Yeah I can see that, good point.
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Is there an MMR system?
- Thread starter Stovee
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Yeah I can see that, good point.
The problem of pre-made vs. randoms is a classic one. On the one hand, it sucks not to play with your friends, but on the other hand it's a bit silly to have one team be six people who've been playing together for years in a very similar game play newbies or even decent to good players that haven't grouped up before the match.
The solutions also hinge a lot on population (e.g., big MOBAs or CS can force you into specific pools because they have the huge populations to pull it off).
However, for the sake of actually decent matches, I'd probably rather the devs stopped people from being able to group (or added some cap like max 2 people in a group). Ideally, I guess you'd have some adaptive system that first tried to pair groups together based on number and then grabbed solo players or smaller groups as needed (some proper ELO would obv be great, but that's another convo).
The solutions also hinge a lot on population (e.g., big MOBAs or CS can force you into specific pools because they have the huge populations to pull it off).
However, for the sake of actually decent matches, I'd probably rather the devs stopped people from being able to group (or added some cap like max 2 people in a group). Ideally, I guess you'd have some adaptive system that first tried to pair groups together based on number and then grabbed solo players or smaller groups as needed (some proper ELO would obv be great, but that's another convo).
I'd once again suggest taking inspiration from Dota 2.
Give every player two separate MMR ratings - Solo and party. Also stacks should be treated as having slightly higher ELO to compensate for the premade coordination.
It's the only viable solution I can think of for BL as I don't think we're going to have a big enough player pool for separate queues, and as I said before, I really don't think stopping people from playing together is a good idea.
Give every player two separate MMR ratings - Solo and party. Also stacks should be treated as having slightly higher ELO to compensate for the premade coordination.
It's the only viable solution I can think of for BL as I don't think we're going to have a big enough player pool for separate queues, and as I said before, I really don't think stopping people from playing together is a good idea.
Yeah I feel like a temporary solution is desperately needed as currently I'm finding that stacks tend to roll the other team (at least for NA servers). This will put off beginners from playing modes like Skirmish more and slowly kill off the multiplayer player base. A temporary fix like preventing people from grouping is also not ideal cause a lot of people (including myself) prefer queuing/playing with friends.
I think for now either a simple MMR system should be implemented or at least prioritize matching group stacks against other group stacks. In the future, a ranked ELO system like the one present in Overwatch would be good.
I think for now either a simple MMR system should be implemented or at least prioritize matching group stacks against other group stacks. In the future, a ranked ELO system like the one present in Overwatch would be good.
Yeah, I agree it's not a good idea to stop people from playing together, but it's still probably the better of two bad choices in the short term (e.g., stacked teams vs. no groups).
Although, tbh, it's kind of an empirical question dependent on what percentage of people playing MP are playing it in a group and what percentage are playing it solo.
However, you are of course right that there are more clever solutions that can be used (but those might not be possible any time soon).
we need any elo system first than 2 different ones
What a great idea!
Let's make the already annoyed competitive players that have to deal with this mess of unbalanced combat system not be able to play with their friends or clan in the only serious and "meaningful" gamemode there is for Early Access until private servers come soon™. I mean, what could go wrong right? Please, for the love of god.
MMR too hard? Balance it with winrate. I mean, it can't be easier than that, but judging at the fact that TW did not listen neither on Alpha or Beta when they only had to focus on fixing MP and adding or removing player's suggestions I HIGHLY doubt that they're gonna add anything when they are most likely directing all of their resources to SP which is where 90% of the game's population is right now.
It's truly a shame that a company I held in such high regard really decided to launch this disaster of early access and is not being held accountable because people are just drooling at the few decent features that SP has and that they have been waiting for years and just overshadowed the more than 9,000 negative reviews across all platforms (that accounts for 1/5 of the total reviews btw)
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Nothing will change probably skirmish will be dead after a few months except for clan stack v clan stack and the odd random pubstar, if community servers are ever implemented most people will just play that. Even most of the tryhard players will be playing community servers and avoiding trash TW matchmaking entirely
they probably should mp first after the sp bugfixes. Most of the SP community wont open the game anyways for a year or smth, till mods and new features are out.
So basically how Warband was...
Stacks are way more problematic than lack of MMR imo, parties should be put into different matchmaking (duos can queue in both solos and parties). Just make it clear in the queue that you are in the party queue and so might expect a longer wait time.
Agreed. At least a temporary solution should be implemented as soon as possible.
ye agree too. Playing with 5 friends bashing new people isn't even fun. Only if you happen to meet another 6 stack.
Limiting party size to 2 people will help skirmish overall
Limiting party size to 2 people will help skirmish overall
I think I'm gonna give multiplayer matchmaking a miss until some sort of basic system to sort people into balanced teams is implemented.
I'm noticing that joining the queue straight after I finish a game puts me in with the same people over and over. I can abuse this by quitting skirmish games until I see that both teams are crap, then rejoin the queue ASAP as it finishes and keep abusing them for wins.
Not to mention, there is no penalty for leaving a game, so if I run into a 6 stack I can just leave in the warm up phase and don't have to deal with that ****.
I'm noticing that joining the queue straight after I finish a game puts me in with the same people over and over. I can abuse this by quitting skirmish games until I see that both teams are crap, then rejoin the queue ASAP as it finishes and keep abusing them for wins.
Not to mention, there is no penalty for leaving a game, so if I run into a 6 stack I can just leave in the warm up phase and don't have to deal with that ****.
I don't know if it's better for MP to have it be months of "pros" or clans stomping on newbies and randoms.
We'll need some sort of population to support MP, so really any fast solution depends on how many groups are really playing. If it turns out MP is mostly groups, then it's probably better to accept the stomp. If it turns out MP is mostly people playing solo, then it's probably better to inconvenience groups.
Again, I don't think any of the solutions that are easy to implement are ideal, but we're talking about a game that doesn't have customer hosted servers yet, at this point it's all triage for MP.
Although I wouldn't at all dispute MP being a mess (and the game in general needing a lot of work), it does make a lot of logical sense that TW are focusing on SP. Even Warband MP was never a big MP game (at least not compared to the number of people that played SP), although we can of course debate how much of that was due to a lack of support for MP from the devs.
I'm just not sure competitive gaming or MP were ever really things TW focused on or were particularly good at (and this is my view was someone who played MP for Warband since the earliest days of the Beta).
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Limiting party size is not the way to go. Put in an MMR system.
As someone who plays with a full stack, it can get a little boring pubstomping. I wish they would split the queue as long as there is enough people to manage it. I would much rather fight pre made teams or at least people queued up with a party of 3 or more. Implementing something like that would be awesome.
Limiting Party size would punish people with friends, only lonesome freaks would like that idea.
I agree, if you remove the part where the People with friends have fun, you give them a reason don't playing this game at all.
