SP - Player, NPCs & Troops Yo were the black women at?

[Mr Similan]

I disagree with the fantasy statement. warband didnt have equel-rights and it made for more intressting gameplay as a female(see different ways of gaining power, arguing with lords). I dont see why Bannerlord shouldnt be warranted the same treatment. Especially with the southern empire having a female leader, it could lead to better intrigue
@Timmortal stop replying to me since you missed the point of your fallicious argument

 

[Tovias]

I am interested in this but not just for women. I wanted to make a bedouin playthrough but there is barely any dark skinned companions or even from Aserai culture. I wouldn't mind it so much if we could do like in Warband and alter the appearance of companions but we can't.

 

[Androme1]

I mean.. it's a game. The theme is medieval but that does not mean it strives to be as realistic as possible.

The game strives to be as realistic as possible in every way imaginable. Except about women, for some reason. All the soldiers in the game are still men, but for some reason it's socially acceptable in-universe for women to be war leaders almost as commonly as men.

Very weird.

 

[Mr Similan]

I am interested in this but not just for women. I wanted to make a bedouin playthrough but there is barely any dark skinned companions or even from Aserai culture. I wouldn't mind it so much if we could do like in Warband and alter the appearance of companions but we can't.

I like the idea of adding a nubian equivalent under the aserai. It would add more ways to expand and use some more of the dessert space.

 

[Earth Dragon]

Can we not have conversations co-opted by SJW nonsense.

A huge selling point of Warband was its immersive tilt, to include there being less women in combat roles and wanting to run around and adventure. It was more difficult for women to move up in the world, and since they were plagued with REAL problems and not complaining about your internet not allowing you to play a video game smoothly, many concentrated on the day to day.

As someone who is playing a female main right now myself, I am extremely disappointed these features are almost nonexistent in Bannerlord. The all male troops are more for model convenience, as many have pointed out women generals, faction leaders, and companions are a dime a dozen.

And this is where we have a thread like this: Where are all the _______ group that never got covered.

if there were _________, we’d be asking for _________ and_________ and _________.

But as someone playing a Black woman as my main, didn’t notice. I did notice the 75% female companion ratio. And I feel the more immersive angle is have to have 75% male companion. If you want a woman, you can always create them as the main story. But Joan of Arc wasn’t fighting wars with an entourage of other teenage girl like some shorty anime. She did it with men: the gender who is So lucky to be more dispensable and gets to fight all the wars.

And lastly, if you hadn’t noticed, the game was bugged and not allowing Aserai and Khuzait companions to spawn for a couple of those builds. And the Aserai is where you might see a black woman companion spawn

 

[Cèsar de Quart]

I disagree with the fantasy statement. warband didnt have equel-rights and it made for more intressting gameplay as a female(see different ways of gaining power, arguing with lords). I dont see why Bannerlord shouldnt be warranted the same treatment. Especially with the southern empire having a female leader, it could lead to better intrigue
@Timmortal stop replying to me since you missed the point of your fallicious argument

I will agree with you in that I'd like to see playing a male being different than playing a female. While playing a female, I'd like to see conservative, stiff male lords belittle you, some female ladies telling you that your place it not with them, while some of the more open-minded people might be swayed by your deeds and charisma.

Joan of Arc didn't have it easy.

 

[Kripaz]

You chose to ignore when I said "exceptional" and also ignored my comment on "Actually, that many of the companions are women fits well their role as "we're the rejects, the pirates, the bandits, the disinherited... you come from the gutter, and so do they, men and women alike, defying social conventions."

Yea i just ignored that, my bad.

You're also wrong on another account: we don't know pretty much every female warrior by name. We know of the famous ones, but the bias in the sources just doesn't allow us to know. We don't know how many women were acting outside of the norm (as well as men acting outisde of the norm, people acting outside of the norm), but from the little examples we have, we can imagine (not be sure, but imagine) that it may not have been uncommon, just rarely recorded.

Well, it's just a bad habit if we try to imagine history. Of course there's thing that haven't been recorded and some are lost in time. But we cannot really use something as argument that we don't know of.

I also don't think "taboo" is the word you have to use in this case. When a woman fought in the Middle Ages, and was recorded, it was not scratched from record. It was commented with astonishment, used as example of defiance or determination, or painted in whatever light the chronicler needed it to be painted. But not erased. Not taboo, just uncommon.

Yes, it wasn't scratched, it was either glorified or demonized in historical written text. Best example is the case of Jeanne d'Arc: English blamed her to be heretic and french thought her to be a gift from god.

 

[Adrivan]

The game strives to be as realistic as possible in every way imaginable. Except about women, for some reason. All the soldiers in the game are still men, but for some reason it's socially acceptable in-universe for women to be war leaders almost as commonly as men.

Very weird.

That exception is exactly what im talking about. If it was striving to be as realistic as possible, there would be no exceptions. But there is at least one, and that's ok. Although I agree it's weird that there are female leaders but not female soldiers.

 

[Calathar]

I am interested in this but not just for women. I wanted to make a bedouin playthrough but there is barely any dark skinned companions or even from Aserai culture. I wouldn't mind it so much if we could do like in Warband and alter the appearance of companions but we can't.

it was a bug, after latest patch I started seeing different culture companions. And I don't want to return to Warband lore as it was inconsistent. For example, Isolda said that Swadia had many queens in the past but there is no single female lord in game. If the society would be 100% patriarchal, there wouldn't be any queen, simple as that. Bear in mind that patriarchal society was enforced mainly in monotheistic religions in our world. In old, politeistic religions, it varied. We don't know anything about religion in this game, thus comparing Calradia to our world is daft.

 

[Androme1]

That exception is exactly what im talking about. If it was striving to be as realistic as possible, there would be no exceptions. But there is at least one, and that's ok. Although I agree it's weird that there are female leaders but not female soldiers.

I'm sorry but I don't think you're making any sense.
You're fine with the game aiming to be as realistic as possible, but you're also fine with if they make that one single exception which breaks the immersion? And your complaint on the issue is the fact that they don't go further in breaking the realistic grounding of the setting by adding female soldiery?

 

[Cèsar de Quart]

Well, it's just a bad habit if we try to imagine history. Of course there's thing that haven't been recorded and some are lost in time. But we cannot really use something as argument that we don't know of.

We can, if it's for a videogame set in a fantasy setting (however low the fantasy may be).

If this was happening in Kingdom Come: Deliverance, I'd complain. But here, I don't mind. This is a fantasy world where the patriarchy is a tad less severe and where the recent chaos the world has been thrown in makes it possible for some people (like the player) to crawl through the cracks of established norms.

I'd actually like it if, say, 5 or 10% of the soldiers that pop up in your recruitment screen were female.

 

[Tovias]

it was a bug, after latest patch I started seeing different culture companions. And I don't want to return to Warband lore as it was inconsistent. For example, Isolda said that Swadia had many queens in the past but there is no single female lord in game. If the society would be 100% patriarchal, there wouldn't be any queen, simple as that. Bear in mind that patriarchal society was enforced mainly in monotheistic religions in our world. In old, politeistic religions, it varied. We don't know anything about religion in this game, thus comparing Calradia to our world is daft.

I don't know, if you go to the heroes sections, all the available heroes are battanian, empire, sturgian and a couple vlandian ones. There is no khuzait or aserai. No mentioning how there is no engineer, steward, smith, etc companions.
Also, that mention of the swadia lineage is difficult to use right now because Swadia is still not a thing.

 

[vahadar]

Do I have to remind you all that this is a fantasy game? Unless you believe Calradia existed. In a fantasy game, females can be whatever they want to be regardless of period.

Well said, end of argument, back to OP topic, thanks

 

[Kripaz]

We can, if it's for a videogame set in a fantasy setting (however low the fantasy may be).

If this was happening in Kingdom Come: Deliverance, I'd complain. But here, I don't mind. This is a fantasy world where the patriarchy is a tad less severe and where the recent chaos the world has been thrown in makes it possible for some people (like the player) to crawl through the cracks of established norms.

I'd actually like it if, say, 5 or 10% of the soldiers that pop up in your recruitment screen were female.

Like i'm trying to point out, i don't care what is Taleworlds penis policy, i'm just too passionate when it comes to historical accuracy.
I'm also on board if there were female warriors in Bannerlord because for my understanding, there is none.

 

[hruza]

Yeah... no. I'm not going to give examples out of the ordinary like Queen Tamar,

She was addressing her troops from the balcony of a church while appointing male generals to lead them in the battle.

like Joan of Arc

Woman that is know to ever use sword only as a tool to beat her servants with it using the flat side.

Artemisia of Caria

She was commanding a ship, sailing around and ramming other ships. Mostly of her own side.

there were women soldiers, women warriors, women pirates, they existed in the fringes

No they were not. I asked people to bring example of a women that are recorded to be fighting in battle during Middle Ages in the geographic area of what MB represents and they could not find a single one. Only examples they could bring was women disguised as men participating in the bar fights and women throwing axes at the enemy from their balconies during sieges. And that was rare enough sight to make them famous.

Women were leading armies in battles on very rare occasions, but they were not actually fighting in the battles. And when they led armies in those very rare cases, it was usually not because they were skilled generals, but because of the authority of their position inherited from male relatives.

I am not excluding that some women actually fought in battle, but that was clearly very, very rare exception. There are millions of records of men in battles all through Medieval history. People who say that women fought in battle can't bring single example of a woman. There is probably reason for that.

This being a parahistorical scenario, I don't see what's wrong with a little nudge on the direction of equality.

It's not little. England had 3 Queens during Middle Ages and about +-40 Kings. Out of those 3 Queens one was on the throne just 9 days. That's ratio of about 7%. And England actually had fairly high ratio of Queens, if you go to count also say France, Russia and Turkey, you will get something like 2% ratio.

Moreover out of those 3 Queens no one was leading troops in battle let alone actuary fight in one.

Women are unrealistically over-represented in the positions of power, command and warfare in the game if compared to real historical facts.

Representation of a skills and value of a women in the Medieval combat, fair fight:

 

[SoldierHair]

She was addressing her troops from the balcony of a church while appointing male generals to lead them in the battle.



Woman that is know to ever use sword only as a tool to beat her servants with it using the flat side.



She was commanding a ship, sailing around and ramming other ships. Mostly of her own side.



No they were not. I asked people to bring example of a women that are recorded to be fighting in battle during Middle Ages in the geographic area of what MB represents and they could not find a single one. Only examples they could bring was women disguised as men participating in the bar fights and women throwing axes at the enemy from their balconies during sieges.

Women were leading armies in battles on rare occasions, but they were not actually fighting in the battles. And when they led armies, it was usually not because they were skilled generals, but because of the authority of their position inherited from male relatives.

I am not excluding that some women actually fought in battle, but that was clearly very, very rare exception. There are millions of records of men in battles all through Medieval history. People who say that women fought in battle can't bring single example of a woman. There is probably reason for that.



It's not little. England had 3 Queens during Middle Ages and about +-40 Kings. Out of those 3 Queens one was on the throne just 9 days. That's ratio of about 7%. And England actually had fairly high ratio of Queens, if you go to count also say France, Russia and Turkey, you will get something like 2% ratio.

Moreover out of those 3 Queens no one was leading troops in battle let alone actuary fight in one.

Women are unrealistically over-represented in the positions of power, command and warfare in the game if compared to real historical facts.

Representation of a skills and value of a women in the Medieval combat, fair fight:

Best response in this thread, and probably the only one here that actually knows some history and not "western PC" history.

 

[Adrivan]

I'm sorry but I don't think you're making any sense.
You're fine with the game aiming to be as realistic as possible, but you're also fine with if they make that one single exception which breaks the immersion? And your complaint on the issue is the fact that they don't go further in breaking the realistic grounding of the setting by adding female soldiery?

I said the game does not strive to be as realistic as possible, you said that... My point was that the exception is proof that they don't really try to to make it 100% realistic. But then if they decided to make females unrealistically represented in the army, they should also be among soldiers, not only leadership.

 

[Ernsteen]

well, my question is why are there even so many woman in this game. i mean, its supposed to be medieval'ish right? And i encounter way more female companions then male...

The companions need a lot of work still and a lot of companion types are missing. Some companion types are gender specific like the medic.
When it comes to nobles, there is clearly a 50/50 split, on the field there are a lot less women than men leading armies. Some are saying, still too many, but instead of arguing with people on the internet whether or not I want more or less women in this game, I'd like to point out that according to that one big reddit thread about unused content in the games code, sexism was supposed to be a relatively big mechanic.
I think that would be very interesting if you had some faction that do not allow women in the armies, and others that might be ambivalent. There could be legislation tied to this that could be even more specific than "woman - yes/no". Some might know that the Spartans had women inherit their men's wealth and became a major political power in the city simply by virtue of being super rich, even though they had zero political rights. Given that this game now has perma death for AI nobles, I think that kinda thing could be worked in and create many more interesting scenarios and/or min-maxing strategies.

 

[Androme1]

I said the game does not strive to be as realistic as possible, you said that... My point was that the exception is proof that they don't really try to to make it 100% realistic. But then if they decided to make females unrealistically represented in the army, they should also be among soldiers, not only leadership.

Alright, well, I completely disagree. I think they should also aim for realistic gender roles in leadership aswell. Especially with the more warlike factions, like the Khuzaits and Sturgians. I can understand Battanian female lords since they seem more decentralized and less reliant on hierarchical systems (as evident by their faction description), so some female lords for the Battanians makes sense in-universe, but in my opinion not for the other factions.

 

[Adrivan]

Alright, well, I completely disagree. I think they should also aim for realistic gender roles in leadership aswell. Especially with the more warlike factions, like the Khuzaits and Sturgians. I can understand Battanian female lords since they seem more decentralized and less reliant on hierarchical systems (as evident by their faction description), so some female lords for the Battanians makes sense in-universe, but in my opinion not for the other factions.

I understand but I think the developers want to give the possibility to female players to also enjoy the game. Seeing some role models to relate to (female warrios) in the game, will probably improve their experience. Reality is different, yes, but in a fantasy world everyone can be a hero. Maybe in bannerlord females are just as strong as males biologically, who knows? If that is the case then it makes sense to see them as soldiers.