Death in Battle hurts Lategame

[Arkyll]

Correct me if this is wrong, but Death in Battle seems to make it so that Lords can die in battles that you fight in.

So essentially this translates to the faction that you are fighting for, and the factions you are fighting, will lose heads whereas factions notorious for snowballing (not naming) on the other side of the map are totally out of the equation.

Your faction, and those around it will lose nobles at a substantially higher rate than the others, basically.

Im pretty damn far into the game now and I can see this in action. Battania (my faction), now has fewer clans and fewer lords than any other faction and are having to marry lots of foreigners because everyone left is old or already married. I tried marrying my sister to a Battanian lord and couldnt because there werent any.

Why cant this be applied to auto-resolved battles aswell? I mean, thats the solution at a glance isnt it?

The other I can think of is that the death rate definitely needs to be lowered. I can't pinpoint it because sometimes you won't get any deaths for ages, or lose a whopping 3 lords of the realm as I did just now.

EDIT: It turns out that lords CAN die in random battles however its clear that the ratio of this occuring outside of a fought battle and inside one are totally lopsided. In my game, the Khuzaits have only lost a single lord in battle, whereas Battania, Vlandia and Empire have lost almost a dozen each.

 

[Galvar]

Exactly. You're the Grim Reaper. If you don't avoid big battles, with a little bit of bad luck, you can ruin your campaign in a couple of wars.

The excuse for it being that way is that they supposedly want to test issues related to death, but it's been like this for a long time and I haven't seen them commenting on it. I wonder whether they just forgot about it.

I just want some communication on it - are they waiting for more feedback and bug reports, struggling with balancing death in AI battles or what?

 

[Kazzan]

Seems like the chance of death is higher when the player is taking part in a battle, which is broken if true.

Bannerlord should take inspiration from the nemesis system of Shadow of War and give each lord a Player Interaction Score that increases as players interact with and encounter them. With a high PIS the lords' chance of dying should decrease, but never to zero.

 

[ratschbumm]

On the other hand, as maximum, I once had four enemy Khuzait lords killed. It was a battle of their 2500 vs 2000 of mine, 14 -16 enemy lords at time. One my vassal was killed too, however.

 

[Blood Gryphon]

Exactly. You're the Grim Reaper. If you don't avoid big battles, with a little bit of bad luck, you can ruin your campaign in a couple of wars.

The excuse for it being that way is that they supposedly want to test issues related to death, but it's been like this for a long time and I haven't seen them commenting on it. I wonder whether they just forgot about it.

I just want some communication on it - are they waiting for more feedback and bug reports, struggling with balancing death in AI battles or what?

Here is the last word on it.

Beyond that it couples with game difficulty options that may affect some of the mission related bits as well. Finally, yes, balance (of companion / ai lord death %) is also something that we are discussing. The latter is not terribly urgent in my view, because the potentially too high amount of death around the player serves to expose issues related to it.

"Not terribly urgent in my view", while it is just his opinion it is a clear indication they are focusing on other things now. Don't expect any changes here for a while.

 

[Mad Vader]

Greetings beta testers of Calradia.
I think Taleworlds needs to step up from their "players=testers" attitude and get the best version of the game with every patch as if it's release day.
It's fine if they want to stress test a particular feature, but that's for dedicated beta testers, not their paying customers.
Besides, how will they balance the death rates if they don't try to find the right death rate? If it's "not urgent" to do this now, when it will be urgent? Are they telling us their EA will last much longer and the actual release is "not urgent"? Speculation is fun and also not urgent.

 

[Arkyll]

Greetings beta testers of Calradia.
I think Taleworlds needs to step up from their "players=testers" attitude and get the best version of the game with every patch as if it's release day.
It's fine if they want to stress test a particular feature, but that's for dedicated beta testers, not their paying customers.
Besides, how will they balance the death rates if they don't try to find the right death rate? If it's "not urgent" to do this now, when it will be urgent? Are they telling us their EA will last much longer and the actual release is "not urgent"? Speculation is fun and also not urgent.

We did purchase the game in Early Access knowing that it wouldnt be complete though.

But yeah, I would rather this stuff show up in the Beta versions and not pollute the full releases with broken test mechanics that only serve to kill off the game the more you play it.

I would rather that the death in battle feature not be sneakily made mandatory. My faction is struggling to fight wars it should be winning because of the sparsity of lords, and I am having to play executioner to balance the tides, which isnt the sorta LARP character I was going for.

 

[nyarlathotep1975]

Duh_TaleWorlds said:


Beyond that it couples with game difficulty options that may affect some of the mission related bits as well. Finally, yes, balance (of companion / ai lord death %) is also something that we are discussing. The latter is not terribly urgent in my view, because the potentially too high amount of death around the player serves to expose issues related to it.
In other words: you paid and it´s to late for refund, so who would give a **** about what you want or need?

 

[Midnitewolf]

We did purchase the game in Early Access knowing that it wouldnt be complete though.

But yeah, I would rather this stuff show up in the Beta versions and not pollute the full releases with broken test mechanics that only serve to kill off the game the more you play it.

I would rather that the death in battle feature not be sneakily made mandatory. My faction is struggling to fight wars it should be winning because of the sparsity of lords, and I am having to play executioner to balance the tides, which isnt the sorta LARP character I was going for.

Yeah we players are such gullible idiots it isn't even funny. Why we give these developers full price for the "Honor" of getting to play in the buggy mess of "Early Access" is beyond me. I remember when Beta testers got the game for free as Developers way of thanking us for volunteering our precious time and effort to the help them test their games. We sure got sold swampland and for some reason we still think of it as prime costal real estate, well as soon the tides go out and the swamps drain anyway.

In other words: you paid and it´s to late for refund, so who would give a **** about what you want or need?

Yep another issue with buying into an "Early Access". They already got our money, finishing the game isn't going to change that meaning there is very little incentive for them to devote all hands on deck efforts or even add in the missing features. I hate to say it but my experiences have been that a developer will devote all hands on deck effort to get a game just finished enough to "Release" a game on Early Access. Then take the money from that Early Access and devote 90% of that money and about that same amount of their development team to another project. Then the skeleton crew left over, will take their own sweet time "Finishing" the game, doing just enough to make it look like their is significant progress or at even if it isn't actual progress, move piles of work around to make it look like something happening.

 

[AlexTheCat]

I'm going to go against the current here. I really enjoy this game. I knew it wouldn't be "complete" for a while. But, so far, It is so much better than warband native. Side note: when a 1257 mod comes out that'll be the only thing I play. I like the death in battle (well, I don't like it). It adds a risk aspect that doesn't generally exist in other games. It sucks when a companion I've grown fond of dies. But, hey, that's war. It's kind of like what makes gambling fun. you can turn off death if you'd like. I remember when this first came out a review said something like "basically a prettier version of warband... So, the best game ever". I don't feel cheated. I waited for this game. I bought it. I feel good about it. I'm not trying to start a fight.

 

[Nodice83]

I'm going to go against the current here. I really enjoy this game. I knew it wouldn't be "complete" for a while. But, so far, It is so much better than warband native. Side note: when a 1257 mod comes out that'll be the only thing I play. I like the death in battle (well, I don't like it). It adds a risk aspect that doesn't generally exist in other games. It sucks when a companion I've grown fond of dies. But, hey, that's war. It's kind of like what makes gambling fun. you can turn off death if you'd like. I remember when this first came out a review said something like "basically a prettier version of warband... So, the best game ever". I don't feel cheated. I waited for this game. I bought it. I feel good about it. I'm not trying to start a fight.

How long have you played it so far ?

 

[AlexTheCat]

How long have you played it so far ?

almost embarrassed to say 1000 hours. I bought it the first week.

 

[Nodice83]

almost embarrassed to say 1000 hours. I bought it the first week.

Then i must say i admire your attitude and honesty. After 500 hr of my gameplay i figured out there is not much to be done there at the time. They started to implement some perks and things but it was never the hype i felt in those first 500 hrs (it is just 200 more now). I agree it was worth the money i paid for it, but i've had higher hopes for the game.

 

[AlexTheCat]

Then i must say i admire your attitude and honesty. After 500 hr of my gameplay i figured out there is not much to be done there at the time. They started to implement some perks and things but it was never the hype i felt in those first 500 hrs (it is just 200 more now). I agree it was worth the money i paid for it, but i've had higher hopes for the game.

I had higher hopes as well. But, to quote an ancient epic poem "you can't always get what you want". All said, in my opinion it's on the right track. I mean, I think bannerlord is a massive improvement on warband. And, when (eventually) the final release comes, everyone who doesn't like it will find a mod that makes them warm and fuzzy. I know this game isn't for everyone. I told my friends that I loved this game but if you're not a mount and blade person you probably won't like it.

 

[Nodice83]

I had higher hopes as well. But, to quote an ancient epic poem "you can't always get what you want". All said, in my opinion it's on the right track. I mean, I think bannerlord is a massive improvement on warband. And, when (eventually) the final release comes, everyone who doesn't like it will find a mod that makes them warm and fuzzy. I know this game isn't for everyone. I told my friends that I loved this game but if you're not a mount and blade person you probably won't like it.

As it turns out it is true - you can't. I will wait and see how they handle this 1.5.8 visual debacle and judge if it goes the right way. Nerfing stuff / improving mechanics made the game better imo but its still far from ideal and i am not saying anything about broken promises - just the implemented features. It is a massive improvement on Warband as the sequel can be, after how many years ...11,12 ? It is far superior in terms of graphiscs, and mechanics - modern computers can handle. I played original M&B and Warband shortly after releases - can still remember, similar exhaust of dopamine and serotonine i had back then I am pretty sure it lasted a bit longer. I hope i will re-approach improved Bannerlord in a quarter or so.. As for those people constatntly reminding to everybody in the forum that "the game will be better with mods" it is pointless to even comment.. I will strongly disagree this game is not for everyone though. It is far more approachable title to literally anybody than.. let say Warband.

 

[nyarlathotep1975]

I'm going to go against the current here. I really enjoy this game. I knew it wouldn't be "complete" for a while. But, so far, It is so much better than warband native. Side note: when a 1257 mod comes out that'll be the only thing I play. I like the death in battle (well, I don't like it). It adds a risk aspect that doesn't generally exist in other games. It sucks when a companion I've grown fond of dies. But, hey, that's war. It's kind of like what makes gambling fun. you can turn off death if you'd like. I remember when this first came out a review said something like "basically a prettier version of warband... So, the best game ever". I don't feel cheated. I waited for this game. I bought it. I feel good about it. I'm not trying to start a fight.

That´s not exactly the point. It´s an EA product and bugs are to be expected. The problem I have is, how they treat their customers. EA should still be an enjoyable experience. but they purposefully introduce bad mechanics for testing and the whole beta brench thing also seems fishy to me. also the fact that they keep so silent about their plans for the game is concerning. their planing seems just wrong to me
but that been said; impressive patients and positiv attitude, even afte 1k hours of gameplay.

 

[AlexTheCat]

That´s not exactly the point. It´s an EA product and bugs are to be expected. The problem I have is, how they treat their customers. EA should still be an enjoyable experience. but they purposefully introduce bad mechanics for testing and the whole beta brench thing also seems fishy to me. also the fact that they keep so silent about their plans for the game is concerning. their planing seems just wrong to me
but that been said; impressive patients and positiv attitude, even afte 1k hours of gameplay.

I don't understand why the beta would be fishy. Maybe you could explain. I think the silence is because if they say something and it doesn't work out people will be even more outraged than they are now. They can't respond to every post or everyone will expect a response and if they don't get one they'll be pissed. I don't think they purposefully add bad mechanics. If they do, they add it to the beta that you have to opt in to. EA is about trying new things. There are games that are complete that have aspects I hate. I feel like people get angrier at stuff they don't like in EA games than in "complete" games. I get the criticism, I disagree with most of it.

 

[nyarlathotep1975]

the beta is simply not necessary. why put in something in even worse shape? read the forum of any beta brench. people get very upset about it. that´s simply not needed. sure you could say nobody needs to play it, but people are curious and try it. why would they drive people into it if not to use them as test subjects? all it does is to create an unnessacery amount of angry players.
and about their silence, i don´t expect them to go into detail but for almost one year all we knew was that they work on stability and and bugs. so many people didn´t knew what or if there is something more to expect. only lately, after almost a year they confirmed new content. and even when it´s more then obvious that they need more then a year to develop the game, they keep silent about it. at least some idea they must have, so why not share it. don´t expect a release date but a little bit of open communication can´t be that dangerous. they already missed their starting idea about when they could finish and nobody got angry about it.

 

[AlexTheCat]

the beta is simply not necessary. why put in something in even worse shape? read the forum of any beta brench. people get very upset about it. that´s simply not needed. sure you could say nobody needs to play it, but people are curious and try it. why would they drive people into it if not to use them as test subjects? all it does is to create an unnessacery amount of angry players.
and about their silence, i don´t expect them to go into detail but for almost one year all we knew was that they work on stability and and bugs. so many people didn´t knew what or if there is something more to expect. only lately, after almost a year they confirmed new content. and even when it´s more then obvious that they need more then a year to develop the game, they keep silent about it. at least some idea they must have, so why not share it. don´t expect a release date but a little bit of open communication can´t be that dangerous. they already missed their starting idea about when they could finish and nobody got angry about it.

Well, the game needs to be tested one way or another. So, I wouldn't say beta is unnecessary. I agree with you in that I would like more communication from taleworlds. I wouldn't say they they drove people into it. There was a very devoted mount an blade community that waited for this for a long time. all they had to do was say "hey we made this new thing". You want to to see angry? go to the Baldurs Gate 3 forum. DnD folks get pissed when you mess with their stuff. But, again, I agree more communication would be the best the thing for everyone.

 

[nyarlathotep1975]

Well, the game needs to be tested one way or another. So, I wouldn't say beta is unnecessary. I agree with you in that I would like more communication from taleworlds. I wouldn't say they they drove people into it. There was a very devoted mount an blade community that waited for this for a long time. all they had to do was say "hey we made this new thing". You want to to see angry? go to the Baldurs Gate 3 forum. DnD folks get pissed when you mess with their stuff. But, again, I agree more communication would be the best the thing for everyone.

still think it´s not needed, but respect your opinion. and i´ve seen the BG3 forum. I will play the game at 100%, but i´m not crazy enough to take part in that discussion. that seems almost on a religous level. nothing i´m into. but i love BG, can´t wait for release. hope it´s awesome