven't passed any laws explicitly banning public displays of affection, although there was some unrest at warnings against public displays. The alcohol thing could be supported on a cultural basis as much religious.
Also the AKP claim to be a secular party, if they were to openly declare themselves to be an islamic party they would most probably lose support.
There were like 3 or 4 replies whilst I was posting this.

 

[ancalimon]

In Turkey usually the more elite people want more freedom about this subject while in Europe it's the opposite.

Germany makes people drink horse *** in the jungle camp show. I believe we have broken all standards.

I guess it comes down to what the fine line should be.

 

[oktay67gs]

http://www.59saniye.com/taksim-gezi-parkindaki-ilginc-eylemci/

 

[Kobrag]

...
Classy.

 

[ancalimon]

When that bombing in Hatay (our Syria border) happened in which more than 50 people died (I was muted when that happened), I thought to myself that something was going to happen.

I have still got mixed feelings about this uprising. Everything seems ...  as if planned.

 

[Rujasu]

I thought the public affection thing was cleared up =/

Since you were pretty uncertain about every country you named, I'd like to say that you will get yelled at by random people if you show your affection in public in South Korea.
Especially if you're foreign, but that's beside the point.

 

[Kobrag]

What?
I named no things. :c

 

[Nord Champion]

Wow. I hope the best for all involved. I can't really say much else since I don't know practically anything about Turkish politics.

 

[wrc]

When that bombing in Hatay (our Syria border) happened in which more than 50 people died (I was muted when that happened), I thought to myself that something was going to happen.

I have still got mixed feelings about this uprising. Everything seems ...  as if planned.

Oh boy, not again.
Russia, Israel and Kurds have organized the whole thing, because they want to tear Turkey apart.

 

[Bluehawk]

Gotta strip the bird if ya wanna make soup.

 

[Hanz]

When that bombing in Hatay (our Syria border) happened in which more than 50 people died (I was muted when that happened), I thought to myself that something was going to happen.

I have still got mixed feelings about this uprising. Everything seems ...  as if planned.

Oh boy, not again.
Russia, Israel and Kurds have organized the whole thing, because they want to tear Turkey apart.

Are you crazy? It's obviously the vile Greeks who want to retake Constantinople!

 

[Rujasu]

What?
I named no things. :c

Not specifically you. **** English.

 

[Kobrag]

I wouldn't do that, many English people are scummy. 

 

[Truktos]

I was there today. 100.000 people made it to the Taksim Square without a problem. I was one of them. Police retreated, after that when I tried to leave the square, 2 of the main streets to the Taksim square was invaded by the police. They didnt let the people leave the square. They used tear-gases etc. I've never seen anything like that. Turkish police didnt attack that ferocious even to the terrorists.

Police is attacking Beşiktaş right now. It's next to the bosphorus. Some of my friends got stuck there.

And by the way, Turkish media is mostly silenced, there are only 2 tv channels which are trying to get a livestream from the field. Even though there are lots of wrong informations, Twitter is the only thing that we can learn the situation.

 

[xenoargh]

Current news from our media.  It's also hit #2 on CNN's trending stories, but that's not saying a lot, as this has been a slow news day otherwise.  We're paying some attention here, but not a lot yet.

Anyhow, I'm not sure about the analysis in the WSJ piece.  Seems the same overly-hopeful nonsense that was being spouted before Egypt came apart at the seams.  Questions remain:

1.  Is the AKP as well-loved as it's implied?  They won elections, to be sure, but I was under the impression that the more conservative portions of their agenda had been the biggest problems.

2.  What are the main reasons people are protesting?  This whole thing started over a relatively minor issue so I don't think that explains it.  Clearly, there are some really deep-seated resentments now being expressed.  What do the people protesting actually want? 

3.  Is Erdegan serious when he implies he can bring "a million" followers to the party (which reads ominously like a threat to start a civil war)? 

4.  Why isn't he spending more time urging calm and trying to figure out what's at the core of this?  An American President who gave a speech like that would face impeachment; I presume that this kind of "tough guy" language goes over better in Turkey.  But it still seemed like a very odd speech overall.  At the very least, it seems bizarre that the actions of the Turkish government appear to be designed to make things worse, not better.  But I'm saying that from what was translated and from my cultural / political POV, of course.  It just seems like a very odd way to deal with what appears to be a very dangerous situation.

 

[Truktos]

Erdogan could have calmed down the people, if he had made police retreated from the Gezi Park. He made Gezi Park besieged instead. I'm pretty sure he could bring a million followers to the field, but he wouldnt dare, I hope for Turkey's sake.

What we are protesting is, Erdogan started to make Hitler of himself. He started to say "I'm elected, I will do everything as I see fit. I dont care about anyones thoughts." Turkish people dont want an iron-fist government. At least that is what I'm protesting when I was on the field.

AKP gets his votes mostly from the eastern cities, which people are more conservative there. I'm pretty sure they lost some votes in whole Turkey though. I'm sure I'm the most antipolitic guy around, but even I went to the Gezipark today. I'm grateful that I could runaway from the branch roads though.

There was a detail in Gezipark today. People wore gas-masks, medical-masks etc., in the expectation of getting tear-gassed. Even though the meeting I took part was legal.

 

[ancalimon]

2.  What are the main reasons people are protesting?  This whole thing started over a relatively minor issue so I don't think that explains it.  Clearly, there are some really deep-seated resentments now being expressed.  What do the people protesting actually want? 

This is the general idea.

 

[xenoargh]

Thanks to both of you; that helps explain a bit. 

It's hard to tell what's going on from outside Turkey and who's doing what if you're not a foreign-policy expert.  Turkey doesn't get a great deal of news coverage here and unlike the problems in Greece, it hasn't gotten a lot of analysis.

But ever since the news came to light of the limitations being put on your media and use of the Internet, I've been worried that this kind of thing might happen.

Hopefully these issues can be addressed peacefully through the democratic process, not violence, once things calm down a bit.