well, if you have right troops...
750 vs. 1750 defending a castle:
including 10 lords and queen
including 10 lords and queen
How to beat Elintor in .8
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clock4orange said:well, if you have right troops...
750 vs. 1750 defending a castle:
including 10 lords and queen
yea i farm paladins of the faith their preety much the best troops in the game they destroy everything on the field and in sieges.
Talinoth
Knight
I find the Elves very scary in the field - the Elintoran Knights, Moon Knights, and Elites are powerful and I hate fighting Archduke Berlaeduil and Queen Arwen in open field combat, my knights are just weaker.
But oddly enough, I've had extreme success in siege combat of all things. The Tolranian Lords I poached from King Torlian actually field surprisingly good archers, and I also poached Valthauionnon and Merisirduil from the Elintor. I've also still got quite a large collection of my own Elintoran Rangers.
I just move cavalry in front of archers and infantry in front of cavalry, while keeping Alindel (Surgeon 10/Wound Management 10/First Aid 10), Slyter (Engineer 10, Spotting 10, Pathfinding 10) and my Elintoran Master Scout (gives me Pathfinding 10+4) as far away from the action as possible;
[Walls = '+']
[Infantry = 'I']
[Cavalry = 'C']
[Archers = 'A']
[Support = 'S']
+++++++++++++++++++++++++
+ Filthy Elves are here +
+++++++++++++++++++++++++
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-------CCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCC--------
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-------AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA--------
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It also helps massively that I bring a Darkforest Ranger Bow, 100 arrows, I have 430 proficiency, and I poach ammo liberally from my archers.
All companions are equipped with Bladed Crossbows/highest level bows they can wield (Zaira can use the Darkforest Ranger Bow too)/or Leaf Bombs.
I can't conquer the towns/castles in a single go though, because the Elintoran Noble Maidens are a very lethal infantry line and slice my knights/infantry into ribbons.
Instead, I clear all the archers I can from the walls, making sure to spam Battlecry for the sweet 42% group heal every time it's off cooldown, and retreat when my guys run out of ammo.
Trying to make the Big Push(TM) to win the siege in one go is always extremely costly because the AI is much better at defending from inside the walls than ON the walls. What happens, is if I use my Kingsman Poleaxe to knock out a Noble Maiden or two, the gap in the line allows 30 Rangers still at their spawn point to pincushion me with arrows. If I send my infantry/dismounted cavalry up, they just take insane losses as every gap from a dead Noble Maiden is filled with a hailstorm of arrows.
No, I find it's considerably more effective to fight from outside the walls, oddly enough, as that means more of my archers are firing at them than their archers are firing at me. As soon as I scale the walls I lose that advantage and sustain massive losses.
My archer line used to be comprised mainly of my own Elintoran troops, but attrition has meant that more of my archers are now Perisno Darkforest Rangers, rescued Tolranian Archers, and rescued Zann Longbowmen/Kheshigs/Swifthunters (I'm allied with the Zann). They're a bit weaker than the Elves but not THAT much weaker, and they get the job done.
I bring around 370 men, and occasionally 2-5 allied lords, and I'm winning. But only in sieges.
Open field combat is much more dangerous. The Elves excel at destroying my knights in hilly terrain. Oddly, I win easily in VERY long range archery matches or by directly ramming my entire army into them at close range on flat fields, but in mixed chaotic skirmishes on bumpy uneven ground where Elven horse archers can shine (see: most of the crappy terrain north-east of Lille), I take huge losses even when I bring a much larger army. Berlaeduil and his Moon Knights can go eat a gentleman's sausage.
But oddly enough, I've had extreme success in siege combat of all things. The Tolranian Lords I poached from King Torlian actually field surprisingly good archers, and I also poached Valthauionnon and Merisirduil from the Elintor. I've also still got quite a large collection of my own Elintoran Rangers.
I just move cavalry in front of archers and infantry in front of cavalry, while keeping Alindel (Surgeon 10/Wound Management 10/First Aid 10), Slyter (Engineer 10, Spotting 10, Pathfinding 10) and my Elintoran Master Scout (gives me Pathfinding 10+4) as far away from the action as possible;
[Walls = '+']
[Infantry = 'I']
[Cavalry = 'C']
[Archers = 'A']
[Support = 'S']
+++++++++++++++++++++++++
+ Filthy Elves are here +
+++++++++++++++++++++++++
---------------------------------------------
---------------------------------------------
---------------------------------------------
-------IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII--------
---------------------------------------------
-------CCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCC--------
---------------------------------------------
-------AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA--------
---------------------------------------------
---------------------------------------------
---------------------------------------------
----------------------S---------------------
---------------------------------------------
It also helps massively that I bring a Darkforest Ranger Bow, 100 arrows, I have 430 proficiency, and I poach ammo liberally from my archers.
All companions are equipped with Bladed Crossbows/highest level bows they can wield (Zaira can use the Darkforest Ranger Bow too)/or Leaf Bombs.
I can't conquer the towns/castles in a single go though, because the Elintoran Noble Maidens are a very lethal infantry line and slice my knights/infantry into ribbons.
Instead, I clear all the archers I can from the walls, making sure to spam Battlecry for the sweet 42% group heal every time it's off cooldown, and retreat when my guys run out of ammo.
Trying to make the Big Push(TM) to win the siege in one go is always extremely costly because the AI is much better at defending from inside the walls than ON the walls. What happens, is if I use my Kingsman Poleaxe to knock out a Noble Maiden or two, the gap in the line allows 30 Rangers still at their spawn point to pincushion me with arrows. If I send my infantry/dismounted cavalry up, they just take insane losses as every gap from a dead Noble Maiden is filled with a hailstorm of arrows.
No, I find it's considerably more effective to fight from outside the walls, oddly enough, as that means more of my archers are firing at them than their archers are firing at me. As soon as I scale the walls I lose that advantage and sustain massive losses.
My archer line used to be comprised mainly of my own Elintoran troops, but attrition has meant that more of my archers are now Perisno Darkforest Rangers, rescued Tolranian Archers, and rescued Zann Longbowmen/Kheshigs/Swifthunters (I'm allied with the Zann). They're a bit weaker than the Elves but not THAT much weaker, and they get the job done.
I bring around 370 men, and occasionally 2-5 allied lords, and I'm winning. But only in sieges.
Open field combat is much more dangerous. The Elves excel at destroying my knights in hilly terrain. Oddly, I win easily in VERY long range archery matches or by directly ramming my entire army into them at close range on flat fields, but in mixed chaotic skirmishes on bumpy uneven ground where Elven horse archers can shine (see: most of the crappy terrain north-east of Lille), I take huge losses even when I bring a much larger army. Berlaeduil and his Moon Knights can go eat a gentleman's sausage.
Sri Singha Mura
Sergeant
Lille siege is kinda broken since Elintorians spawn at the back of 2 unpassable wagons blocking a passage
While at first we managed to kill the ones near the wagons, the others were far from reach of our weapons and then they began unloading a crazy amount of arrows at us. A lot of my troops died trying to get to the other side which we never could, we were shot to pieces like "shooting fish in a barrel". Had to retreat and resiege Lille and finally wipe out the defenders near the wall.
While at first we managed to kill the ones near the wagons, the others were far from reach of our weapons and then they began unloading a crazy amount of arrows at us. A lot of my troops died trying to get to the other side which we never could, we were shot to pieces like "shooting fish in a barrel". Had to retreat and resiege Lille and finally wipe out the defenders near the wall.
Sri Singha Mura
Sergeant
I have the PBODless_P08.3.zip patch I downloaded in Jan 30,2017. Oh.......I didn't notice that there was another patch update in Jan 31,2017. My bad.
EspaFrost
Recruit
In my playthrough I'm playing an Elf trying to help Queen Arwen spread the Elf Blight across all of Perisno. . and Hakkon and Tolranian are at our throats all day long!
Managed to get the alliance of the Geldar in on our side though
If this combined effort continues then I'll have to turn on my Queen and start pushing with the other teams haha
Managed to get the alliance of the Geldar in on our side though
If this combined effort continues then I'll have to turn on my Queen and start pushing with the other teams haha
DurgePurge
Recruit
Like above posters have said, the Elintor aren't as terrifying when you realize that with the proper units, you can beat them at their own game.
I like to outfit my Ladies of the Burning Lion (Household Guards) with Persino Flatbows when going up against Elintor and I find that having a whole firing line of them + Darkforest Archers protected by a shieldwall of Perisno Champions and Tolranian Kingsmen allows them to easily outgun their firing lines while minimizing casualties for our side. By now I would have hoped that my Holy Champions would have taught their lords a valuable lesson about using horse-archers as melee cavalry, but alas, Elintorans can be a hard-headed lot.
I like to outfit my Ladies of the Burning Lion (Household Guards) with Persino Flatbows when going up against Elintor and I find that having a whole firing line of them + Darkforest Archers protected by a shieldwall of Perisno Champions and Tolranian Kingsmen allows them to easily outgun their firing lines while minimizing casualties for our side. By now I would have hoped that my Holy Champions would have taught their lords a valuable lesson about using horse-archers as melee cavalry, but alas, Elintorans can be a hard-headed lot.
Perisno 0.811: Well I eliminated Elintor as first faction in my way.
After Zann Invasion I started my Kingdom from Forniron. As Tolarian Marshal I took Forniron from Zann & then rebelled. (Also completing Forniron for Geldar quest.) Then made Tamaris, Marcus, Dietrich as Vassals. In few days I besieged and captured Elsinore with 4-5 Vassals and Remus's guards. Then any castle they took from Tolaranians, I took it from them. But failed miserably to take Serin Castle. The three direction Arrow fire killed even most elite troops b4 reaching to melee. So I got a truce. Again after some days, Elintor started taking Tolranian castles. I saw opportunity, and declared war again. Imprisoned their lords. and took all castles except Serin.
The last Battle for Serin took almost 300 lost & 700 wounded on my side to kill 700 Elintoran defenders.But finally they lost. I had more than 2000 allies and still in siege map both sides had almost 75-75 soldiers.
Settings: Easy, Player level 32, Battle Size 150.
My major forces were Tolaranian Kingsman, and Highelf Archers(Noble). But allies were mixed.
(Now I took Lille from Zann with 2 sally defeats by infantry army & 3 consecutive sieges by pure Archer Army. Last 800 units were taken in one go.So Now I am King of Elintor.)
After Zann Invasion I started my Kingdom from Forniron. As Tolarian Marshal I took Forniron from Zann & then rebelled. (Also completing Forniron for Geldar quest.) Then made Tamaris, Marcus, Dietrich as Vassals. In few days I besieged and captured Elsinore with 4-5 Vassals and Remus's guards. Then any castle they took from Tolaranians, I took it from them. But failed miserably to take Serin Castle. The three direction Arrow fire killed even most elite troops b4 reaching to melee. So I got a truce. Again after some days, Elintor started taking Tolranian castles. I saw opportunity, and declared war again. Imprisoned their lords. and took all castles except Serin.
The last Battle for Serin took almost 300 lost & 700 wounded on my side to kill 700 Elintoran defenders.But finally they lost. I had more than 2000 allies and still in siege map both sides had almost 75-75 soldiers.
Settings: Easy, Player level 32, Battle Size 150.
My major forces were Tolaranian Kingsman, and Highelf Archers(Noble). But allies were mixed.
(Now I took Lille from Zann with 2 sally defeats by infantry army & 3 consecutive sieges by pure Archer Army. Last 800 units were taken in one go.So Now I am King of Elintor.)
Darkstar13
Recruit
Perisno Newb here.. Just wanted to discuss the Elintor. I read in multiple guides (which must be out-dated) that Elintor archers are their major strong point. I have been playing with the new feature that makes bows weaker vs. armor while crossbows have great armor penetration. And I would like to leave the feature on for that extra challenge, but I am wondering if it may be too big of a nerf.
In battle against the Tolranians, I see that most of their troops are real arrow sponges, and most times my Elintor archers have exhausted their ammo before even making a dent in their army. I don't know if the reason is that Tolranian Lords are able to insta-spam heavy infantry along with household and elite troops. But I am wondering what viable strategies others use against heavily armored armies. The only way I have been able to have any success is relying on mercenaries (crossbows and heavy cavalry) which amount to 2/3rds of my army. So I am wondering, with that feature turned on, is an Elintor centric army viable towards end game? I am a vassal currently but don't have access to household troops quite yet. So I just wanted to know what other people think and if there is something I may be missing.
In battle against the Tolranians, I see that most of their troops are real arrow sponges, and most times my Elintor archers have exhausted their ammo before even making a dent in their army. I don't know if the reason is that Tolranian Lords are able to insta-spam heavy infantry along with household and elite troops. But I am wondering what viable strategies others use against heavily armored armies. The only way I have been able to have any success is relying on mercenaries (crossbows and heavy cavalry) which amount to 2/3rds of my army. So I am wondering, with that feature turned on, is an Elintor centric army viable towards end game? I am a vassal currently but don't have access to household troops quite yet. So I just wanted to know what other people think and if there is something I may be missing.
Yep, the nerf/buff were too big in 0.8. I overdid it. In PNB more moderate numbers are used, and so they will be in 0.9.
It also depends on what elven archers you use. To pierce the armor of tolranian champions you need crimson rangers or at least just rangers. Some bowmen won't do.
It also depends on what elven archers you use. To pierce the armor of tolranian champions you need crimson rangers or at least just rangers. Some bowmen won't do.
Darkstar13
Recruit
Ah okay. Thanks for saving me from all the pain and heartache. I turned the feature off for now. I'm looking forward to having it back on when its more finely tuned.
Darkstar13
Recruit
The Elintoran archer troop-line is already viable if you turn off the Realistic Ranged Damage setting under Game Options in the Camp Menu. They are superb archers and are also very good in melee. You want to have almost a 1:1 ratio of archers and horse archers in open field battles to make you're army shine, and I usually have some infantry in reserve from mercenaries. I like to use the Freelancers or the custom units from the Mercenary Guild.
But if you really do want to buff Elintor (and not break the game making them OP) than increase the proficiency modifier around 25 - 35 points, and/or add another point in Power Draw for their units.
But if you really do want to buff Elintor (and not break the game making them OP) than increase the proficiency modifier around 25 - 35 points, and/or add another point in Power Draw for their units.
