Cavalry in this mod?

[Mathryt]

Cav is pretty OP yes. Dont understand why everybody is denying this, horses are hard to kill and you can reload from horseback, what more do you want? I can agree, realisme , yah they reloaded of their horse, but gameplay wise its horrible.

I was playing a 10 vs 10 ealier, they all had swedish horses, we all had cossack pikes we got decimated, round after round after round, while they just lost 2-4 max everytime. we couldnt really do much, it was an open map and if we sticked together they would just shoot us from their horses. Ultimately I just left.

Maybe I wrote this post out of a little rage, but I still think Cav is OP and theirs so many of them! 

 

[General Awesome]

You mean pikes, right? What's wrong with them? They should work fine. You just have to actually hit the horse's chest with the pointy end of the pike (and at right angle).

I play as pikemen rather often, and out of 20+ times I've braced my pike the enemy horse has only taken damage twice! Note that I always hit the horse dead on in the chest at a full gallop, usually with a Fine Long Pike.

 

[FrisianDude]

Cav is pretty OP yes. Dont understand why everybody is denying this, horses are hard to kill and you can reload from horseback, what more do you want? I can agree, realisme , yah they reloaded of their horse, but gameplay wise its horrible.

I was playing a 10 vs 10 ealier, they all had swedish horses, we all had cossack pikes we got decimated, round after round after round, while they just lost 2-4 max everytime. we couldnt really do much, it was an open map and if we sticked together they would just shoot us from their horses. Ultimately I just left.

Maybe I wrote this post out of a little rage, but I still think Cav is OP and theirs so many of them! 

Have you seen how slow a horseman has to go before they can even think of reloading? It's like shooting crippled fish in a think oily river. And some guns can't even be held while on horse.  (And it's somewhat silly to try to counter ten horsemen with ten pikemen. Why not bring a gun or two and a few horses yourself? )

 

[Mathryt]

Cav is pretty OP yes. Dont understand why everybody is denying this, horses are hard to kill and you can reload from horseback, what more do you want? I can agree, realisme , yah they reloaded of their horse, but gameplay wise its horrible.

I was playing a 10 vs 10 ealier, they all had swedish horses, we all had cossack pikes we got decimated, round after round after round, while they just lost 2-4 max everytime. we couldnt really do much, it was an open map and if we sticked together they would just shoot us from their horses. Ultimately I just left.

Maybe I wrote this post out of a little rage, but I still think Cav is OP and theirs so many of them! 

Have you seen how slow a horseman has to go before they can even think of reloading? It's like shooting crippled fish in a think oily river. And some guns can't even be held while on horse.  (And it's somewhat silly to try to counter ten horsemen with ten pikemen. Why not bring a gun or two and a few horses yourself? )

Well we did have some shots but no cav, but the balance is diffuclt to achieve with pubbers, if you get to many shots or horses you wont have enough pikes.
Also, a horse going slow and having to reload is still faster then infantry, yah its our mistake we didnt have horses, maybe horses should be standing still to be able to reload?

 

[Jean de Mentz]

Heya. I don't know if I'm the only one who has noticed this, but isn't the cavalry in this mod alot more powerful than in pretty much any mod out there?

It might just be me, but pretty much all my usual countermeasures are nullified.

No jump-slashing.
Drop the spear when you stab them charging you,
Bracing stops them sometimes, sometimes don't.
Horses have alot, alot of hp.

I thought about it, and since the mod is made by polish developers, they might've buffed cavalry due to national pride of the polish cavalry, hm?

Do you think cavalry is fine as it is now, or is it too strong? Or too weak even?
Thoughts?

I think only if the same mods could be transfered in a Medieval Age mod....i guess then the  people would be a lot more. ("Oh my bow does nothing!", "Oh why the horse is so tough!" - Shoot the horseman man!)
The horse is a Large beast twice the size of a man in length and height many times, not mention it's weight!!! If a man can stand an arrow or a bullet, what can a horse withstand
(especially in older times where avg human height was 160cm)
Only two+ bracing pikemen could stand a change against a headlong charge of a single cavalryman. I think it's pretty easy to figure out the picture....not every cav charge in history against pikemen ended like the one in Braveheart movie. Otherwise knights wouldn't be famous at all until gunpower, they would have vanished long before that.

 

[matmannen]

Spoiler

Heya. I don't know if I'm the only one who has noticed this, but isn't the cavalry in this mod alot more powerful than in pretty much any mod out there?

It might just be me, but pretty much all my usual countermeasures are nullified.

No jump-slashing.
Drop the spear when you stab them charging you,
Bracing stops them sometimes, sometimes don't.
Horses have alot, alot of hp.

I thought about it, and since the mod is made by polish developers, they might've buffed cavalry due to national pride of the polish cavalry, hm?

Do you think cavalry is fine as it is now, or is it too strong? Or too weak even?
Thoughts?

I think only if the same mods could be transfered in a Medieval Age mod....i guess then the  people would be a lot more. ("Oh my bow does nothing!", "Oh why the horse is so tough!" - Shoot the horseman man!)
The horse is a Large beast twice the size of a man in length and height many times, not mention it's weight!!! If a man can stand an arrow or a bullet, what can a horse withstand
(especially in older times where avg human height was 160cm)
Only two+ bracing pikemen could stand a change against a headlong charge of a single cavalryman. I think it's pretty easy to figure out the picture....not every cav charge in history against pikemen ended like the one in Braveheart movie. Otherwise knights wouldn't be famous at all until gunpower, they would have vanished long before that.

Good points 
Though i might add gunpowder was not the reason for the knights demise. During the first half of the 16th century was the time the gendarmers and men-at-arms armors got heavier and heavier; to be able to withstand the bullets.
The weapon that abolished the knight as the dominant force on the battlefield were the pike, especially the spanish tercioss proved extremally effective versus the french gendarmere.

 

[FrisianDude]

Cav is pretty OP yes. Dont understand why everybody is denying this, horses are hard to kill and you can reload from horseback, what more do you want? I can agree, realisme , yah they reloaded of their horse, but gameplay wise its horrible.

I was playing a 10 vs 10 ealier, they all had swedish horses, we all had cossack pikes we got decimated, round after round after round, while they just lost 2-4 max everytime. we couldnt really do much, it was an open map and if we sticked together they would just shoot us from their horses. Ultimately I just left.

Maybe I wrote this post out of a little rage, but I still think Cav is OP and theirs so many of them! 

Have you seen how slow a horseman has to go before they can even think of reloading? It's like shooting crippled fish in a think oily river. And some guns can't even be held while on horse.  (And it's somewhat silly to try to counter ten horsemen with ten pikemen. Why not bring a gun or two and a few horses yourself? )

Well we did have some shots but no cav, but the balance is diffuclt to achieve with pubbers, if you get to many shots or horses you wont have enough pikes.
Also, a horse going slow and having to reload is still faster then infantry, yah its our mistake we didnt have horses, maybe horses should be standing still to be able to reload?

Well, you don't really *need*  pikemen, not even as Sweden. Horsemen trying to reload while riding are actually slower than running infantry. And having to stop a horse entirely for reload would be pointless, then it would even be better to get off the horse because that makes you less of a target.

 

[testi]

I have not read the whole thread, but wanted to reply:

The horses/Cavalry are fine as they are IMO. I hate the way MM has their cavalry, where soldiers are able to do 360s and stab horses to death in one hit. They are perfect as they are now, and I hope you guys keep it as they are .

 

[maha]

it's somewhat silly to try to counter ten horsemen with ten pikemen. Why not bring [...] a few horses yourself? )

horses op

qed

 

[Roran 13]

How to counter a cavteam.

Get some pikemen.
Get some gunners/ranged units of any kind
Horsemen are less effective at range than real ranged units, who are % safe due to pikemen, who have to to nothing, unless suicidal cav comes around, which is a snack, if they aren't killhungry and abandon formation
Ranged units eat the horsemen who are helpless

 

[NightHawkreal]

When horse charges you with full speed, do you think you can hold your weapon when you hit it with it?


Yes, because that's the only thing you can hold.

 

[Hofiko]

I mean, not when you just hold it. When you HIT the charging horse with an item, it is quite impossible to hold it in your hand. For me it seems logical.

 

[FrisianDude]

Depends how you hold it, I suppose. Hold it 'loosely' enough and I suppose something like a sword would sort of tilt in your hand, causing it to trail along the flank of the horse. Stabbing a charging horse in the rapidly approaching chest with an estoc on the other hand... well, it's quite logical that that results in the estoc being jarred from my hand.

 

[NightHawkreal]

By the way, archers are still tearing the bowstring? Today, horse archers do not seem to suffer from it.

 

[FrisianDude]

Yeppers.

 

[NightHawkreal]

By the way, to throw off a rider, you need to hit him or the horse?

And, if the infantry drop his weapon at impact the horse, then the rider must drop the sword when hе falls from his horse.

 

[matmannen]

By the way, to throw off a rider, you need to hit him or the horse?

And, if the infantry drop his weapon at impact the horse, then the rider must drop the sword when hе falls from his horse.

Good point 

 

[Roran 13]

To throw him off the horse, hit him.


And no, you try to hit a car with a wooden stick when it's racing past, or jump of your bike with a wooden stick in ur hands.
Apart from some bruises and scratches, you'd easier keep ur stick clenched when falling.

Horsemen aren't hard to counter. It takes 2 inf to counetr 1 horse, but 100 horse to counter 50 inf.

 

[Duke Daniel Milutin]

I mean, not when you just hold it. When you HIT the charging horse with an item, it is quite impossible to hold it in your hand. For me it seems logical.

It depends on how you hit it. If you stab it, it's more realistic that the sword remains in the horse instead of just falling, and if you slash the horse it's smaller chance to lose the sword. Also, I saw some hussars had the sabers tied to their hands especially for this reason, not sure if they did that in 17th century tough.

 

[matmannen]

I mean, not when you just hold it. When you HIT the charging horse with an item, it is quite impossible to hold it in your hand. For me it seems logical.

It depends on how you hit it. If you stab it, it's more realistic that the sword remains in the horse instead of just falling, and if you slash the horse it's smaller chance to lose the sword. Also, I saw some hussars had the sabers tied to their hands especially for this reason, not sure if they did that in 17th century tough.

Also if you thrust the pike into a charging horse then yes you might not beable to hold on to it if the horse is fast enaugh. But with a braced pike (the pikes back is stuck into the ground) then the pike would either brake, or the horse would stop or even fall and tumble.