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MadVader

Duke
M&BWB
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Sounds like a pointless exercise as people don't read documentation.
If you need to understand the code, just study it until you do, documenting everything won't help you get there quicker, it will slow you down for no good reason.

Diplomacy may need to be broken up into modules, not expanded. Maybe a mod or a player needs inter-kingdom diplomacy only and not exploitative patrol creation, or the other way around. It lost its original use by semi-randomly accumulating features.
This happens with every utility mod as mod authors can't help themselves. Even Cabadrin added whistling for horses into PBOD, where it doesn't belong at all.
So, please make it smaller and more manageable if possible. It's not a full standalone mod and I believe it was never supposed to be.
 

yehrom

Sergeant at Arms
WBWF&S
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MadVader said:
Sounds like a pointless exercise as people don't read documentation.
[...]
Diplomacy may need to be broken up into modules, not expanded. Maybe a mod or a player needs inter-kingdom diplomacy only and not exploitative
[...]
So, please make it smaller and more manageable if possible. It's not a full standalone mod and I believe it was never supposed to be.
I dont want to be rude but do you have any knowledge about coding?

'Documentation' is a mandatory.
We dont speak here about doc for 'user", but for coder.

'Expanded' doesnt mean 'more fatty big piece'.
I agree with you, Diplomacy options should be better designed, more details in them.
 

MadVader

Duke
M&BWB
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yehrom said:
MadVader said:
Sounds like a pointless exercise as people don't read documentation.
[...]
Diplomacy may need to be broken up into modules, not expanded. Maybe a mod or a player needs inter-kingdom diplomacy only and not exploitative
[...]
So, please make it smaller and more manageable if possible. It's not a full standalone mod and I believe it was never supposed to be.
I dont want to be rude but do you have any knowledge about coding?

'Documentation' is a mandatory.
We dont speak here about doc for 'user", but for coder.
It's not as rude as ill-informed. If you check the Forge frequently, which good coders do, you would know.

Sure, documentation is nice, but as I stated people won't read it unless it's short and well presented, not a list of every obscure change.
Several well-formulated sentences that will start you on your way to integrating Diplomacy features into a mod may be sufficient.
 

yehrom

Sergeant at Arms
WBWF&S
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Well, I dont use the Forge section. The few time I dig into it I never find any useful things.
One thing they should have done since Age is an overall documentation of the ModSys... which 'good coders' would have done.
I just cant understand they never did.

As said early, we speak here about 'technical documentation' for the coder that would work our this project. Not one 'user-end' oriented for player or modder.

'Documentation' is mostly drawing and pattern.
Currently we have only inline comment, which is the minimum at least, but we need to build an overview about what Diplomacy, where, and how.
That would be our 'documentation'.
 

MadVader

Duke
M&BWB
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yehrom said:
Well, I dont use the Forge section. The few time I dig into it I never find any useful things.
One thing they should have done since Age is an overall documentation of the ModSys... which 'good coders' would have done.
I just cant understand they never did.
General ModSys documentation: http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php/topic,142422.0.html
Better operations documentation: http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php/topic,213060.0.html
 

yehrom

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WBWF&S
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Obviously, we failed to communicate.
Thoses informations are great for people interested to begin in modding, indeed. But that's 'tutorial', the documentation I am speaking. As explained early, it dont provide any global overview which is the first key to have.
I dont blame the Forge community. They do what is interesting for them. I just point this section dont offer what is needed for such project.
We just dont share the same the objectives.

It is not an 'ego' issue as you may think, if you find something useful to help that's very welcome.
I am here to find people which works seriously, in good condition , and that involves having this famous 'documentation'.
Without we can just do crappy patchwork code which will lead us into issue.
If you have a better working pattern, great. Just expose it there.

 

MadVader

Duke
M&BWB
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I don't understand what else do you need, better provide an example.

You were lamenting the lack of ModSys documentation, I showed you some. You said it doesn't help you and that you need a tutorial, if I understand you correctly.
Here's a ModSys tutorial: http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php/topic,56798.0.html
I have a feeling you are not really looking for help, given your strange attitude about the Forge. It's the only place to get help.
 

yehrom

Sergeant at Arms
WBWF&S
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...

Sorry for my lame english.
I didnt said 'I need 'tutorial'. I said what you presented as 'a documentation' is just 'a tutorial'. What is called 'global documentation' is :
yehrom said:
'Documentation' is mostly drawing and pattern.
Currently we have only inline comment, which is the minimum at least, but we need to build an overview about what Diplomacy, where, and how.
That would be our 'documentation'.
I am just looking for people ready to support the Diplomacy mod. The method I suggested is the very basis for any kind of project. The easiest way.
I really failed to see where a misunderstood can occur there  :?:
 

MadVader

Duke
M&BWB
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I see, you want people to help you understand how Diplomacy code works?

Use WinMerge and compare its files to Native, that's what I did when I was studying its code. The sources are well documented, although the code is complex at places and there are many, many small changes.
Drawing diagrams won't help much, Diplomacy code is grafted onto Native and next you'll go off drawing diagrams for Native which is a never-ending task.
Instead, the end result should be simple instructions on how to work with Diplomacy code.

Keep learning English, as you can see it's crucial. I still can't quite understand what are you trying to say and it will be the same for anyone else. This is critically important if you are proposing to actually write documentation in English.
 

yehrom

Sergeant at Arms
WBWF&S
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Well, thanks for your try. But again, look like we really dont speak about the same thing. So instead of trolling this post, lets end the discuss here.