Hit Points for Weapon

Users who are viewing this thread

i would like your weapon to break, because one of the pictures for the loading screen shows a guy with a two handed and a dagger at his belt, i think it'd be cool if ur weapon breaks u have to draw ur dagger or other weapon, plus armor should wear down.... not as easy.... i mean you'd have to get hit a bunch, and it could rust if you fight ur battles in rivers a bunch... but id want to be able to repair the items back to full, and better the item longer they last
 
As has been said, I'd be fine with them being like shields, breaking but repairing themselves after the battle.

And as for realism issues, there were several cases of swords breaking in real life, but it didn't happen often because swords themselves were weapons of last resort. Lances were used on horseback, axes or bows on foot. That's why you don't hear about swords breaking.
 
Totally agree. But swords and other weapons made from harder material than wood will most likely just drop down from your hands rather than break apart. Which would be a cool feature as well.

Like the suggestion writer said it's totally ridiculous you would rather use your butter knife to block massive 2 hander than scratching your shield. It should be no doubt addressed as a problem. Of course it's up to games policy. How realistic they aim, but at least mine one reason was pretty much the games realism why I got interested about this game and finally bought it and I really think that's one of the M&Bs main strenghts. I really hope these similar realism-breakers are something they would like to fix in future. Rather than I hope not them to being so called "balance" implementations. Which are IMO always the wrong approach for games which are trying to be somehow realistic. Also I think counter arguments against this like "it's not fun" are not really good arguments.

On singleplayer I'm not sure is it necessary to have repair fees for weapons or armours. Though at other hand your horse might get worse as well. So why not your weapons as well. Either way I really would like to see this breaking feature on heat of the battle.
 
how about its optional? so that those who dont want it can uncheckit


also i feel lances should be given a chance to 100% break from a couched hit

i know some hits would be smooth but your striking through flesh and bone surely theres a point in which a couched lance would crack under the pressure


maybe give attacking with anyother weapon depending on the material less damage then blocking but some


surely a sword cant just strike through a metal sheild and not warp slightly or dull a bit
 
I'd rather have this not be in Warband  for a couple of reasons. I apologize in advanced if this has been discussed earlier in the thread (read a few pages, but not all 18 )

#1
If you properly block a weapon, such as an axe, you aren't just stopping the cutting edge of the blade. As anyone who has done even the most basic levels of martial arts (European or otherwise) would know, a good block does not stop an opponent's force, but rather redirects the attack harmlessly. If you are using a wooden staff to block an axe, you don't put your staff to the blade of the axe, but you would push the shaft of the axe away, redirecting the force away from your body. When done correctly, your staff would not suffer any damage.

#2
As some people will point out, manual blocking represents a parry, although the animations do not display this. A more advanced parrying system was briefly experimented in Warband during the beta, but was cut from the game.


I've played plenty of games where durability was well implemented, but I feel that Warband's combat system is too simplistic to add this in a realistic manner, and it would also create some balance issues. Maybe for M&B 2, but don't fix what isn't broken for Warband.
 
Seawied86 said:
I'd rather have this not be in Warband  for a couple of reasons. I apologize in advanced if this has been discussed earlier in the thread (read a few pages, but not all 18 )

#1
If you properly block a weapon, such as an axe, you aren't just stopping the cutting edge of the blade. As anyone who has done even the most basic levels of martial arts (European or otherwise) would know, a good block does not stop an opponent's force, but rather redirects the attack harmlessly. If you are using a wooden staff to block an axe, you don't put your staff to the blade of the axe, but you would push the shaft of the axe away, redirecting the force away from your body. When done correctly, your staff would not suffer any damage.

#2
As some people will point out, manual blocking represents a parry, although the animations do not display this. A more advanced parrying system was briefly experimented in Warband during the beta, but was cut from the game.


I've played plenty of games where durability was well implemented, but I feel that Warband's combat system is too simplistic to add this in a realistic manner, and it would also create some balance issues. Maybe for M&B 2, but don't fix what isn't broken for Warband.

I'd have to think that a wooden staff would be prone to breaking if the blow was heavy enough..

Although I completely agree with the above as well..
 
^  its wood on wood,  and as said- the force of the blow is mostly deflected.
a staff (well, a staff designed for combat) is pretty damned sturdy,  its not going to break if you know what you are doing.

to expand on what is said above:  the blocking (and overall combat) system is an abstracted version of real life.  it would be impossible to fully simulate the massive complexities that go on during a fight,  so its simplified down.

true, if you just put your staff in the way of an incoming greataxe strike, its going to take a hell of a lot of damage-    but, if you were to deflect the blow away at the corect angle, with the correct technique,  the axe strike is simply going to go off in a harmless direction, leaving the staff completely unharmed from the collision.

Just like you arent only going to use 4 directions to attack from in real life, you arent going to block every strike with the same technique in real life.
 
Manic Oppressive said:
As has been said, I'd be fine with them being like shields, breaking but repairing themselves after the battle.

And as for realism issues, there were several cases of swords breaking in real life, but it didn't happen often because swords themselves were weapons of last resort. Lances were used on horseback, axes or bows on foot. That's why you don't hear about swords breaking.
swords were much more expensive and harder to make than lances, spears, axes and bows, but germans had those 2m long 2-handed swordsmen who rarely survived their first battle), and romans used swords, they weren't last resolt(depending who used them), but were not maked in as high numbers as other weapons.
 
this idea is important. RP games make us focus too much on the EPIC armour with the +2 against zombies or whatever. I say in a Multiplayer M&B expansion where you are going to have people churning out armour and weapons from their smith shops. Keep the demand up to meet the supply. So yes we break weapons we wear out armour. Not immediately but if we have a weaponsmith churning out 20-30 swords a week. lets say 2 may be masterworked 5 may be superior and 5 may be inferior or crude. Theres no magic to it so theres no real reason for any to be singularly better. Keep the masterwork ones for yourself to use, maybe give the superior ones to your elite troops, the normal to your regular troops and if your mean send the shoddy ones to your village militia hehe.

Thats how i see it working anyway.
 
I don't know how to imply this idea to the game but breaking opponents weapon or removing it from your opponents hands is a good idea and will make the game much more realistic. Weapons can be broken after taking some damage in reality (maces spears swords and so on...) so why not in the game? But obviously it will be a problem for the designers to make animations for all of the weapons to break or fall apart from players hand in a realistic aspect. Anyway I think it is a good idea.
 
Qwertyman said:
^  its wood on wood,  and as said- the force of the blow is mostly deflected.
a staff (well, a staff designed for combat) is pretty damned sturdy,  its not going to break if you know what you are doing.

to expand on what is said above:  the blocking (and overall combat) system is an abstracted version of real life.  it would be impossible to fully simulate the massive complexities that go on during a fight,  so its simplified down.

true, if you just put your staff in the way of an incoming greataxe strike, its going to take a hell of a lot of damage-    but, if you were to deflect the blow away at the corect angle, with the correct technique,  the axe strike is simply going to go off in a harmless direction, leaving the staff completely unharmed from the collision.

Just like you arent only going to use 4 directions to attack from in real life, you arent going to block every strike with the same technique in real life.


Looks like skills and/or weapon proficiencies could come into play then.

For example, a master swordsman would know how to deflect and counter an incoming blow without harming or losing his own weapon, whereas a recruit wouldn't have that same level of expertise and experience. Therefor it makes sense for a soldier who knows how to parry with his sword (ie, weapon proficiency 180 with One-Handed Weapons) to expose his blade to less harm than a soldier with little skill (ie, weapon proficiency 20 with One-Handed Weapons). The "Weapon Master" skill could also factor into this.

I agree that a "health and damage" system similar to the shield's would work well. During battle, weapons would take 'damage' (representing notches, fractures, bluntened edges, structural weaknesses, etc). As the weapon takes damage, it is less capable of inflicting damage in return, and loses effectiveness over time. Should the weapon's hitpoints reach zero, it will "downgrade" a rank (ie, become chipped, battered, bent, cracked, etc), and there should be a chance that it will break outright (in which case it's gone for good). Should the character reach the end of a battle without his weapon reaching zero hitpoints, then it is fully repaired (in the same way as a shield; it's assumed that the character has tended to his weapons after the battle, and fixed any damage sustained during the fight).

It'd also be great if unskilled troops could be disarmed by enemy strikes, should they attempt to parry overwhelming blows or duel more skilled opponents. For example, a swordsman could parry with another swordsman and not face much risk of being disarmed, but should he try to parry a strike from an enemy wielding a two-handed battle axe, then he puts his weapon in danger and risks having it knocked right out of his hands. Aside from upping the ante in the realism department, this would also introduce new strategies and deepen gameplay. For example, a fight between a swordsman and a maceman: instead of the standard 'hack, slash and block' techniques, it becomes a game of speed vs. power. No longer would lightly armed troops be able to thump it out with heavily-armed enemies, as they can now.




Sorry about the wall of text, but these are concepts that I believe would work really well within M&B, both enhancing gameplay and forcing the player to think about which weapons he or she wants to use.
 
Whilst i agree with most of your points,  I would not like to see this implemented in multiplayer,  as things like weapon breaking and disarming will detract from the skill based gameplay if you ask me,    I'd rather not have a roll of a dice determine if i drop my sword or not.
 
Really, really like the idea of weapon durability. I mean, realism is the basis and foundation for much of the enjoyment I get out of this game.. i'm one of those types.

Go spoony!
 
I agree with spoon pretty much on everything except the part where you can get disarmed by an opponent's strike.
That seems a little too dependant on luck.
 
Maybe weapon velocity (and/or skill levels) could determine whether a soldier is disarmed or not?

And yeah, losing my weapon in multiplayer would really piss me off, but I still think it could add to the game if implemented fairly (ie. disarming being based purely on weapon velocity or type rather than chance).  Shields would play a more important role (allowing you to defend yourself once disarmed), and heavier weapons (two-handed swords, axes, maces, etc) become more powerful (and better balanced) in the overall scheme of things. Archers armed with only a small one-handed weapon are put at a big disadvantage during melee fights (as they should be).

I guess you guys are right about it being an unnecessary hassle at times, but I reckon it's a no-brainer for the campaign, and it could at least be an option for multiplayer servers.
 
I_am_a_Spoon said:
Maybe weapon velocity (and/or skill levels) could determine whether a soldier is disarmed or not?

And yeah, losing my weapon in multiplayer would really piss me off, but I still think it could add to the game if implemented fairly (ie. disarming being based purely on weapon velocity or type rather than chance).  Shields would play a more important role (allowing you to defend yourself once disarmed), and heavier weapons (two-handed swords, axes, maces, etc) become more powerful (and better balanced) in the overall scheme of things. Archers armed with only a small one-handed weapon are put at a big disadvantage during melee fights (as they should be).

I guess you guys are right about it being an unnecessary hassle at times, but I reckon it's a no-brainer for the campaign, and it could at least be an option for multiplayer servers.


I think the fact that I have to watch out how many times I guard with my weapon to make sure it doesn't break on me in the midst of battle is as realistic I'd want to take it =P even for Campaign gameplay. It wouldn't make much sense to be disarmed unless they add a whole other animation which pushes the disarmed player/character back and allows you to pick your weapon back up before someone else attacks =P
 
weapons breaking and/or disarming would be a major pain for all.  instead, the weight of the blocking weapon and the weight of the attacking weapon should be taken into account.  if the attacking weapon is significantly heavier, then there would be a large chance of the blow staggering the blocker, leaving him vulnerable briefly for a follow-up attack.  this could provide a balance between sword-shield users and 2-handers.
 
jibba_jabba said:
weapons breaking and/or disarming would be a major pain for all.  instead, the weight of the blocking weapon and the weight of the attacking weapon should be taken into account.  if the attacking weapon is significantly heavier, then there would be a large chance of the blow staggering the blocker, leaving him vulnerable briefly for a follow-up attack.  this could provide a balance between sword-shield users and 2-handers.

Adding a simple 'health' bar for your weapons is much easier and lighter on the soal than your suggestion imo.
Weight of the weapon? Is there even a stat for Weight in this game? No.
 
Outlawed said:
jibba_jabba said:
weapons breaking and/or disarming would be a major pain for all.  instead, the weight of the blocking weapon and the weight of the attacking weapon should be taken into account.  if the attacking weapon is significantly heavier, then there would be a large chance of the blow staggering the blocker, leaving him vulnerable briefly for a follow-up attack.  this could provide a balance between sword-shield users and 2-handers.

Adding a simple 'health' bar for your weapons is much easier and lighter on the soal than your suggestion imo.
Weight of the weapon? Is there even a stat for Weight in this game? No. Yes

fixed :razz:  weapon weight is in the game and already influences seveal features like block crush.
 
Where is the poll for this sugestion?
My mighty flamberg was always blocked by a peasant using a club!!!  :mad:
 
Back
Top Bottom