With Fire & Sword: Questions and Answers

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XCram said:
OMG, what are you talking about...  :dead:
Are you working in Taleworlds to be that sure about licensing issues ?  :facepalm:

I don't need to work for Taleworlds to understand commercial realities. Business is driven by finance, not fantasy.

And why do we need WSE to upgrade WFaS engine ?  :shock:
WSE is a third-party program and nothing more  :roll:

WSE adds substancially more operations to the engine than those added by an upgrade from 1.143 to 1.172 and allows access to external data stores.


Are you sure ?  :???:

Are you being deliberately patronising? Of course I know what I am saying and mean what I say.

So, if we need to update WFaS, we need to buy a new engine license from Taleworlds along with some kind of permission from Snowbird.
I hope the price will be lower considering the approaching Bannerlord release.

Who do you mean by we? I've already told you that I'm happy with WFaS as it is. Upgrading WFaS is your dream, not mine.
 
XCram said:
But wait, aren't you trying to make a mod using that outdated engine ?

if you are so keen at talking about modding, why don't you visit the Forge? A warning tho, so far all your posts were very inaccurate. You may benefit from reading some guides/tutorials if you are a inspiring modder.

Cheers
 
I don't need to work for Taleworlds to understand commercial realities. Business is driven by finance, not fantasy.

Sorry for my 'patronising', but are you sure you understand the difference between 'commercial realities' (for example, all people buy or sell smth) and 'licensing issues' (i.e. some people agreed to distribute their work under certain conditions) ?
Since I can't find any info about Taleworlds licensing from an open sources, I was very surprised by your confidence  :???:

WSE adds substancially more operations to the engine than those added by an upgrade from 1.143 to 1.172 and allows access to external data stores.

Look, WSE is a classical 'hack', like many other extenders/enhancers for many other games... How could it 'adds operations to the engine' (?) It uses hidden engine capabilities, and nothing more  :roll:

Who do you mean by we? I've already told you that I'm happy with WFaS as it is. Upgrading WFaS is your dream, not mine.

Ok, be happy. But you somehow seem unhappy, sorry  :smile:
I'm just talking about the possibilities. I didn't mean you personally.

@kalarhan

if you are so keen at talking about modding, why don't you visit the Forge? A warning tho, so far all your posts were very inaccurate. You may benefit from reading some guides/tutorials if you are a inspiring modder.

Despite your post is very inaccurate with regard to the current topic, and moreover it's totally useless -- if you really want to know: I don't like talking about modding. I like modding itself. Also I don't like this entire forum, and I don't like advertise my mods here. Not just because of people like you. Just because I always get tired from a long conversation.
 
XCram said:
WSE adds substancially more operations to the engine than those added by an upgrade from 1.143 to 1.172 and allows access to external data stores.

Look, WSE is a classical 'hack', like many other extenders/enhancers for many other games... How could it 'adds operations to the engine' (?) It uses hidden engine capabilities, and nothing more  :roll:

Agreed WSE is a hack. However, it has opened up more of the warband engine than those  module system upgrades from version 1.143 to 1.172. No doubt the warband engine is capable of more, but its biggest limitation IMO is only being able to access 4gb of RAM, which limits battle size, map size, mesh details, texture resolution etc. Those limitations caused lots of modders to abandon projects and wait for Bannerlord.
Sadly, their expectations about Bannerlord's release date were overly optimistic. There was plenty of time to have made and played those mods in Warband/WFaS/VC etc.


PS on keeping me or other people happy, think twice before using face palm emoticons, which suggest their comments are ridiculous.
 
Agreed WSE is a hack. However, it has opened up more of the warband engine than those  module system upgrades from version 1.143 to 1.172.

Well, absolutely not. Again, you can check it yourself, comparing WSE + WFaS with Warband.
In general, I don't like crutches like WSE. I think most of its functions can be easily duplicated using standard, but more tricky code. For example, dynamical changing skins (bodies). I.e., as you said, 'making life easier for coders'. It's just about WSE.

No doubt the warband engine is capable of more, but its biggest limitation IMO is only being able to access 4gb of RAM, which limits battle size, map size, mesh details, texture resolution etc. Those limitations caused lots of modders to abandon projects and wait for Bannerlord.

I'm not one of those modders who are interested in making resources incredibly huge. I'm primarily interested in the functionality. Or improved physics.
Yes, about a year ago I decided to stop and wait for Bannerlord release. However, I couldn't wait long, and resumed my activity early this year  :smile:
Anyway, I need to do something first, for transferring to Bannerlord later.
Recently, I have tried to port my Native Improvements mod to WFaS, and encountered significant limitations of the WFaS engine. Since I need WFaS global map and WFaS resources, I can't just use them in the latest Warband engine.
That's why I need updated WFaS engine...

PS on keeping me or other people happy, think twice before using face palm emoticons, which suggest their comments are ridiculous.

Ok, noted.
Do you allow me to use this  :roll: and this  :???: and this  :shock: ?
:fruity: :lol:
 
XCram said:
Recently, I have tried to port my Native Improvements mod to WFaS, and encountered significant limitations of the WFaS engine. Since I need WFaS global map and WFaS resources, I can't just use them in the latest Warband engine.
That's why I need updated WFaS engine...

You could ask Snowbird's permission to use some of their WFaS assets in Warband. Their developers have previously granted at least one modder permission to use some specific models outside of WFaS.

Ok, noted.
Do you allow me to use this  :roll: and this  :???: and this  :shock: ?
:fruity: :lol:

You can communicate however you wish, just bear in mind how it affects those on the receiving end. :grin:
 
You could ask Snowbird's permission to use some of their WFaS assets in Warband. Their developers have previously granted at least one modder permission to use some specific models outside of WFaS.

Yes, but I don't need just some models.
Not to mention it's a bit tricky to make Snowbird respond to someone  :lol:
 
XCram said:
You could ask Snowbird's permission to use some of their WFaS assets in Warband. Their developers have previously granted at least one modder permission to use some specific models outside of WFaS.

Yes, but I don't need just some models.
Not to mention it's a bit tricky to make Snowbird respond to someone  :lol:

True.

What missing operations stopped you importing your Warband improvements into WFaS?
 
True.

What missing operations stopped you importing your Warband improvements into WFaS?

Well, not a single... pile of missed operations can stop me !  :fruity:  :lol:
(In fact, I have already ported most of the features, and you can find it on moddb as WFaS Improvements mod.)
But still it would be much more interesting with using 'scene props' in single-player. It's the most important thing.
Also I need some important operations, e.g. add_missile, prop_instance_deform_to_time, agent_ai_get_num_cached_enemies, set_shader_param_* operations, game_key_get_mapped_key_name, set_camera_in_first_person, agent_get_ammo_for_slot, item_get_* operations and some other, less important.
 
XCram said:
True.

What missing operations stopped you importing your Warband improvements into WFaS?

Well, not a single... pile of missed operations can stop me !  :fruity:  :lol:
(In fact, I have already ported most of the features, and you can find it on moddb as WFaS Improvements mod.)
But still it would be much more interesting with using 'scene props' in single-player. It's the most important thing.
Also I need some important operations, e.g. add_missile, prop_instance_deform_to_time, agent_ai_get_num_cached_enemies, set_shader_param_* operations, game_key_get_mapped_key_name, set_camera_in_first_person, agent_get_ammo_for_slot, item_get_* operations and some other, less important.

Scene props can be used in single player. Dr Tomas used them to implement artillery for Twilight of the Sun King back in 2013. He's since made his code open source. It ported to my WFaS mod OK. It's also used by L'Aigle.
 
Scene props can be used in single player. Dr Tomas used them to implement artillery for Twilight of the Sun King back in 2013. He's since made his code open source. It ported to my WFaS mod OK. It's also used by L'Aigle.

:shock:
Could you please show me a single screenshot ?
 
XCram said:
Ok, but where is using here ?  :???:
I need using inside ti_on_scene_prop_use trigger. If you mean you can use it -->somehow<-- inside mission_templates triggers -- I know it.

It doesn't use ti_on_scene_prop_use. The artillery is controlled by the AI, not hands-on by the player. A player can only give artillery orders such as fire, hold fire etc.

If you want to recognise when a player interacts with a scene prop, could you give the player a key to press, which will only activate the prop when he/she is close enough?
 
It doesn't use ti_on_scene_prop_use. The artillery is controlled by the AI, not hands-on by the player. A player can only give artillery orders such as fire, hold fire etc.

Of course, it doesn't. I see.
I need just using inside ti_on_scene_prop_use.

If you want to recognise when a player interacts with a scene prop, could you give the player a key to press, which will only activate the prop when he/she is close enough?

Yes, easily. (It was in some early versions of my mod.)
I don't like this method.
Since I have useable doors, fireplaces, ladders, clothes and maybe some other things -- I need a single, proper method of using. Not a confusing  :smile:
 
XCram said:
It doesn't use ti_on_scene_prop_use. The artillery is controlled by the AI, not hands-on by the player. A player can only give artillery orders such as fire, hold fire etc.

Of course, it doesn't. I see.
I need just using inside ti_on_scene_prop_use.

If you want to recognise when a player interacts with a scene prop, could you give the player a key to press, which will only activate the prop when he/she is close enough?

Yes, easily. (It was in some early versions of my mod.)
I don't like this method.
Since I have useable doors, fireplaces, ladders, clothes and maybe some other things -- I need a single, proper method of using. Not a confusing  :smile:

Lots of games expect players to hit the same key to use different objects. Players are used to it. You've just got to test which prop they're next to and trying to use.
 
Lots of games expect players to hit the same key to use different objects. Players are used to it. You've just got to test which prop they're next to and trying to use.

No, being just next to object could be confusing. Player should look at an object and receive some graphical message.
 
XCram said:
Lots of games expect players to hit the same key to use different objects. Players are used to it. You've just got to test which prop they're next to and trying to use.

No, being just next to object could be confusing. Player should look at an object and receive some graphical message.

In a scene, if you approach a horse that's more difficult to ride than your skill level you get a warning message even if you don't try to mount it. Maybe you use a similar trick to give players an appropriate message when they are near a triggerable prop.
 
In a scene, if you approach a horse that's more difficult to ride than your skill level you get a warning message even if you don't try to mount it. Maybe you use a similar trick to give players an appropriate message when they are near a triggerable prop.

:meh:
Look, I used this method more than 2 years ago (as tutorial_message). I don't want to return to it. Because we have an updated Warband engine.
And if we still don't have updated WFaS engine -- I'm going to use my time on asking 'why' rather than getting back to some crooked methods. After all, there are many other directions of the mod developing.
 
good sire..
can you help me find this mod.
so in the past i play M&B wfas, and it has a features for ordering musketers to fire by row.
but i recently download and play W&B wfas 1143 version, but the fire orders only had ; fire left, right or middle flank.
anyone can help me with this?
 
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