[Werewolf] Crusade on Castle Mengelberg, (Werewolves Win!)

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Apologies for my activity.



Calodine's switch from me to Tuckles and back is a bad sign of fur. He's been crusading for a lynch against me since page 7, saw I wasn't going to get lynched day 1 and went with the next best thing. Tuckles wasn't a dangerous player to his pack, but an innocent less is an innocent less. Of course he acts reluctant before casting his vote, and notes a couple of times that he'll be straight back on to me the following day. He has a stronger "case" against me and is clearly unwilling to chance his stance on it, but changes to Tuckles anyway. He also tries to clear himself in case Tuckles turns out innocent (which he knew beforehand), and makes sure the blame would fall on Xardob.

Calodine said:
I don't particularly support this course of action, but if it avoids a nolynch I'll get my hands dirty and hammer the last nail in.
Calodine said:
Given how we're only gonna get a single extra vote at best, I'll swap over now because either result is better than doing nothing. But don't be surprised when I drop it right back on sheep the following day.
Calodine said:
I was lining up Xardob for the possible no. 2-3 spot on my list, but if Tuckles is a wolf, that doesn't work. He pretty much singlehandedly pushed this through.

And, for reference? Still want Sheep dead.



ComingWinter: Voted to lynch Adaham day 1. Hasn't been very confident with her posts, but comes back after night time to make a post where she seems very confident of her case. What did the wolves discuss, I wonder? She ties together Xardob, Adaham and I because we voted for Tuckles, but forgets that there were three others (Calodine, Nipplemelter and Suspicious Pilgrim). The entire post is dedicated to Xardob and Adaham's discussions with SootShade, but she ends up jumping on the Sheep bandwagon. She became suspicious of me on day 1 (when she saw her packie Calo doing so), but kept her lynch vote on Adaham to keep herself distant. They had a chat about pack tactics night 1, and now she's homed in on me too.

ComingWinter said:
I've been reading and rereading for a bit now, trying to start forming connections and pieces.

*snip*

I feel like Sheep is trying very hard to press the attack on Sootshade with very intriguing reasons to go on. Hmmmmm.



Ativan I am unsure about. I consider it possible these three are the pack. Whilst it might seem too obvious a thing to do (the pack going after one target), perhaps they've considered in reverse, it's so obvious no-one would suspect it? They can go after me as the three of them, as they've built "strong cases" against me because of my "****-up" of targeting SootShade and Calodine.

I'm thinking after Tuckles was lynched, rather than me (they had expected to lynch me, but the bandwagon didn't get going), they offed SootShade so it'd look like I was trying to keep the heat off myself. They had their little wolf discussion and are now coming after me again for a day 2 lynch. Everyone has noticed Calodine's and Ativan's insistence to have me hanged, I'm sure. Like Llandy says:

Pharaoh Llandy said:
So. Sheep, Xardob, Pilgrim and Adaham seem like the obvious candidates benefitting from Soot's death, however I'm cautious about this precisely becaue they are so obvious.

Still, I am unsure about Ativan. His posts on their own don't reek of wolf, whereas Calo's and CW's do.



I think out of Calodine and CW though, ComingWinter is the most obvious. Vote: ComingWinter.



 
Venerable F. Sheep said:
As pretty much everyone else has pointed out though, Tuckles is currently not contributing in any way and has been acting suspiciously. I think Adaham nails it on the head, and I agree with Adaham and Xardob that whatever way he turns out (though I'm hanging on it being a larger chance he's a lurking wolf), lynching him would be no loss.

something something Make your mind up already.

Adaham - Given it's something you bring up q
 
afasdgsdhs I did not mean to post that yet

Anyway.

Adaham - Given it's something you bring up quite a bit, I don't suppose you could do me a favour and point out where exactly I actually blamed you for either of the deaths? Because I can't see how anything in that post could be read that way. Also, you seem to have found the major chink in our CUNNING WOLFPACK PLAN: It requires I tell Llandy to be more active...Then bugger off and barely say **** all myself? I mean, I could be wrong but that seems like a really terrible plan. Especially given your proposed packmates for me - Llandy and CW. This makes me the ringleader, I guess. I don't get why I'd wanna kill Soot. The 'unlynchable' - your word - guy who was only called out for defending me. While being the main proponent of lynching you and Xardob. Who's also the guy I know best how to sway by far due to being the only person in the game I've really interacted with in the last couple years. His 'old married couple' joke gets said more often than I care to admit.
Honestly, alternate universe furry-me sounds like a really ****ty player. I mean, Sheep seems to agree with you here and he's CURRENT-universe wolf, so maybe you have a point :eek:

Just gonna ignore the stuff that calls my vote on Tuckles flipflopping etc. I explained why pretty well yesterday.



Unrelated: Adaham is entirely right about me not saying **** all today. It's ****ty and more people should have probably called me out on it. I expected him and Sheep to bring it up - it's free ammo - But I'm genuinely surprised Ativan/Llandy/Nipple didn't. Not so much on the CW/Xardob front, but still. It was really ****ty, ESPECIALLY after how I opened the day up. All I can really say here is sorry.
Need coffee and shop etc today, but I'll try and work through stuff later on during Kronic-games. Probably sum up the whole 'reasons why Sheep should have died yesterday' thing, if Ativan doesn't beat me to it. This should be a decent starting point:

Calodine said:
I have no idea how you can find Sheep innocent, though. Literally his entire post history within the thread after the CW thing was shown to be built entirely on lies and deliberate omissions. And then he vanished when the heat turned up - blame that on me all you like, but other people at least stepped in and stirred up discussion, even if it was primarily focused on my argument with Face. He's every bit if not moreso guilty of the things you want Tuckles dead for than Tuckles himself. I just don't see how you can look at that and see innocent.
 
I'm just going to leave this here.

Ativan said:
At that time was Sheep was my top priority (STILL IS. HEY XARDOB LOOK HERE, I WANT SHEEP LYNCHED), Tuckles was playing the game badly (If Sheep hadn't ****ed up royally, Tuckles would have a fine choice instead, especially on day one) but since Sheep is a scum Tuckles was more likely to be innocent. It's just like "yeah, I guess he would be a fine candidate for day one in a parallel universe (game) in which everything went ok / expectedly (i.e. nobody showed his fangs and fur LIKE SHEEP DID. HELLO XARDOB).


Ativan said:
Oh now let's not forget:

Vote: Venerable F. Sheep

YOU ARE GOING DOWN TODAY (Is this effort real enough for you Xardob?)

Venerable F. Sheep said:
Still, I am unsure about Ativan. His posts on their own don't reek of wolf, whereas Calo's and CW's do.



Anyway, moving on.

Venerable F. Sheep said:
ComingWinter: Voted to lynch Adaham day 1. Hasn't been very confident with her posts, but comes back after night time to make a post where she seems very confident of her case. What did the wolves discuss, I wonder? She ties together Xardob, Adaham and I because we voted for Tuckles, but forgets that there were three others (Calodine, Nipplemelter and Suspicious Pilgrim). The entire post is dedicated to Xardob and Adaham's discussions with SootShade, but she ends up jumping on the Sheep bandwagon. She became suspicious of me on day 1 (when she saw her packie Calo doing so), but kept her lynch vote on Adaham to keep herself distant. They had a chat about pack tactics night 1, and now she's homed in on me too.

Did you not read anything that I had written?

"She ties together Xardob, Adaham and I because we voted for Tuckles"

No, because Sootshade voted for you and Xardob and Adaham were implicated with you as well.

"The entire post is dedicated to Xardob and Adaham's discussions with SootShade, but she ends up jumping on the Sheep bandwagon"

My entire discussion was why I wasn't jumping on the bandwagon. I had made a clear logical path that started with Sootshade's LoS and the others around him that raised any flags. I wanted to find out the reason why Sootshade voted for you, and why he could have died.



Adaham said:
CW is - considering the fact she hasn't contributed jack**** to the discussion prior to her long post - awfully sure of what she's saying, which is suspicious to me. She goes on for the whole post to talk about Xardob and me and finally...votes Sheep? Man, voting Sheep has really become the scapegoat of choice for wolves that don't want to risk putting up the first vote. Remember who did the same thing (albeit with less words)?. Right, Calo.

And since Sheep is turning into the Tuckles of day 2 (activity-wise), there's not much to fear from that vote. But at the same time, the wolves are waiting carefully for somebody to break the ice and vote Xardob or me, so a bandwagon can get rolling. Their road is laid out. If Xardob or me can be lynched, they'll gladly take it. The next day they can still go for Sheep (finally). And if they manage to lynch three innocents in three days, they will have won. This also works the other way around (though less conveniently). Lynch Sheep today - be disappointed (everyone can make a mistake) and go for Xardob or me tomorrow - same result.

Yawn Adaham, try again.
 
Glad to see some active discussion around here today, especially from Sheep. Now, if only Pilgrim would make some noise, like he promise he’d do  :neutral:



@ Nipplemelter

Nipplemelter said:
Soot's death does not surprise me much, considering how vocal and active in the hunt he was. As Adaham says, he seemed unlynchable and therefore a good target to go for. I've been trying to think of potential suspects in this, but there seems to be no good way of doing so. On one hand, it would be beneficial for one of the more weighty players (i.e. Xardob, Adaham) to get rid of a player such as Soot who would pose a threat in "controlling the village," so to say, especially since he was at odds with them a few times. On the other hand, that would seem too obvious of a choice, making him a good target for framing those players (unless he was getting close to picking up a scent). While I think this is too up in the air, I'm leaning more towards the "obvious choice" theory because it wouldn't make sense for someone who was on Soot's "good side" or even neutral to get rid of him because he would be a powerful ally to have.

I agree with your point, about Soot’s death being a huge blow. IMO, Soot was the most active, vocal and impartial hunter. Regardless of who the wolves are, I think they knew exactly what they were doing in taking Soot out. Even if we disregard the whole ‘set up other players’ scenario, Soot was a good candidate for the first night kill because he was (at least, IMO) the strongest player we had during Day 1. I think the wolves were well aware of this when they killed him.

Nipplemelter said:
I'm somewhat unsettled by the fact that Xardob and Adaham admitted to not bothering to read Cado and I's ****storm (or even Soot's summary of it). Yes, it was fruitless, but normally seasoned wolf-hunters such as them would at least give it a shot to see if there is anything they could find in it that is potentially wolfy, especially since Adaham said he thinks at least one of Cado or I is a wolf due to it. He even seemed to miss some questions I had for him in the LoS I posted at the time, making me think he is less concerned about paying as close attention as usual for whatever reason.

More on Adaham: His LoS still is not sitting well with me. More often than not my thoughts on suspects lie closely to those of his, but something with it feels wrong to me. Probably because (as he admits) he hasn't been following people closely enough (regarding his thoughts on Sheep), causing him to get things wrong in his analysis (I never said I think Sheep is less scummy than Cado, unless you were talking about someone else in the blurb on me). Additionally, his "defense" of Xardob (in the sense that he feels Xardob is the person he trusts the most at the time) is not convincing to me. For you he showed that he was scumhunting, but it seems like you are the only one to feel that way. Granted, he did make a nice post on Tuckles, but that was after your thoughts on him. Otherwise, all he had at the time was a LoS and "lets lynch Tuckles." None of this is inherently wolfy, but the combination of it all bugs me. Either Adaham is a wolf trying to be careful, or his time off has made him rusty.  :wink:

With regards to part of your second/third point, and as much as it pains me to speak in defence of one of my primary suspects, I have to admit that your whole argument with Cal got very trying very quickly. I started reading it. Then it just got confusing as hell. When it seemed like you were both completely misunderstanding what the other was saying (or in Cal’s case, understanding but feeling defensive because he was being framed for something he didn’t say which was taken out of context) I resorted to skimming over your exchanges for the pertinent points. At that point, there really weren’t any.

Whilst I did skim your posts around that time, they didn’t really sink in because the sheer inanity of them was just overwhelming. So, I can’t blame either Xardob or Adaham for not reading too much into them, although I thought Soot summed it all up very nicely and I agreed with his conclusion (that you were both innocents who’d got the wrong end of the stick). And I’m still pretty sure about that conclusion, too.

Nipplemelter said:
Suspicious Pilgrim's post here and his recovery also makes me feel uneasy (though he has made me feel that way all game). His reluctance to vote for Tuckles could be that of an innocent who honestly doesn't feel like Tuckles was a wolf, but he did make an analysis of Tuckles earlier on that would suggest otherwise. Unwilling to put the nail in the coffin during crunch time and nearly causing a no-lynch (which Soot would have prevented, but that doesn't really matter) under those circumstances makes me think Pilgrim is a wolf who didn't want to have any blood on his hands knowing Tuckles would come out innocent.

In response to your point about Pilgrim, I wholeheartedly agree. I also agree with Xardob when he said he didn’t fall for Pilgrim’s whole ‘reluctant voter’ routine. Maybe it’s just how I see things; if you’re reluctant, don’t do it. But that’s just my opinion. Everybody’s been saying how a no-lynch is bad. And maybe it is. But I can’t help but feel if we’d ended up with a no-lynch, we’d not be down a villager now. And maybe the result of the wolves’ first night of activity would have been different, too. But I realise such speculation is pointless; we have to play the game we’re playing, not the game we might have played if a butterfly hadn’t flapped its wings halfway across the world and ended up lynching Tuckles.



@ Adaham

Adaham said:
The death of Soot is something very speculative to talk about. It involves a lot of WIFOM (Wine In Front Of Me - go watch "The Princess Bride" if you don't know the expression). Meaning you can just as eagerly claim Xardob and I wanted Soot out of the way, as well as saying the wolves knew that would come up, hence they did it to frame others. It's a game of endless speculation and doesn't lead anywhere.

About the “endless speculation” around Soot’s death. I don’t think it’s as pointless to speculate as you’re trying to imply. As for “doesn’t lead anywhere,” I also disagree with that, because it is leading to discussion. Granted, it might not lead to somebody slipping up and saying “oh yeah, Soot’s fingers were really tasty but I wish I’d had some ketchup to go with them!” but it’s generating discussion and it’s getting people to post their opinions, some of which will be genuine. At the very least, I think it will be very enlightening to review these opinions at the end of the game (I’d like to use the opportunity to see how accurate my own thoughts & feelings have been.)

So, with your permission, I’m going to keep speculating about Soot’s death.

Adaham said:
Fact is, a whole mob seems to be willing to lynch either Xardob or me today and that would mean that we did a really bad job at being wolves so far.

This is my biggest bone that I have to pick with you right now, you claim that a whole mob is willing to lynch you and Xardob. WTF? Are you reading a different thread? How many people have voted for you? And how many for Xardob? At the time you made this post, I count 3 for Sheep and 1 for ComingWinter. A lot of people are making accusations towards you, and pointing out inconsistencies in your posts, but I feel that level of suspicion is entirely justified. Please don’t try to play the martyr before you’ve even been strung up on the cross, it just comes across as false.

Adaham said:
2) When the day started, Calo and Llandy were very quick to point fingers. It confirmed my assumption, that the wolves killed Soot because he was a) unlynchable and b) as a side-effect, they could be trying to frame me or Xardob for it. While I might have understood if Llandy does so - since she's rather new….

Hang on a sec. I’m not allowed to play the newbie card in my defence, but you’re allowed to use it as an accusation? :\  And didn’t you just, a few posts ago, claim that “Llandy knows exactly how to play?” or something to that effect? (I can dig the quote up if you or anybody else needs me to). You seem to be trying to use this both ways, straddling both sides of the fence if it were.

Adaham said:
But imagine the following scenario. Let's say, I stepped on a wolf's tail yesterday when pointing out Llandy's interaction with Calodine. Of course, they're not going to admit it, but they'll be well aware that their game might have been slightly too obvious. So at night they confer and draw up a plan for the next day. The more experienced wolves advise the newcomer: "Be more active, don't play the funny-noob too much, it'll draw attention." And instead of eating the guy who stepped on their tail (me), they rather decide to eat another dangerous guy (Soot) and frame me for it. Not very difficult, as Xardob and I have been isolated from the group's opinion already on day 1. Two innocents down, now let's go after the hunters.

This part had so many lols in it that I just don’t know where to start. But, from the top I guess.

“Be more active…”  -- during the first Day (other than the first 4 days when I was regrettably absent and I have made my apologies for that) I was one of the most active players. Granted, my first half-dozen posts didn’t have much substance. I admit it. I tried to change. I like to think I did change. I could not physically have been more active than I already was, I assure you.

“...don’t play the funny-noob too much, it’ll draw attention…” -- Yeah, except if was a wolf, and had been advised by other wolves to do exactly that, they would have gotten the exact same response as you when you pointed out that my posts were very jovial.

Like Frankie said; I did it my way.

“...Xardob and I have been isolated from the group’s opinion already on day 1.”

So, naturally, it’s the fault of the group for not coming around to your way of thinking.

I will point out here that Xardob was barely even touching my top 5 of suspicious posters. The only concerns I had about him during Day 1, was his insistence on lynching Tuckles and his somewhat iffy LoS.

Even now, I’m still willing to entertain the idea that Xardob is innocent. The scenario I’m currently playing around with is that you saw an opportunity to back an innocent and encourage him in being vocal about lynching another innocent, essentially making Xardob your fall-guy. If that’s the case, then I have to wonder how Xardob’s view is looking right now, from up there on that grassy knoll. Maybe when the smoke clears, he’ll tell us.

“Two innocents down, now let’s go after the hunters.” -- Are you joking? Soot was the best hunter we had in Day 1. And forgive me because I’m quoting something now from a little further on in your post....

Calo
CW
Llandy
Ativan

I don’t think you’ve managed to hunt a single wolf there. I think you’ve just listed four innocent villagers. I can understand why you’ve heaped suspicion onto Cal, CW and I. We’ve all made arguments against you. I can’t understand why Ativan’s on that list (other than the fact that you think he’s far more dangerous than Cal and he’s an experienced player). My guess would be that he would become suspicious of you if you didn’t list him as a potential wolf, because like you said in a previous post, you’ll only trust each other once you’re both dead.

Adaham said:
Llandy's post reeks of wolfish advice to me. Her packies tipped her off to be active (which is for her an easy way to defend herself against all criticism) and less jokey. Interestingly enough, despite her promise to "keep on joking" because it's "who she is", her attitude towards Calodine has become far less jokey since then, at least I don't recall any Yorkshire-comment since I called her out on it. And the content of her long WoT basically is a long attempt to frame her usual suspects (mostly me) for what went wrong.

You know, I’m actually gutted. I was going to make a “Oh my god, they killed Tuckles! You bastards!” post right at the very beginning of my WoT. It was the first though I had when I woke up and saw an innocent had been lynched, and it stuck with me for days. But when I actually came to type out my WoT, I was still kinda reeling from Soot being ‘et by wolves, and to my extreme horror, my happily planned South Park joke slipped my mind  :sad:

Yes, my attitude towards Cal has become less jokey, because he’s said a couple of things which have got me to wondering. Not things which necessarily make me think he’s a wolf, but definitely have given me something to think about. I list these things in my first WoT.

You claim my WoT is an attempt to frame my usual suspects for what went wrong. I believe Xardob had not been on my LoS before that. I also had some pointed questions to ask of a few others. I don’t blame you for what went wrong any more than I blame Pilgrim for such a fake “Oh, I don’t know if I should vote for Tuckles because I think he’s innocent, but I guess I will anyway…” post.

Adaham said:
3) There's at least one dumb guy around. Yeah, could be me, true dat. But the problem I'm having is, that while Ativan also followed in similar tracks (albeit more subtle) as Cal and Llandy, so did CW, too (albeit far less subtle). There's no pack of 4 people, so at least one of you guys is a confused villager. Based on experience, I would naturally exclude Calodine and Ativan from that, which would leave either Llandy or CW just being willing helpers. But there's no guarantee for that. And I'm having real trouble seeing CW as anything else than a badly camouflaged wolf that is just staying alive by not posting too much to get attention.

Here’s another viewpoint; we’re all villagers. I’m not sure about ‘confused’ though. I’m pretty certain about you and Pilgrim. Certain enough to lynch either of you. But now I’m teetering between Xardob and Sheep as #3. I still don’t understand why you’re so intent on defending Xardob. You’re either two very clever pack-mates (neither of you has any lynch votes right now AFAIK) or you are trying to win Xardob’s trust and, as I mentioned above, provide yourself with a fall-guy. Because you believe in Xardob (clap your hands!) and if Xardob is lynched and proved innocent, that simply vindicates your own stance.

Adaham said:
CW: Her post starts off with an almost unbearable appeal to emotion.

Have to actually agree with that one. I found the opening of her post to be overly dramatic. Doesn’t mean I think she’s a wolf, though; simply trying to appeal to everyone on a more emotional level. I don’t particularly think it worked, but hey ho.

Nor can I figure out why she spent her post arguing that you and Xardob were suspicious but then put her vote on Sheep. I admit, it’s weird. As weird as Cal’s flip-flopping. As weird as Tuckles’ “Hey I’m overlooked here!” post. Grounds for calling her out as a wolf? Not to me. But then, I’m not the recipient of her attention. Probably looks different from where you’re standing.


Well, that about sums up my WoT. I hope it makes sense, I did half at work on my lunch hour and finished it now. There’s more I want to post about comments from other people, but I gotta go horse riding in five mins and I want to wrap this up.


/vote Adaham


Because other than Pilgrim, you’re the only one I’m sure of.

 
Nipplemelter said:
Why were you expecting me to call you out on not posting much yet today?

Ditto that question for me.

I mean, yes, Cal was quiet yesterday. But so was pretty much everyone else. At least you (Cal) checked in after the Night. Pilgrim hasn't even done that yet (despite his ASSURANCE that he would be the first one to post). Yesterday we had a ton of CloudFlare errors which meant the forums were down for half of the day, and throwing up stupid block messages for the other half. I wouldn't blame anyone for not posting yesterday.


While we're on the subject of questions, there's a question I want to ask the Werewolf community in general. Earlier, Xardob made a post which said a last-minute vote change to ensure a no-lynch doesn't occur is acceptable villager behaviour. And before he got killed, Soot posted that he was going to change his vote to Tuckles (if necessary) too. What I want to know is, is this whole 'vote-changing at the last minute is acceptable' thing the general consensus from players?
 
WARNING: This post has a lot of WIFOM and metagaming. Also half of it was written before Llandy's response to Adaham, in case anything seems redundant.

Adaham said:
The death of Soot is something very speculative to talk about. It involves a lot of WIFOM (Wine In Front Of Me - go watch "The Princess Bride" if you don't know the expression). Meaning you can just as eagerly claim Xardob and I wanted Soot out of the way, as well as saying the wolves knew that would come up, hence they did it to frame others.

Indeed, but I see nothing wrong with at least thinking about the implications. I know when we were packies together in The Tower of Games, we totally got rid of Revilo so I could claim "it was an obvious setup" against me, and we knocked off Mag because of the potential wolf-hunting threat he posed; very similar to what could be said about the situation here. Yes, it is WIFOM, but you love to use that to distance yourself from such an accusation. I know I cannot make an argument purely based off that, and I am not because it is mega meta-gamey (metagaming WIFOM: your favourite thing to deal with), but I'd like to point out how this fits into your wolf repertoire as food for thought.

It's a game of endless speculation and doesn't lead anywhere. I think the only people profiting from it are the wolves themselves.

So you'd like for people to just not think about how Soot's death could be connected to anything?

1) Some of you guys are inconsistent. On one hand you hold Xardob and me to the highest of standards, on the other hand you expect us to play really dumb as wolves. Granted - the last bit could be part of an incredibly elaborate double-bluff - but that's again a lot of WIFOM.

I think everyone holds you to higher standards because you have set those standards yourself from previous games and built a reputation of it. I don't expect you guys to play dumb wolves; I expect you guys to play reasonable wolves, which doesn't rule out anything I've said. If you were a wolf, killing off Soot and claiming thoughts about you as a potential suspect for it as a WIFOM would not be a dumb move. If you were a wolf, playing it slightly less aggressive than you tend to do while still making nice WoTs would be a smart move. If you were a wolf, "making allies" with Xardob would be a smart move. All of this would be equally smart for an innocent Adaham to do as well, which is why I don't think you can claim the any of this being "dumb" for you to do.

Fact is, a whole mob seems to be willing to lynch either Xardob or me today and that would mean that we did a really bad job at being wolves so far. Not that this is to be excluded, but I think it's far-fetched.

If it helps, I think a few of the arguments against you are thin at best. You know the village is almost always out to get you, and yet you still manage to keep it together and survive most of the time, so nothing is unusual here.

If people like CW know so much about past games, then she'd know also, that as a wolf I usually show far less doubt and my logic is usually far more elaborate than as a villager. Simple, because I can just make **** up and don't have to think twice. Just construct whatever I can from a person's posts.

You've done that as a villager too, and as a wolf you also have taken the middle ground and sat back waiting for the right moment to get bandwagons rollin'. This is the difficulty with you: the style in which you play has a good deal of variability, making it hard to peg you as a wolf.

So if you still think that it's suspicious because I don't know what so many see in Venerable (or because I haven't devoured the Nipple/Calo-quote war), think again. Or don't. It's really up to you.

Not saying you are suspicious wholly because of that (as I said, I don't fault you for not reading the quote war, but from what I recall you didn't even bother with Soot's summary), but I'm just surprised that you find Sheep suspicious in no form because he clearly has been using flawed logic and has been sidestepping accusations against him instead of confronting them.

2) When the day started, Calo and Llandy were very quick to point fingers. It confirmed my assumption, that the wolves killed Soot because he was a) unlynchable and b) as a side-effect, they could be trying to frame me or Xardob for it.

I thought you were against WIFOM reasoning? Or is that okay when you can use it as a defense?

Rather than indulging in WIFOM-speculation and emotional appeals (Oh Noes Adaham, two innocents down, your fault!), he looked at the cold, hard facts. Doesn't mean I agree that Nipplemelters vote was the most suspicious of the bunch, but I understand where he's coming from and it was worthwhile to prod Nipple about it.

So poking at things is only okay when they aren't directed at you?

And since Sheep is turning into the Tuckles of day 2 (activity-wise), there's not much to fear from that vote. But at the same time, the wolves are waiting carefully for somebody to break the ice and vote Xardob or me, so a bandwagon can get rolling. Their road is laid out. If Xardob or me can be lynched, they'll gladly take it. The next day they can still go for Sheep (finally). And if they manage to lynch three innocents in three days, they will have won. This also works the other way around (though less conveniently). Lynch Sheep today - be disappointed (everyone can make a mistake) and go for Xardob or me tomorrow - same result.

How can you just assume Xardob and Sheep are innocents, especially when you said you haven't paid attention to Sheep? Trying to divert suspicion away from "top suspects" like this is fishy.


Pharaoh Llandy said:
Whilst I did skim your posts around that time, they didn’t really sink in because the sheer inanity of them was just overwhelming. So, I can’t blame either Xardob or Adaham for not reading too much into them, although I thought Soot summed it all up very nicely and I agreed with his conclusion (that you were both innocents who’d got the wrong end of the stick). And I’m still pretty sure about that conclusion, too.

My problem was more with Adaham saying "yeah, I guess there is a wolf in there, but I'm not going to pay much attention to it and assume it is Cado." Yes, it is tiring, but it not something that would take too long to read over.

But I can’t help but feel if we’d ended up with a no-lynch, we’d not be down a villager now. And maybe the result of the wolves’ first night of activity would have been different, too.

A lost innocent hurts more in a game like this with less players, but had we not lynched Tuckles, chances are we would be stuck on Day 2 between him and Sheep.

This is my biggest bone that I have to pick with you right now, you claim that a whole mob is willing to lynch you and Xardob. WTF? Are you reading a different thread? How many people have voted for you? And how many for Xardob?

There are quite a few people who are suspicious of Adaham, so he isn't exactly incorrect in saying so. Not voting for Adaham =/= not being out to get him.


Venerable F. Sheep said:
Calodine's switch from me to Tuckles and back is a bad sign of fur. He's been crusading for a lynch against me since page 7, saw I wasn't going to get lynched day 1 and went with the next best thing. Tuckles wasn't a dangerous player to his pack, but an innocent less is an innocent less. Of course he acts reluctant before casting his vote, and notes a couple of times that he'll be straight back on to me the following day. He has a stronger "case" against me and is clearly unwilling to chance his stance on it, but changes to Tuckles anyway. He also tries to clear himself in case Tuckles turns out innocent (which he knew beforehand), and makes sure the blame would fall on Xardob.

This is so wrong. Cado's switch to Tuckles was to prevent a no-lynch and I see nothing wolfy about it. What about Pilgrim's reluctant vote? What about Soot's post saying he would have switched his vote over? What about your vote saying lynching him is no loss? You didn't seem so concerned about "an innocent less is an innocent less" then.

On the matter of your vote, you said that you "think it is best to keep [Sootshade] around," which strikes me as a strange think to say about a player who was not even in the running for being lynched at the time. Preemptive Day 1 defense in your plan for killing Soot at night?

They can go after me as the three of them, as they've built "strong cases" against me because of my "****-up" of targeting SootShade and Calodine.

Uhhhh, I don't think Ativan or even CW made their cases based off that. Cado did, Soot did, and I kind of did, but less so for the others.

I'm thinking after Tuckles was lynched, rather than me (they had expected to lynch me, but the bandwagon didn't get going), they offed SootShade so it'd look like I was trying to keep the heat off myself.

This doesn't make sense. There were lots of other people going after you, so how would getting rid of Soot take the heat off of you? Are you just trying to dumb suspicion on other people now?


ComingWinter said:
I'm just going to leave this here.

What's the big deal? Sheep says he doesn't find Avian wolfy; no reason to think that he would OMGUS him for thinking as much.

Yawn Adaham, try again.

Mind actually doing something with that?


Pharaoh Llandy said:
What I want to know is, is this whole 'vote-changing at the last minute is acceptable' thing the general consensus from players?

Acceptable, but it can sometimes be wolfy depending on how it is done.
 
Austupaio said:
Well, if you want to ask that as a question towards Werewolf as a whole, you should post in the Host thread rather than the game thread.

If you mean this game in particular, then neither I or any other non-player should discuss it all, with players anyway.

Since I believe you meant the former and just decided to post it here, I'll say that I've not seen a rule against last minute vote changes, nor do I see a need for one.

Sorry, I meant the players in this game, rather than the whole community. No need to go dragging them in here, but if I do end up in other games, I might ask the question again in a more relevant place :razz:

Nipplemelter said:
Acceptable, but it can sometimes be wolfy depending on how it is done.

Thanks. I thought it might be something along those lines. I suppose it depends on the individual, and how/when they do it, and who they do it to, which needs scrutinising.

Overall, I have to say... the fact that SootShade was willing to switch votes to Tuckles to avoid a no-lynch kinda makes me a little less suspicious of everyone else who did it. The suspicion hasn't entirely gone, and I still think Pilgrim was obvious as hell with his whole undecided act, but I'll try to keep this in mind for future.
 
Day 2: Vote Count 1

Venerable F. Sheep (3) - (Calodine, Ativan, ComingWinter)
Nipplemelter (1) - (Xardob)
ComingWinter (1) - (Venerable F. Sheep)
Adaham (1) - (Pharaoh Llandy)
Suspicious Pilgrim (0) - ()
Calodine (0) - ()
Ativan (0) - ()
Xardob (0) - ()
Pharaoh Llandy (0) - ()

Not Voting (3) (Suspicious Pilgrim, Adaham, Nipplemelter)

With 9 Alive, it takes 5 votes to lynch.
Day 2 Deadline is October 5th at 11:59PM EST.

Suspicious Pilgrim is getting a prod.
 
Pharaoh Llandy said:
Overall, I have to say... the fact that SootShade was willing to switch votes to Tuckles to avoid a no-lynch kinda makes me a little less suspicious of everyone else who did it. The suspicion hasn't entirely gone, and I still think Pilgrim was obvious as hell with his whole undecided act, but I'll try to keep this in mind for future.

Don't be any less suspicious because of it; saying that you would rather go one way but are willing to switch to a different person is an easy way to shrug off any blame for voting the "wrong way" in that scenario and avoid accusation of bandwagoning.
 
Nipplemelter said:
Don't be any less suspicious because of it; saying that you would rather go one way but are willing to switch to a different person is an easy way to shrug off any blame for voting the "wrong way" in that scenario and avoid accusation of bandwagoning.

I don't think I used the right word when I said 'suspicious' but I'm battling a cold and losing, so let me try again.

I am more accepting of the fact that switching votes at the last minute is sometimes considered acceptable behaviour, but I will not be scrutinising the people involved in this any less closely.

Hope that clarifies. If not... meh. It makes sense in my brain-space.
 
I have spent the last two hours or so to re-read the first day and second day posts. I have made very interesting observations but unfortunately I don't have enough time to post them today and they have to wait.

Spoilers: These observations are mainly about Sheep (of course), Adaham and Xardob.

Meanwhile I'd like you guys to post some LoS's because I want to see what people think about each other, it will be helpful. If I'm not mistaken there are some players that haven't done a LoS yet, ever.

Apologies for the inactivity, I'll try to make up for it tomorrow.
 
I'll see if I can come up with another basic LoS tomorrow or Thursday, but this week is pretty busy for me, so just don't expect something extremely well thought out from meticulously re-reading the thread.
 
I really wish everyone would stop talking about Soot's death. Would be easier to resist the urge to vote anyone who mentioned it, or to single out the wolves who want to distract the village with it.

Nipplemelter said:
A lost innocent hurts more in a game like this with less players, but had we not lynched Tuckles, chances are we would be stuck on Day 2 between him and Sheep.
As opposed to us now being stuck between Sheep and Sheep?

Since Ativan asked for everyone's stance, here goes mine, but no LoS, since my last one took more effort than it was worth.

Llandy is probably innocent, and I'm going to say Adaham is innocent as well.

I can see the reasoning against Sheep, but I'm not at all convinced he's a wolf. I'll ask again, if someone can sum the case against him, I'd appreciate. Unless the entire case rests on the **** up with Cal's misquote.

Cal continues to be my main suspect, Nipple and CW have risen quite a bit lately.

I really have to reread the thread to organize my thoughts on Pilgrim, but one thing I can say for certain, he's the best bet for a lurker wolf. I refuse to believe the wolves would leave such a good target alone.

Ativan I'm unsure. I keep going back and forth on him. I want to know who are his other suspects besides Sheep.
 
Hello everyone! I swear to god I didn't have much time to jump into discussion these past few days but I wanted to make a comprehensive post instead of a daily "maybe tomorrow...". I'll give my commentary on today's events now.

Calodine said:
Well I ain't gonna say much right now because it's way too damn early for that, but before I forget, that's pretty damn ****ty, Adaham. Tuckles being innocent after all that, AND Soot being murdered...Doesn't change your stance on anything? Well, beyond framing the kill as being intended to make you and Xardob look worse. And not even considering that Soot was offed for any reason beyond being unlynchable. Like, say, who he was gunning for.

This is conjecture, but I believe Soot was murdered due to the fact he was one of the people leading the witch hunt. The only way he could have gotten any suspicion is if he had nailed in the coffin instead of me and wasn't murdered, and I have a feeling everyone would have glossed it over as a mistake. It would have tarnished his reputation, sure, but I feel not enough to become a notable lynch suspect. That being said, he did say he intended to lynch Tuckles.

Pharaoh Llandy said:
For the moment, all I can say is that you're now sharing #1 spot on my list with Adaham. No, in fact, you've bumped Adaham down to #2 on my list and replaced him as my main suspect.

I'm curious, what posts did Adaham make that show his hands are red? He was in my periphery. I further disagree with your posts saying that Calodine or me are suspicious for giving into peer pressure. I mean sure, it's entirely possible a wolf would play reluctant in order to spin around and say "I TOLD YOU SO" but it's equally as possible as someone just being plain... pressured. I feel like you'd be hard pressed to get hard, cold evidence supporting either viewpoint. I feel like you then distance yourself from the lynching like the rest of us by saying "Oh yeah, I wasn't too sure about him either..!" which I feel like is a double-take on your part, as you chew out Calodine for doing the same thing.

You go on to call out Adaham for Xardob being, quote, "The person I trust most". Don't you think it's a bit haphazard for wolves to give full, dedicated support to one another rather than subtle boosts? Adaham and Xardob are experienced players, it's unlikely they'd pull off something so obvious. Unless it's reverse psychology.

I agree with your Ativan analysis, as his behavior of standing in the background seems to just be a non-committal way of going with the mob while doing his own thing, and his disinterest in rallying the masses seems to me like an attempt to remain a low profile character. To me, it's a sign of wolfishness or a special. I also agree with your comment on CW, he seems like he used Sheep and Tuckles as smoke clouds to immerse herself in.

Moving on. Xardob's post here is muddling to say the least. He doesn't offer much of an excuse besides "I messed up", which is really just working under the assumption he's innocent I feel. You don't really answer the question of "How can you prove you aren't a wolf?" If you "made a mistake and lynched an innocent", why aren't you exercising more caution in casting your vote? You literally place a vote on Melter after a few sentences of reasoning, early into the day, before he even makes a post. You don't seem to be changing your tactics at all, and if you're going to keep using the excuse of "I made a mistake" every time a villager's head rolls you're either incredibly callous at our expense or a wolf.

I'm disappointed that Llandy doesn't seem to pick up on Xardob's nonsense in her next post, despite the fact he's at the top of her list. If he's at the top, shouldn't you be scrutinizing him more carefully? This may be a guise between packmates to distance themselves from each other by maintaining weak cases and lots of suspicion. I doubt it though, as it seems like a far-fetched tactic for someone as novice as Llandy, it being her first game and all. Just food for thought.

I agree with her comments on Sheep in that post.

Her analysis of Soot's opinion on me is amusing. She completely ignores the fact that one of his posts supposedly calling me out, if she's referring to this one, is mainly centered around approval of me nudging Llandy into posting more frequently, and commenting on her innocence and possible lack thereof.

Ativan's post here is interesting. He's sticking to his guns, which is something that can't be said for most of us, but he also seems to pursue a Sheep lynch far more aggressively than on day 1. Jokingly, it seems, but perhaps hiding the fact he felt pulled from the shadows so to speak. No current justification is given for a Sheep vote, not much commentary is made on Soot's murder. Seems to me like he's still trying to revive the Sheep bandwagon for an easy lynch. Don't get me wrong, Sheep's sketchy, but there's not much commitment being shown when you make jokes and write in all caps.

His next post is strangely more standoffish than his day 1 posts, which, to be honest, faded into obscurity for most people. Ativan just says a bunch of nonsense in this post in some bid to stand out more, which perhaps is a rash reaction as he's frustrated with accusations of noncommitment or just word filler that grabs headlines. Further aggressive rhetoric is made here without much analysis. I feel that it goes without saying that lynching based on day 1 actions without seriously addressing the lynch and the night is just mindless.

Calodine goes onto vote on Sheep here without any serious conversation or waiting to see what Sheep has to say for his wolfy behavior. Again, I think it's rash and hurrying through the day like this just leaves us fewer avenues for investigation.

Winter's post comes out of nowhere. It does nothing to address Winter's noted absence from the game after she narrowly escaped the noose, and gives more summaries and opinions than any proper points. The case against Sheep is air-tight? Say how it is! Most of the post is "i think" "i think" "i think", and the fact that yet another person casts a vote so early with so little retrospection is outrageous. This seems to me less like a solid post and more of a jump onto a bandwagon she sniffed out, which may be a noob mistake but the possibility of going with popular opinion to avoid getting caught and stay in the periphery is possible as well.

I like Melter's post here. He's indicating we should have more discussion before killing someone off, and he doesn't make a bandwagon vote without any justification like some others have. Also like this one. And this on- oh **** he calls me out! I agree most of his points with the obvious exception of his suspicion of me. My analysis of Tuckles was more of an attempt to draw him out/analyze the possibilities rather than assert my suspicion. I'll admit it was kind of ****ty due to his lack of any posts, but I maintain that I was trying to pressure him so I could probe him more. Which didn't work due to his lack of interest as we all know.

Annnnd that's all for tonight. I'll try to sneak in more time tomorrow as I'll have considerably lessened work load, but goodness I am not looking forward to reading and commenting on the walls of text that appear further on in the thread.
 
So my question for you Pilgrim is what exactly is your point in all of this? Yes, you have suspicions, yet you draw no conclusion from them.



Suspicious Pilgrim said:
Winter's post comes out of nowhere. It does nothing to address Winter's noted absence from the game after she narrowly escaped the noose, and gives more summaries and opinions than any proper points. The case against Sheep is air-tight? Say how it is! Most of the post is "i think" "i think" "i think", and the fact that yet another person casts a vote so early with so little retrospection is outrageous. This seems to me less like a solid post and more of a jump onto a bandwagon she sniffed out, which may be a noob mistake but the possibility of going with popular opinion to avoid getting caught and stay in the periphery is possible as well.

Seriously? What exactly was your post then? I think Activan, I think Winter, I think Llandy, blah blah blah. At least I had the balls to put a vote at the end instead of standing around with my thumb up my nose.

And if I'm jumping on the bandwagon, I've seen ****tier attempts. If actually read the thing you would have seen my thought process into why Soot died. I think he was on to something with Sheep and that post was an attempt to see what he saw.

Here is his original LoS on Sheep

Suspicious Pilgrim said:
It does nothing to address Winter's noted absence from the game after she narrowly escaped the noose, and gives more summaries and opinions than any proper points.

ComingWinter said:
I started college up for the fall term, so I have been very busy today (obviously) and yesterday. Things probably won't slow down until Friday which will be my free day.

 
Xardob said:
As opposed to us now being stuck between Sheep and Sheep?

Which would you rather have? And no, we aren't necessarily stuck with Sheep, but he has done nothing to make his case look any better (in my eyes).

I can see the reasoning against Sheep, but I'm not at all convinced he's a wolf. I'll ask again, if someone can sum the case against him, I'd appreciate.

A brief list of my thoughts of him:

  • He only has 8 posts, with only about 5 of them having any sort of content. Lurky.
  • After getting called out for the poor reasoning behind his vote on Soot and the misquote of Cado, he claims that the post was to "distance Cado from Soot," sidestepping questions brought about it.
  • He hasn't made an LoS or ever talked much about very many people - only really been involved with situations surrounding himself.
  • Mentions twice that Soot wouldn't be a good Day 1 lynch... when nobody was ever considering it in the first place. Strange and sounds like a preemptive cover-up.
  • Claims his post against Cado and Soot brought up fresh perspectives from other players, which makes no sense because all it brought was people pointing out his flawed logic.
  • Is ignoring people's questions against him and writing it off as a bandwagon.
  • Says lynching Tuckles would be no loss... and is now saying Cado is wolfy because of wanting to lynch Tuckles rather than having a no-lynch. And if Cado is so clearly wolfy, then why is he voting for CW instead?

You can also look back through his posts, since there are few enough.

If possible, can you also expand on your thoughts with more specifics? It isn't helping any of us that you are just saying "yeah, I think these guys are okay and those guys aren't."
 
My new LoS, in order of suspiciousness. To avoid sounding like a broken record, I’ll try to sum up the pertinent points.

• Adaham

I will admit that my initial suspicion of Adaham was based off a post he made that I interpreted as a veiled threat. One or two people have pointed out this was an OMGUS reaction on my behalf, but since then, every post of Adaham’s that I’ve read has made me more and more suspicious of him and has given me no reason to alter my suspicion.

Here he makes several claims which simply don’t make sense. For example, playing the “everyone suspects me” card, as he’s also doing right now. CW makes his gut tingle but Sheep doesn’t. People only thought Soot was innocent because he posted a lot. Uh, okay. It had nothing to do with the impartial tone of Soot’s posts and the actual content of his discussion. It was simply because he posted a lot.  :\

In his LoS he completely fails to see anything suspicious in 2 of the most suspicious players of the game at that stage (Sheep & Pilgrim) despite some very solid arguments for lynching sheep and some pretty dodgy behaviour from Pilgrim, and he’s the only one who thinks Xardob’s LoS wasn’t lackadaisical. He also claimed Soot’s contributions were vague and lacking substance despite Soot being the strongest wolf-hunter of Day 1.

There are many other posts of his which I find suspicious, but I think I’ve addressed the rest in general discussion and I’m trying to keep this succinct. In short, I get the feeling that I’m on Adaham’s list because he’s on mine. I like to think that this is because I’ve managed to find the wolf in him, because I’m struggling to entertain the notion that he’s innocent.

Suspicious Pilgrim

I think it should be pretty obvious why Pilgrim’s a wolf. He has outright ignored almost every accusation of suspicious behaviour, instead trying to shift the focus to other players (I was one, and IIRC Cal or Nipple was the other). His activity towards the end of the game was downright suspicious compared to his activity earlier on in the game, and his reluctance in lynching Tuckles was faker than Gwyneth Paltrow’s Oscar acceptance tears. Despite being now four days in to Day 2, he has yet to make an appearance. I like to give people the benefit of the doubt where interweb absence is concerned because sometimes **** happens IRL and the forums should not take precedence over that.

But seriously. We’re four days in. Several people considered Pilgrim a strong suspect in Day 1, but by being absent he’s completely flying under the radar of most people who are instead concentrating on accusing each other.

(In-post edit: between writing this LoS and posting it, Pilgrim has posted, but I’ll address that in a separate general discussion post as it doesn’t change my opinion of him one bit)

When he does posts, his arguments are paper-thin, and at times even insulting. It seems like he’s trying to goad his victims into losing their temper. He dismisses accusations with one-liners and turns them into accusations about his accuser. For an example of this, click here

If I had to put money on it, I’d say he and Adaham got together pre-game and agreed that Pilgrim should play obvious/dumb wolf, and Adaham would play sneaky wolf. This would explain why Adaham doesn’t find anything suspicious in Pilgrim’s post, and why he (earlier in the game) felt that Pilgrim and Sheep were blending into one person in his mind.

The reason Adaham’s my #1 lynch despite me feeling that Pilgrim is more obvious, is because I feel like I can deal with obvious better than sneaky. And if this whole ‘absent for most of the game’ strategy is indicative of how Pilgrim’s going to play, it should make it easy to get rid of him after we’ve dealt with the other two.

Venerable Sheep

Actually, my third place is tied between Sheep and Xardob, but as with the whole Adaham/Tuckles situation, I think Sheep is more obvious about it.

Much like Pilgrim (but to a greater extent), Sheep was around earlier in the game then absent almost entirely until the end, when he showed up just long enough to switch his vote and contribute towards the lynching of an innocent. His attempt to frame Calodine seems quite obvious; he quotes Cal’s stuff out of context and tries to misdirect people into believing Cal said something he didn’t. He’s kinda indirectly responsible for the Cal/Nipple ****storm.

Because Sheep hasn’t posted as much as most other people, it’s been hard for me to get a personal feel for him, but his recent post (which I haven’t had time to address in discussion yet) just feels completely wrong. He barely attempts to defend himself, tries to direct attention (again) onto Cal and this time throws CW into the mix, and apologises for his ‘activity.’ More like lack of activity.

However, a lot of my suspicion about Sheep comes from reading the posts other players have made about him. Soot was willing to lynch him, before he got conveniently killed. And yeah, Sheep claims that this would be stupid for him to do as it draws attention. But maybe the wolves decided to spread that attention around a little and implicate Adaham (or Xardob, who in this scenario would be innocent) by taking out Soot (who was also the best player at the time).

The fact that Ativan, Cal and CW (who feature along with me on Adaham’s LoS) also want Sheep lynched is also a strong case for his lynching. I do, however, still believe that Adaham is the greater threat because he’s clever and could possibly talk his way out of a lynching, whereas Sheep doesn’t really stand a chance.

Xardob

I’m finding Xardob the hardest person in this whole game to get a read on. On one hand he makes some salient points, but on the other hand he seems to completely misunderstand the reasoning of others or just fail to see things which seem obvious.

I think I need to go back and re-read all of Xardob’s post. Problem is, I can easily see him being a wolf playing a confident and aggressive game (based on his insistence on lynching Tuckles) but I can also see him as a villager who made a bad decision and got framed. Overall, I find his behaviour more suspicious than not, but if my first three guesses are correct then he’s an innocent having a bad game. Like I said though, I need to go back and read his posts more carefully.

ComingWinter

CW got off to a bit of a shaky start, but I think she recovered from it well enough. Her absence was most notable in the latter half of the game and I think that’s a pity, because I would have liked to have seen her opinions on Tuckles right before he got lynched, and it would have given me a chance to get a better grasp on her thoughts on the others too.

Overall, my opinions seem to run along the same lines as CW’s, though I think her first post on Day 2 was a bit OTT. I can see why she did it that way, but I don’t think this was the right game/crowd to try it with, as it sounded a little too much like narration.

Other than that, I can follow her logic and can’t find much to disagree about in her posts. I think CW is innocent, though she’s lowest on my innocents list because I haven’t see as much from her as I have the others.

Calodine

Cal’s anger/frustration during the whole Cal/Nipple thing, whilst a little heated, seemed genuine enough to me. That’s one of the main reasons I believe he’s innocent. One thing I like about Cal’s posts is that he doesn’t hold back, and seems to say what he thinks at the time even if it’s not the smartest thing to do.

There have been one or two things Cal has said/done which have made me a bit wary towards him (for example, trying to make it clear that Xardob was the one to organise the Tuckles lynch, because it wasn’t as if Cal was forced to change his vote under duress) and I don’t always agree with his reasoning, but as with CW, I find my thoughts mostly echoing his.

Ativan

Ativan’s first LoS was decent enough, and since then he’s made some good contributions. I agree with a lot of his assessments of people, though I’ve noticed that he does tend to speculate on certain things then fail to follow them through when nobody picks them up (such as this post). On the whole, however, there’s not much he’s said that I disagree with. I’m reluctant to say that I trust him, because the last person I trusted the most got eaten (and besides, this is Ativan’s castle, so I imagine he’s sitting in a room high up in some tower drinking the blood of innocents, stroking his white cat and cackling maniacally, as all castle-owners do) but I haven’t seen him post anything that screams ‘wolf’ at me. Overall he’s been pretty thorough and logical and (IMO) relatively impartial compared to some other players (me included).

I’m slightly worried he might actually murder someone if Sheep doesn’t get lynched this round, so that will be interesting to see.

Nipplemelter

Having re-read the Day 1 discussions last week, I’ve noticed that Nipple’s suspicions and thoughts are almost aligned with my own. The only one I disagree with him on is Cal. I think those two just had a really big misunderstanding and went on a Ross & Rachel break. I think they would have accomplished much more if they hadn’t gotten involved in a poo-flinging contest, but that’s in the past and will hopefully never be repeated again.

But as I was saying, I think Nipplemelter is doing a very good job so far of picking apart other players' posts/arguments, backing his own suspicions up with quotes/evidence, and generally making his viewpoint understood. I was initially suspicious of him during parts of Day 1, but having seen him play and being able to easily follow his posts has pretty much allayed that suspicion. Nipple’s been the least wolfy person (IMO) overall, and I feel that his posts have been regular and consistent.

Apologies for yet another WoT, but you can blame Ativan for this one as he wanted folks to post more LoS’s. I hope all of this post makes sense, because you have no idea how dosed up I am on cold/flu medicine right now. I know if anything doesn’t make sense, somebody will be along to point it out.



Now damnit, Ativan, post your damn stuff!  :mad:
 
Just a quick one, as I have to jump into my car and go and make a presentation about something...

...a certain degree of speculation about Soot's death was certainly legit, that may not have been clear from what I said before. But people need to restrain themselves with these speculations, because as always, these things can swing both ways.

Right now I'm very suspicious of all these Sootshade-Fanboys/girls. You guys should start a fanclub, as you seem to adore every word of his...and to you guys his suspicions are infallible. This is why I say that these Soot-speculations only benefit the wolves. Can't turn your own words around? Just borrow the suspicions from the dead innocent guy and you've got a plethora of options to go. This is exactly why Soot died, because he was vocal, innocent and probably completely wrong (that happens).

@Nipple: You compliment me a lot, and yet you think I'd go back to doing the same damn thing I've done before? Funny enough, it's something you actually did when in a pack with me, so who's to blame here?

@ComingWinter: If you decide to communicate with me like that, I'll do the same. Your contributions are a complete joke, and your fake confidence can't camouflage that even a bit. I can only hope you are a wolf, because as a villager you'd be an outright disgrace!
 
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