Smithing is ...game breaking....

[REDRONIN]

A few weeks ago when i started playing I researched many things and watched videos to be prepared. I have seen the many " javelin rush" posts and vids but I did not realize how sadly game breaking it is. In just a couple hours in a game I can smith two handers from easy low materials that sell for 10k each. ( at rank 50-75 ) . Then at rank 100-150 ( still low ranks) I can craft two handers and javelins for 10k-100k... this is silly to the point of just stupid design. workshops a few hundred denars a day, a good caravan 400 denars a day,, smith at very low level 50k-a million denars a day. Not to mention all ones companions. It is not smart thinking to NOT train your companions up as well as you sit and train smiting. rest smith repeat. In a few hours I have 6 companions at 30-70 smiting each. Everyone of them can make the two handers and javelins. There becomes zero reason to do anything else in game for money. no quests. no selling items or gear even. no tension of the balance of playing the game or working towards anything. Can buy king level gear for every slot of every toon . Max tier troops for every keep. Anyhow just very poor design. I really hope they nerf the selling of crafted items 6feet under very soon. I just wont believe this is working as intended.
Rant over just kinda ruined the whole tension of the game for me.

 

[MostBlunted]

They claimed that they will rework smithing. Don´t expect results anytime soon.

 

[Daelaam]

The smithing actually makes the game playable for me. My standard playthrough is to participate in as many tournaments as I can and make about 15k denars. Previously, I used to buy a workshop or a caravan, but now I just buy pugios, smelt them and start crafting two handed swords. At some point I will unlock a two handed blade that does a lot of damage or a javelin that isn't completely terrible. Any of them will make about 105k denars. I also don't sell anything that is below this amount or has any minuses in their stats (it is my principle). I know that this is completely broken, but I don't think this should be nerfed significantly, until the workshops and caravans are buffed/fixed. Even fiefs do not make enough money (most of their income goes for their garrison anyway). Only after leveling smithing to somewhere 200+ (which happens pretty fast), I start hiring troops and companions.

Maybe I am just playing it wrong and there are actually valid ways of making money and supporting a big group of elite fighters without constantly fighting.

Overall, smithing is something I enjoy the most after fighting. It would be nice to have quests like "the lord wants a legendary sword whose name is Dawn" or something like this. But right now, it would be nice just to have bugs fixed.

P.S. The game adds your crafted weapons to their towns even if you don't sell them, but there is a mod that prevents it. Participating in tournaments may get annoying, considering that you get only 0.25 of a regular experience and leveling is very slow (even in 1.4.3), but there is mod for this as well (this mod actually made practice fights extremely more enjoyable for me)

 

[Ananda_The_Destroyer]

It needs to be reworked but it's not game breaking, since you can make massive money just beating down lords. In fact smithing for some money is pretty much the only non-"beat every one up forever" thing you can do to support a growing army.

It is not smart thinking to NOT train your companions up as well as you sit and train smiting.

I would argue smart thinking is ONLY using companions to smith so you MC can preserve high learning speed as long as possible for other skills. You can easily power level smithing later if you feel like it, after the leveling speed is already garbage(for things other then smithing javelins.)

 

[stevehoos]

The smithing actually makes the game playable for me. My standard playthrough is to participate in as many tournaments as I can and make about 15k denars. Previously, I used to buy a workshop or a caravan, but now I just buy pugios, smelt them and start crafting two handed swords. At some point I will unlock a two handed blade that does a lot of damage or a javelin that isn't completely terrible. Any of them will make about 105k denars. I also don't sell anything that is below this amount or has any minuses in their stats (it is my principle). I know that this is completely broken, but I don't think this should be nerfed significantly, until the workshops and caravans are buffed/fixed. Even fiefs do not make enough money (most of their income goes for their garrison anyway). Only after leveling smithing to somewhere 200+ (which happens pretty fast), I start hiring troops and companions.

Maybe I am just playing it wrong and there are actually valid ways of making money and supporting a big group of elite fighters without constantly fighting.

Overall, smithing is something I enjoy the most after fighting. It would be nice to have quests like "the lord wants a legendary sword whose name is Dawn" or something like this. But right now, it would be nice just to have bugs fixed.

P.S. The game adds your crafted weapons to their towns even if you don't sell them, but there is a mod that prevents it. Participating in tournaments may get annoying, considering that you get only 0.25 of a regular experience and leveling is very slow (even in 1.4.3), but there is mod for this as well (this mod actually made practice fights extremely more enjoyable for me)

It breaks the game because you can just give a faction a sword each time for peace. The javelins are also game breaking.

 

[MostBlunted]

Maybe I am just playing it wrong and there are actually valid ways of making money and supporting a big group of elite fighters without constantly fighting.

Nope, only the smithing cheese and battles will make money. That´s why you can defeat a lord and the next day he is back.

The economy is totally broken.

 

[Daelaam]

It breaks the game because you can just give a faction a sword each time for peace. The javelins are also game breaking.

Well, yes, I said that it was completely broken as well (especially when javelins that do not cost anything to make, can be sold for 105k+), but considering that everything else is broken too in the game, it kind of makes things easier. I used to rely on workshops and caravans before, but they are not making much money now.

 

[Dearmad]

Economy broken: Yes. Yes it is....

 

[Ananda_The_Destroyer]

It breaks the game because you can just give a faction a sword each time for peace

They also will make peace for 0 denars if you've beaten them badly. If you have the power to take a town on your own, you can probably beat them till the point they make free peace too. I even squeezed war horses and some money out of one of em. I don't think the AI considers anything but it current situation so the prospect of gaining a dozen lords released and -1 war is a big YES for them. unless they're en-rout to a fief they calculate can be taken. They don't have the knowledge that the lord will quickly escape on their own or that I'm 1 clan so if they siege 2 of my feifs I'm ****ed... well maybe not mekeb and chaikland they're pretty close.

EDIT: I always forget to mention how silly it is that any vassal can make peace with you. Why does Korte get to make war policy for the entire khuzaits?

 

[Maximum997]

You forgot one new thing.

With new XP system (and it is far better system then previous) with smithing you can lvl up like a mad and get 10 stats and 5 focus points to any skill you need to grow it faster.

34 days in the game i am lvl 24. Want a new lvl? Just make amd smelt some javelines. So yes, smithing is a game breaking

 

[grunwalder01]

This is so funny actually. Everytime i imagine how we can print money and make towns bankrupt just by crafting javelins i have a loud laugh .
But, anyway, the easiest solution until TW fix it is not using it. Or, use it but not abuse it in a way that breaks the game.

 

[Olympeus]

You forgot one new thing.

With new XP system (and it is far better system then previous) with smithing you can lvl up like a mad and get 10 stats and 5 focus points to any skill you need to grow it faster.

34 days in the game i am lvl 24. Want a new lvl? Just make amd smelt some javelines. So yes, smithing is a game breaking

I found out somewhere else on this forum that your character level will start to slow your learning rate of new skills.

Past character level 15 the effect starts to become significant and by the mid 20s your learning rate is slowed greatly.

Assuming those learning rate formulas haven’t changed, there is a downside to power leveling your main character through smithing. Still great for those companions though.

 

[Maximum997]

I found out somewhere else on this forum that your character level will start to slow your learning rate of new skills.

Past character level 15 the effect starts to become significant and by the mid 20s your learning rate is slowed greatly.

Assuming those learning rate formulas haven’t changed, there is a downside to power leveling your main character through smithing. Still great for those companions though.

It is true, but it is not that bad.

For sxample:
At lvl 1 you have 1.8 bonus
At lvl 25 0,57

From 10 stats and 5 focus points it is around x5 bonuses

So difference between lvl 0 and lvl 25 is x5,5 vs x6.7 learning rate. And this difference will dissapear very fast.(becouse you will gain lvls)
25 focus points and 8 stats will be much better then this bonus from low lvl.

So you will learn your skills much faster, becouse you have 5 focus points in every skill you want and a lot of stats.

 

[wokkawokka666]

It breaks the game because you can just give a faction a sword each time for peace. The javelins are also game breaking.

The majority of the economy in this game is annoying and ****ed. There's so little pleasure in trading from settlement to settlement but overall, even that rote monotony is better than this ****ing endless grind of pointless battle after battle for NO loot and losing troops that require 2-3 ****ing horses each (and a **** ton of cash) alongside nothing paying out significantly enough to be worth the loss in manpower.

Yeah, the forge is broke, too. Big surprise. At least there's a chance I can make a quick 1k to support my two useless, skill-less companions that suck up gold endlessly, and my maybe 2-3 tier V horse cav that keep me from getting completely overrun everytime I accidentally fight looters or another dip**** group of pointless NPCs in a village.

Seriously. These forums do more to harm development at this point - with the fruitless "oh this doesn't work for me, dev mommy please change diaper!" - than simply leaving the game the **** alone and letting modders fix it in 1-2 months.