Feature Requests

[Steffenximus]

I'm sure this has been addressed over and over and I'm sorry to  bother you about this minor inconvenience but the bullet drop rate seems a bit too high for my liking. Correct me if I'm wrong as I know about early firearms but shouldn't the drop rate for the bullet be a bit lower? Right now it's basically a crossbow with a new skin.

Also, army AI. When joining an ally into battle I find that both my ally and the enemy find a defensive spot and hold ground. The player can't lure the enemy out by small cavalry harassment, and as you've stated, blindly charging in just gets you killed. Especially when some 75% of your force consists of allied units you can't control.
Both armies charge after the player gets killed, so as it is now I've been harassing the enemy together with my cavalry in the hopes of chipping off a few high-end units before I go down. The rest is up to my army, meaning tactics, as well as any other player intervention, gets effectively stomped out. Not fun.

And about tactics, have you considered (I'm sure you have and that there's a perfectly fine reason as to why it isn't implemented) allowing the player and the AI to form ranks? I dislike having my troops either form a line that spans from one end to the map to the other (slightly exaggerated). This means it'll take ages to maneuver troops to where they're needed. Right now the only alternative to that AFAIK would be ordering the troops to move closer and form a big blob of flesh; a dream come true for enemy archers.

Cheers,

About bullet drops, increase your looting skill and you'll find much better equipment, not just bullets.

As for the AI tactics, just have a little patience, eventually one of the army charges. you could also advance your shield infantry with the ranged units right behind them up to the point where your ranged units (preferably firearms) are devastating, while they being mostly protected by the infantry's shields. At the same time you can take the cavalry and mounted companions in a flanking position, then order a full attack with infantry and cavalry, you spearheading the attack, attracting the enemy's attention thus preventing your troops from being killed.

You can also order your troops to Stand Closer, thus reducing that long line you hate.

 

[Untitled.]

Thanks for the tips, but I like bullets D: I just don't think it's realistic that a bullet behaves the same way as an arrow.

Oh, also, while I'm posting, what are the "Army of Light" and "Army of Darkness"? I raided an enemy village and noticed my relation with the Army of Light deteriorated.

 

[Steffenximus]

Thanks for the tips, but I like bullets D: I just don't think it's realistic that a bullet behaves the same way as an arrow.

Oh, also, while I'm posting, what are the "Army of Light" and "Army of Darkness"? I raided an enemy village and noticed my relation with the Army of Light deteriorated.

This mod isn't supposed to be 100% realistic, after all we do have Undead hordes (skeletons) and Death Knights roaming around 

Armies of Light are the Templars. They're pretty strong and have large sized parties. Death Knights are the Armies of Darkness, these guys are in the range of 2k-3k at number.

 

[Hallegra]

Thanks for the tips, but I like bullets D: I just don't think it's realistic that a bullet behaves the same way as an arrow.

Oh, also, while I'm posting, what are the "Army of Light" and "Army of Darkness"? I raided an enemy village and noticed my relation with the Army of Light deteriorated.

In order to encounter the armies of light and darkness, you need to play on 'Mommy' difficulty. The army of light is basically a fanatical group of templars, and the army of darkness an evil horde of cultists. Even then, you can choose when they show up (Day of Doom), either on the first day or the thirtieth day.
Apparently the hardest thing to do is play on mommy difficulty with a peasant revolutionary and day of doom day 1.

Also, while this mod may have fantastical parts to it, it's also a tactically realistic mod, which is what xeno intended for it. Unfortunately, Mount and Blade's engine doesn't allow you to have perfect bullet dynamics just because of how it's built. The most you can do is create a projectile and increase its speed a hundredfold. What is a bullet but a more strongly-propelled, differently-shaped arrow?

On an off-note, if you want perfectly accurate projectiles, look elsewhere. Bullets do drop over time. The maximum range of on a M4 Carbine is about 500 metres, with an M16A2 rifle having an effective range of 600 metres, and both these statistics are if the guns are tilted upwards at maybe 40 degree angle. And these are modern age weapons, not the primitive gunpowder firearms of the age of Blood and Steel, so one of the guns in the mod would have a significantly lower effective range, as well as accuracy. Altogether, I think it's done quite well.

(In Xeno I Trust)TM.

 

[nilloc93]

On an off-note, if you want perfectly accurate projectiles, look elsewhere. Bullets do drop over time. The maximum range of on a M4 Carbine is about 500 metres, with an M16A2 rifle having an effective range of 600 metres, and both these statistics are if the guns are tilted upwards at maybe 40 degree angle. And these are modern age weapons, not the primitive gunpowder firearms of the age of Blood and Steel, so one of the guns in the mod would have a significantly lower effective range, as well as accuracy. Altogether, I think it's done quite well.

no no no, an M4 can hit a target at 500M without a 40 degree tilt, effective range in the maximum range a weapon is designed to shoot accurately.
in reality at a 40 degree angle coming out of a carbine at around 3000 FPS a round could travel over 3 miles before air resistance and wind destabilized the round
the bullet drop in this mod is a bit extreme but its easy to compensate for and thus not worth xenos time changing it

 

[Hallegra]

My bad, I was looking at an incorrect source. The actual average speed of a bullet in the U.S. is around 600 m/s. It would have to be significantly lower to only go 500m with a 40 degree tilt.

 

[Untitled.]

Yeah, this is a very tactically realistic mod, and one of the few mods to have lethal combat. But it's not like any of these things are gamebreaking so I guess I'll just get used to them.
Thanks for the help guys.

 

[Evelyn]

On an off-note, if you want perfectly accurate projectiles, look elsewhere. Bullets do drop over time. The maximum range of on a M4 Carbine is about 500 metres, with an M16A2 rifle having an effective range of 600 metres, and both these statistics are if the guns are tilted upwards at maybe 40 degree angle. And these are modern age weapons, not the primitive gunpowder firearms of the age of Blood and Steel, so one of the guns in the mod would have a significantly lower effective range, as well as accuracy. Altogether, I think it's done quite well.

no no no, an M4 can hit a target at 500M without a 40 degree tilt, effective range in the maximum range a weapon is designed to shoot accurately.
in reality at a 40 degree angle coming out of a carbine at around 3000 FPS a round could travel over 3 miles before air resistance and wind destabilized the round
the bullet drop in this mod is a bit extreme but its easy to compensate for and thus not worth xenos time changing it

You mean a 45 degree angle? Because at 40 degrees you would be aiming at the ground.

 

[xenoargh]

Bullet velocity is somewhere near where the engine breaks atm; bullets that go a lot faster would just pass right through people.

In terms of the impact on ranges, a major problem with the engine is that while it's quite possible for shots to go quite a bit farther than they do at their current velocities, the AI only aims upwards maybe 10-15 degrees, and literally cannot fire anywhere near the real-world max ranges.  Try shooting a Jezzail sometime; in theory, on a good day, you could hit and kill somebody a kilometer away with one (and I have occasionally done do) but you need to adjust for drop very considerably to do so.  If all of that worked something like the real world, it'd be pretty tempting to try and make battlefields big enough that the real differences in range would be a much bigger factor (and ammo conservation might become a major consideration if you didn't have a bunch of reloads available).

There are other considerations, too; early firearms really didn't have a lot longer effective ranges than the heavier crossbows, which were able to kill people in armor at 400 meters+ occasionally.  In most cases, early musketry was significantly less accurate than crossbows, as well; I fudge that a bit in this mod, because I'm largely simulating the changes in the base of fire as firearms proliferated, etc.

 

[nilloc93]

You mean a 45 degree angle? Because at 40 degrees you would be aiming at the ground.

blue = 40 degrees
red = 45 degrees

how on earth can you come to the idea that 5 degrees would change the direction by 85 degrees?

 

[nilloc93]

i was just thinking it would be awsome if when you upgraded a fief(such as a village) you could go into the village and accually see the upgrades (manor especially).

and what would this do aside from basic visual upgrades

 

[Untitled.]

Lemme take a wild stab and say; nothing.

 

[Evelyn]

I assumed we were scaling it to 90 as opposed to 180, had a bit of a geometryderp.

 

[elkillo]

i was just thinking it would be awsome if when you upgraded a fief(such as a village) you could go into the village and accually see the upgrades (manor especially).

and what would this do aside from basic visual upgrades

if you fought there you could use the manor as a place to defend and the watch tower upgrade could be used to house archers more for RP sake then much else

 

[nilloc93]

i was just thinking it would be awsome if when you upgraded a fief(such as a village) you could go into the village and accually see the upgrades (manor especially).

and what would this do aside from basic visual upgrades

if you fought there you could use the manor as a place to defend and the watch tower upgrade could be used to house archers more for RP sake then much else

that would have to be a MASSIVE watchtower to fit my 200 ranged units in, and if the manor would act as a castle with no walls it would just be a maze of pathfinding errors

 

[xenoargh]

I'd have to duplicate every single village Scene and make a special version, etc., etc.

I really don't think it's practical unless somebody wants to do all of the Scene editing, including the AI mesh work, which would take even a really expert scener a week or two.  If that happened, I'd find time to write the code, which I'd estimate would take 3-4 days and a week of testing. 

I really have a lot of other things I'd rather do with my time, guys; sorry but no

 

[elkillo]

point taken

 

[Hallegra]

I'd be willing to do it in my spare time, but I'd need a short tutorial I think. Once a designer got the base model for each of the buildings set up, it wouldn't be too hard. I think it'd make for a really immersive experience. Might make things TOO in-depth, though

 

[here2peer]

Wouldn't it be fun to have Diplomacy and Pre-Battle orders & deployment?
Diplomacy (S) mod: http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php/board,176.0.html
Features of the mod: http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php/topic,116424.0.html#post_features

 

[Hallegra]

Wouldn't it be fun to have Diplomacy and Pre-Battle orders & deployment?
Diplomacy (S) mod: http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php/board,176.0.html
Features of the mod: http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php/topic,116424.0.html#post_features

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