How do YOU start your kingdom?

I also tried taking catles then declining and taking another, but eventually Greg just kept offering me the same one (Ravenstern the town) over and over and I kept decling (about 6 times), and he didn't award Ravenstern to any other lords or himself. I got tired of that and quit the game.

Next day I started up the game with the intention of withdrawing my vassalage and all of a sudden Greg turned down my request for Ravenstern which gave me the oppo to spit in his face and go Rogue.

Why are the Ravenstern so wimpy when it comes to reclaiming lost castles & towns? In my new game I've been unaffiliated since day 1 and started grabbing the castles in NW corner of the map (I think it is, at least - the ones near Windholm and Ravenstern) and their response wasn't anything to write home about.

Which faction is VERY aggressive and which faction less so is random and varies from game to game.  If they are at war with another faction or two, they are too busy to come after you, that's all.

Fawzia dokhtar-i-Sanjar said:

You can always take back your oath and choose to keep your fiefs, in which case Gregory and most of the Ravenstern lords will immediately come against you, so you'd best have really big garrisons.  Your villages will be toast.

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How do you do this?  I don't get the dialogue option to keep my fiefs when I ask to be released from my oath.

If it works the old MnB way you´ll have to ask for a castle and if you don´t get it granted you renounce your oath and may keep your holdings.
Instant war with your mother faction will occur 9/10 though and you´ll keep your old, bad relations with the other factions.

noosers said:

If it works the old MnB way you´ll have to ask for a castle and if you don´t get it granted you renounce your oath and may keep your holdings.
Instant war with your mother faction will occur 9/10 though and you´ll keep your old, bad relations with the other factions.

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This is the only way to do it?  Fawzia made it sound like you could ask the king to renounce your oath and still retain your holdings.

creiner said:

noosers said:

If it works the old MnB way you´ll have to ask for a castle and if you don´t get it granted you renounce your oath and may keep your holdings.
Instant war with your mother faction will occur 9/10 though and you´ll keep your old, bad relations with the other factions.

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This is the only way to do it?  Fawzia made it sound like you could ask the king to renounce your oath and still retain your holdings.

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That's what I though too.

It´s the only way to keep your holdings.

The cheesy exploit is to leave your bastions lousily defended (1 peasant), then renounce your oath, lose all your holdings and immediately conquer it back utterly betraying them.

But that´s trickier to pull off, especially if your mother faction is a strong one.

noosers said:

It´s the only way to keep your holdings.

The cheesy exploit is to leave your bastions lousily defended (1 peasant), then renounce your oath, lose all your holdings and immediately conquer it back utterly betraying them.

But that´s trickier to pull off, especially if your mother faction is a strong one.

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Which option pisses them of the least/most?

First of, been playing PoP here and there for some year and a half now but never really got to the actual endgame so..
Few days ago I checked this here thread to see if there are any updates and surprise surprise!
Warband version out woot!


So I started out the looter guy.
Which I now see as a mistake because I had lots of troops all the time, some 80+ right from the start.
So with all the Noldor starting spawns being about 30ish.. u guess right, I didn`t get many shinies from the loot.
But as I was already gone pretty deep into this new game, and got all the companions (Lethlardian, Alistair etc) I decided to keep playing.

Around level 15 I got into Ravenstern vassalage and started working my way up right away.
Recruiting all the Barclay Footman and Sappers I could bump into, also got working leveling (foreign, south, north etc) Nobleman to Adventurers, and finally Hero Adventurers gave me pretty good base army to get things rollin`.
As they were in the middle of war with the Fierdsvain, that helped a lot to my leveling and also got me prolly couple hundred K`s of Denars through all them prisoners.

Around level 20 I already got a nice Noldor Warhorse that got me even more prisoners during field fights.
And then something very very nice happened, a traveler in some tavern sold me a map to the Red Brotherhood secret location where I got my 2nd Qualis Gem from the chest!
Was very wootlike moment!


And then I decided to check out all this amazing stuff I read about Noldor and the quest with Jatu Army and their city etc etc.
Started scouting for Noldor parties all around Laria and eventually got to relationship +1 or +2, 3 through releasing prisoners so they don`t attack me.
Followed them around assisting in battles so in mere couple days got to relationship in upper 20ies with em.

Now, Laria being my most favorite town I decided to start out the Kingdom of Pendor with Laria with its capital.
Took the 2 castles around it and the Laria itself and started to slowly establish my own kingdom.
All of this was taken from Sarleon based purely on my troops consisting of Barclay & Adventurers mix I mentioned before.
Very nice combo in early game.
As this part of the game is the real deal I am going very slowly, being that I was in peace after I captured Sarleon king and he proposed peace treaty.

After this I was cruising the map gathering my new army and with 3 ex- Sarleon lords I recruited after releasing them from battles my kingdom was starting to shape up.
With numerous D`Shar Bladesman as my early infantry (I plan to establish Knights of the Ebony Gauntlet with my next Qualis Gem) and Empire
Crossbowmen I got around 60 Ravenstern Rangers to get some mid tier archers.
I also won numerous tournaments on my way (including the Noldor one in Eclai ) that got my purse a bit heavier. 

Now, at day 280ish in the game, Sarleon declared a war on me once again so I will crush them naturally taking Sarleon, Marleon and only 2 castles they have left (Ravenstern and Fierdsvain took Avendor and couple of castles) and a few Lords in the process.
Only have one more book to read so my skills are quite good for a lvl 27 character.
I also traded one Qualis Gem for the elixir (which would prolly be better used on an Knight Order, but oh well.. ), and another one to open up the Noldor Store once I got my relationship up with em.

I am level 27 now and my gear is:

Spirited Noldor Spirit Horse (70 armor, 52 speed, 37 maneuver, 36 charge, 190 HP, 6 riding skill req) wouldn`t trade it for a real life tank
Thick Mettenheim Steel Mittens (11 body armor)
Ebony Platemail (2 head, 60 body, 19 leg, 18 STR req)
Noldor Leather Boots (37 leg armor)
Knight Helm (55 head armor 12 STR req)
Balanced Blunt Tip Lance (dmg 20 blunt) gives me A LOT of prisoners early in the fight and on the routing ones also
Balanced Runed Bastard Sword (dmg 50 swing, 45 trust) haven`t seen better 1H sword in the game yet, having dmg/speed/REACH combo in mind
Noldor Enchanted Shield (1000/1000, 25 resistance, 119 size, 100 speed rating) great stuff in sieges

So the next thing I plan is slowly establishing what would someday be a united Pendor Kingdom once again.
Very nice game I got goin` on here if u ask me..

How much right to rule is advisable before starting your kingdom in Pendor? I am getting the itch to start mine but I only have 9 RTR.

Started my first kingdom near the Noldor forest with a castle from the Empire while they were occupied with the Sarleons and D'Shars, it's something Keep, Noldor patrols one border, mountains between me and Sarleon (but they like me though) and an open area where the Empire sends thier armies and my cav dominates and the silvermist rangers take down horse from a distance

This is the best way I find to start a kingdom

1 get all your ducks in a row first, that means upgrade your troops (you'll need a ton of high qualty troops to take the castle/town you want to take first and then hold out against the 1500 man army that is going to try to retake it), level up yourself and companions, and gather lots and lots of denars

2 Get good relations with other factions and thier lords (even the faction your going the invade), this helps a lot in the long run when you need help holding that first castle and when you are ready to expand. When you do start your kingdom and have to fight off the counterattacks always release lords to make them like you better.

3 Location,Location,Location. This is the most important. Find the right spot to start. Look for a place with defendable borders, starting out with a castle in the middle of the faction you took it from or between two factions take you have negative relations with is a very bad idea, personally I find it best to start near the Noldor forest after you on on good terms with the Noldor (you have to get a good relation with them anyways to win the game) as they will patrol part of your border. Also look for natural boundries like mountains and rivers, make the enemy come to you and make it difficult. if you like cav make the enemy to you via flatlands.

4 Politics. Play the political game. build strong bonds with nearby factions to prevent them from turning on you. Try to sue for peace with the faction you took the castle/town from. When you choose the castle you want to take take it from a faction that is at war. Check the status of the war, ask yourself ,is this war going to last long or not? You can fing out by asking lords. A war that has no end in the near future means that they will be busy for longer.

After you have your castle

1 When you are at peace build upgrades for your castle and it's village(s), build an economy to get the denars coming in to prepare for the next target you want

2 Don't go lord happy just yet, lords require a lot of attention in the beginnig and you want to upgrade the fief with buildings before you give it to them because they do not do it, if you really want a lord get one that has great relation or a companion

3 Plan the next conquest in detail, how many troops will you need, supplies (remember even in Pendor an army marches on it's stomach), what will you get out of the town/castle, will I have enough men to garrison both my first fief and the new one, basically think long term.


Above all remember that starting a kingdom is mid to late game and it takes a very long time to get on your feet so don't whine because you expected to be king of Pendor in a few hundred days. And if you can then hats off to you.

1) Have 1 faction to own the whole world. Meanwhile get as much friends among lords as possible.
2) Create your own faction. Anywhere. Fight against the enemies of the Chosen (by you) Faction.
3) Capture as much friendly lords as posibble. Make them your vassals.
4) Indict all vassals for treason. Become vassal of Chosen Faction, keeping all the lands.
5) Assembly the army. Renounce the oath. Start the war. Capture all friendly lords. Make them your vassals. (!) It's very important to have 21+ relation with all fief-holding lords (usually, they are all close friends of dominating faction's king, so their number is quite few (like 8-10)). Why 21? Cause when you attack them and take them prisoner, it will decrease relation by 4 points. If you succeed, ALL lands except king's ones will be your faction's.
6) Repeat until the king of "Chosen" Faction remains as an only member of that faction.
7) Beat him, capture, turn him into a jest, capture all his holdings - become a King of all Pendor - FTW!

ok proably nub question but i'm at day 72 atm and ofc want to start off my own kingdom wich i know is a pain in the @#$@#

and i currently am a merc army for the ravernstern king wich gives a nice ammount of income,

so this time i want to do it right and got a few questions

1 as stated above howmuch right to rule is advicabel?
2 what is the best way to increase relation with lords? (i do quests for each lord i encounter and help them in fights but it aint going fast ^_^
3 advicable troops (i got ravernstern troops)
4 does honor has to do anything with this? cause i keep training peasents vs bandits and then the offer me there stuff but i refuce each time wich gives me honor
5 howmuch denars are advicable to have before starting your own kingdom

anything i missed?

A few things to look for (some of these come from tips people posted earlier):

1. An easily defensible castle but a weak garrison. One that borders a minimal number of factions is ideal well. I believe Talon Castle and Poinsbruk are some of the most easily defensible, and a lot of people tend to take Laria early. Basically, that area that's right on the edge of Jatu and Noldor territory is a decent place to start. The best way to ensure a weak garrison is to wait for it to be attacked, retaken, and maybe retaken again. I've seen castles with as low as an 80 man garrison.
2. Ideally you want to take it from a faction that is at war. The more people they're at war with, the better. This will ensure the army that comes to retake it will be pretty small. If you happen to know who the marshal of the faction you're taking it from, try to take him prisoner. Taking the king prisoner will help too.
3. Honor will help a LOT with some lords' relations. I have around 100 and a number of lords I haven't even done quests for (hell, I don't even know if I've met some of them) are at 35+ rep. In the case of most lords, letting them go is a better idea than taking them prisoner, with marshals and kings the obvious exceptions or if you're very short of cash. This will raise honor as well. Evil lords will really hate you for it, but that's no big deal.
4. Ravenstern Rangers are awesome, so you've got a good start (you will want a LOT of them though, at least 50 I'd say). Empire (Armored) Crossbowmen are good to have as well. Apart from that, as much heavy infantry (cavalry will work in a pinch too) as you can. Armored Axemen, Huscarls, Bladesmen, Adventurers, you get the picture. In addition, max out your army. Bring recruits for any extra spots because you're just going to want to settle down in your castle, train people and heal for the ugly battle that will come. I've tried to run around collecting recruits, but I'd just recommend bringing as many troops as you can and hoping your surgeon and medic do work.
5. The more money, the better, and the less you'll have to worry about finding tournaments, etc. in places that are at war with you.

Don't try to take a castle too early though. You will definitely want a few trainers (I have myself with 6, Boadice with 4 and Fred with 5) and a max army size of at least 150 (200+ would be better). Make sure you load up on food while you're collecting recruits, and to keep morale up, get your troops drunk in every town you come by until your morale maxes out. You do NOT want starvation or deserters in the middle of your siege.

Never Darktide said:

A few things to look for (some of these come from tips people posted earlier):

1. An easily defensible castle but a weak garrison. One that borders a minimal number of factions is ideal well. I believe Talon Castle and Poinsbruk are some of the most easily defensible, and a lot of people tend to take Laria early. Basically, that area that's right on the edge of Jatu and Noldor territory is a decent place to start. The best way to ensure a weak garrison is to wait for it to be attacked, retaken, and maybe retaken again. I've seen castles with as low as an 80 man garrison.
2. Ideally you want to take it from a faction that is at war. The more people they're at war with, the better. This will ensure the army that comes to retake it will be pretty small. If you happen to know who the marshal of the faction you're taking it from, try to take him prisoner. Taking the king prisoner will help too.
3. Honor will help a LOT with some lords' relations. I have around 100 and a number of lords I haven't even done quests for (hell, I don't even know if I've met some of them) are at 35+ rep. In the case of most lords, letting them go is a better idea than taking them prisoner, with marshals and kings the obvious exceptions or if you're very short of cash. This will raise honor as well. Evil lords will really hate you for it, but that's no big deal.
4. Ravenstern Rangers are awesome, so you've got a good start (you will want a LOT of them though, at least 50 I'd say). Empire (Armored) Crossbowmen are good to have as well. Apart from that, as much heavy infantry (cavalry will work in a pinch too) as you can. Armored Axemen, Huscarls, Bladesmen, Adventurers, you get the picture. In addition, max out your army. Bring recruits for any extra spots because you're just going to want to settle down in your castle, train people and heal for the ugly battle that will come. I've tried to run around collecting recruits, but I'd just recommend bringing as many troops as you can and hoping your surgeon and medic do work.
5. The more money, the better, and the less you'll have to worry about finding tournaments, etc. in places that are at war with you.

Don't try to take a castle too early though. You will definitely want a few trainers (I have myself with 6, Boadice with 4 and Fred with 5) and a max army size of at least 150 (200+ would be better). Make sure you load up on food while you're collecting recruits, and to keep morale up, get your troops drunk in every town you come by until your morale maxes out. You do NOT want starvation or deserters in the middle of your siege.

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Ok this helps putting me in the right direction.

but what about right to rule? does  that needs to be high as well? cause it seems its harder to get then honor

I've never really gotten too far in the game, so I'm honestly not sure. Bear in mind that you can still gain RTR after you've taken a castle and declared independence.

ok so finaly i am beginning to start my own kingdom.

i took highpass fortress from the empire the took it from the d'har i believe.

and after beating back 500 invading empire forces the wanted to make peace (nice deal ;p)

but now more questions apear! :p

first you need to select a minister

1 does it mather who you pick? or does your minister need skills. if so wich?
2 howmuch right to rule you need before other people are gone regonize you as king? i got 35 atm but each time i send an emisery the all reply back as 'korpah' instead king korpah
3 does your emisery requires skills? in the txt it says you can better send someon wich is persuasive but does it realy mathers?
4 is it posible to put a companion in a castle so he trains the troops? or can i only get the recruit ones and i have to recruit them my self?
5 what is a good way to make money? i got 5 enterprices up and running but the do not make enough money to field my army or my castle + village
6 does it help if you put raw materials or food in your village (sell it for free) does it grow extra fast or does it only improve by building stuff in it?

proably more questions will come when i start to build up more forces again to take my first city nal - tar. and ye i know its kinda off map. but laria was never under attack and nothing happened kinda in that region :p so i went scouting with my warband of 150 revernsten troops ^_^ and stumbled upon a light defended highpass fortress

so anyone can help?

1) Not as far as I can tell. The best one in my opinion is (for a male character) your wife, since it means you don't have to lose a companion. If not, find a companion who doesn't fit into your current group (would argue with someone), dress them up in some nice courtier clothes and let them stand there looking impressive.
EDIT: I forgot, don't let your minister be the one picked from local citizenry, because they don't like the job and won't get all the options.

2) Right to rule is strange. It maxes out at 99. You can get it from your companion quests, or from being part of a faction (being a mercenary for a faction works too) when a peace treaty is declared. You also get it from marrying into a noble family (male or female). Firstly, you can work on it from the beginning - choose who you want as companions and note it down somewhere, but hire every companion in the game. The ones you don't want in your final group can be sent on their special quests to raise support, and when they come back just tell them to separate. Each mission gives you 3 RtR iirc.
I know that RtR has an effect upon persuading lords to join your kingdom, but I'm not sure how large an effect it is. I'm pretty certain it has no effect on negotiating a peace treaty.
Weirdly, there is one other way to get right to rule - if another lord recognises you as a king. This requires high right to rule anyway, plus a companion with high persuasion as your emissary, plus (the biggest and by far most important factor) a conducive political situation - they will only recognise your title if both your kingdoms are at war with the same enemy, they consider your kingdom powerful enough to be of help in the war, and your kingdom isn't so close to theirs that they feel threatened/want your land.
This is (as far as I can tell) the only point of sending an emissary to a non-hostile kingdom - to gain a small amount of right to rule. Pretty useless I think.

In my experience, RtR isn't that important, since you can work on it throughout the game, and it has a tiny effect compared to political situations and your relationship with a lord. However, you will need it to help persuade lords to join you, especially the ones who want to hear that you have a good claim for the throne. Just do all the companion missions, and fight a few wars and next time you check it'll be maxed out anyway. Not something to worry about too much.

3) Yeah, it says a persuasive emissary is better. Sarah the Fox starts with high persuasion, so send her. But, remember that while persuasion helps, what is far more important in negotiating a peace treaty is how the AI feels about the political situation. The persuasion is a tiny factor compared to that. If they aren't at war with anyone else, have more lords than you (likely), have more fiefs than you, and you've taken some of their land, even if you have a companion with 10 persuasion you're not going to get them to sign a peace deal. They need to feel like they've won a major victory (taken some land back), or you're winning to the point where they don't stand a chance (they're not going to feel like that unless you take over 50% of their land and lots of their lords desert). Or, you need to wait until another faction declares war on them. Politics are far more important than persuasion.

4) I think the training grounds will train your garrisoned troops. Though I've had troops trained in castles without training grounds, so I don't know. If you make a companion a lord, he'll train his troops like any other lord (slowly). Training them yourself is usually better. If you build up your fief's improvements and get their economy high, they will produce better quality recruits (higher tiers). If you get the fief to like you more, it'll produce more recruits - with +99 relations a village will give you 20 recruits per visit minimum. Don't worry too much about training up your garrison - pack it full of low tier troops. The AI looks at the numbers of troops, not the level, when it decides what to siege (afaik).

5) Fighting and looting, or trade. There's a really good trade guide somewhere here, and I saw a post somewhere about how to build the best enterprises in the best locations. Also, improve your fiefs - it'll cost a lot but its a good investment because they give more income and provide better soldiers.

6) I don't think that'll work. Unless the economic system is more complex than I thought and the farmers actually sell that stuff in town, improving their wealth. But I doubt it. Building stuff improves the economy, but also so does doing quests for the village elder - which also raises relations and they give you more recruits. It's a win/win situation. Also, DO NOT let your fief get raided. It damages buildings and cripples the economy.

cheers @ reply!  and so far i keep my head above water with the money xD, and i keep killing lords from the d'hak but the keep returning sooo anoying xD but again thanks for the reply. going back to my major battle now :p