(With Dev Replies) Development Now Feels Slower than Ever ... Do I Detect Another Code Refactor?

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fysaga

Sergeant Knight at Arms
WB
Why dont we have the option to send divisions against other specific divisions, like infantry specifically attacking other infantry ? Also blunt damage bypassing armour is quite broken, and armour needs better pricing or else it wont show up ingame. Could also defend a bit better.
Thanks for the replies guys.
 

svelok

Sergeant
If a party's tactics skill is so influential on how the battle plays out, it should probably be displayed somewhere on the pre-battle screen, the same as troop counts?
 

Calabanar

Sergeant
If a party's tactics skill is so influential on how the battle plays out, it should probably be displayed somewhere on the pre-battle screen, the same as troop counts?
Good idea, though I will add that it should be probably be in the form of an addition to the battle screen on the world map such as:

The enemy general is a renowned commander
The enemy general is known to be a competent commander
The enemy commander has the reputation of having the tactical sense of a cow.

Just for immersion sake.
 

Apocal

Grandmaster Knight
If a party's tactics skill is so influential on how the battle plays out, it should probably be displayed somewhere on the pre-battle screen, the same as troop counts?
In practice, it is really hard to see the difference in the tactics.
 

Calabanar

Sergeant
In practice, it is really hard to see the difference in the tactics.
True, I mean, for the first time in my 500 hours I finally saw an army retreat when they were clearly beat today (700 vs 400, 500 dead on their side, 70 on ours).

It should have a noticeable effect much more often.
 

Blood Gryphon

Master Knight
WBVC
True, I mean, for the first time in my 500 hours I finally saw an army retreat when they were clearly beat today (700 vs 400, 500 dead on their side, 70 on ours).

It should have a noticeable effect much more often.
So I believe the retreat thing is actually a recent change that lets high tier troops actually retreat now.

These tactics limits seem to be so low that they barely impact AI combat lords. I still need to do my own research on tactic skill levels, but from @Stromming research last August, it seems only 9 combat lords have less than 60 tactics at the start of the game.
Count of how many party leaders per faction and what tactic skill they have
Party Leadery
Count of NobleColumn Labels
Tactic SkillAseraiBattaniaKhuzaitNorthern EmpireSouthern EmpireSturgiaVlandiaWestern EmpireGrand Total
60
1​
2​
1​
2​
2​
3​
3​
14​
80
3​
4​
5​
3​
5​
3​
6​
3​
32​
100
4​
3​
9​
2​
6​
11​
5​
1​
41​
120
7​
2​
5​
3​
6​
3​
3​
7​
36​
140
2​
7​
3​
6​
2​
4​
6​
6​
36​
160
3​
2​
2​
2​
2​
11​
180
1​
1​
2​
200
2​
2​
0
1​
1​
1​
3​
3​
9​
Grand Total
21​
21​
23​
19​
24​
26​
25​
24​
183​


Btw key word up there is Combat Lord, last time I check there were 343 adult nobles at the start of the game, so there are probably ~160 nobles that are steward nobles (most females) that likely have very low to no tactic skill.

I still want to do some more research on if these steward nobles ever gain enough tactics over time to break into these higher tactic formations.
 

Calabanar

Sergeant
So I believe the retreat thing is actually a recent change that lets high tier troops actually retreat now.

If it's a recent addition, I am very fond of it, though still: it happens very rarely...
I am at around my 200th battle if not more at this point of my campaign.

On another note, does the tactics skill influence the Ai above the 60 point margin?
 

Blood Gryphon

Master Knight
WBVC
If it's a recent addition, I am very fond of it, though still: it happens very rarely...
I am at around my 200th battle if not more at this point of my campaign.
Yeah I've only seen a full army retreat twice.
On another note, does the tactics skill influence the Ai above the 60 point margin?
So no and yes. From what dejan just told us, no for player battles. But in every other AI vs AI battle it is auto-calc'd so the below applies to them.

Tactics skill:
Simulation advantage: +0.1% per level
Decrease the sacrificed troop number when trying to get away 0.1% per level
 

Calabanar

Sergeant
Yeah I've only seen a full army retreat twice.

So no and yes. From what dejan just told us, no for player battles. But in every other AI vs AI battle it is auto-calc'd so the below applies to them.

Tactics skill:
Simulation advantage: +0.1% per level
Decrease the sacrificed troop number when trying to get away 0.1% per level
Thank you for the explanation.

Hopefully any big improvements on player battle AI will get incoporated to commanders with higher tactics skill.

Kind of wish there was a "coward" trait that would greatly increase the chances of retreating, and much more early.
 
Last edited:
Sure, I've discussed it with our mission wizard Burak and he was more than happy to oblige. Here's the list but keep in mind that it can change during EA.

no skill/no general hero:

Tactic Charge => everybody charges

general tactic skill 20 unlocks:

Attacking or defending:
Tactic Full Scale Attack => approach enemy in organized fashion and engage in melee, cavalry flanks etc.

Only when attacking:
Tactic Ranged Harrassment => approach to the effective range of our ranged formation and pepper enemy with ranged weapons; utilized in case of missile superiority

Only when defending:
Tactic Defensive Engagement => Choose terrain with advantageous slope to enemy approach and hold defensive position
Tactic Defensive Line => Choose a suitable tactical line(among those marked in scene) such as edge of a forest, side of a hill etc. depending on enemy approach direction and hold defensive line

general tactic skill 50 unlocks:

Attacking or defending:
Tactic Frontal Cavalry Charge => Approach in organized fashion with cavalry in center front, charge with cavalry and engage disorganized enemy with infantry and ranged; utilized in case of cavalry superiority/cavalry based army

Only when attacking:
Tactic Coordinated Retreat => Try to retreat to mission border in organized fashion before running away instead of being routed in case of a battle went wrong

Only when defending:
Tactic Defensive Ring => Choose a suitable position(among regions marked in scene) that can impede enemy cavalry movement such as in woods or swamp or difficult terrain and form infantry ring around ranged and hold; utilized in case of suitable numbers of infantry, ranged and enemy cavalry superiority
Tactic Hold Choke Point => Choose a suitable choke point(among positions marked in scene) and try to keep enemy confined to one side of it, depending on terrain, allowing ranged to take higher positions such as cliffs and riverbanks(among such marked in scene) not directly behind infantry cover, expecting the infantry to bar enemy reaching them; utilized in case of numerical disadvantage.

Pretty please Dejan, bring up this question on the next meeting:

How can we relay all this info to the player on an expanded tutorial? Use images/pictures/videos to make it succint. A good game that makes it easy to learn is FrostPunk, free now on Epic Gamestore.
 
Sure, I've discussed it with our mission wizard Burak and he was more than happy to oblige. Here's the list but keep in mind that it can change during EA.

no skill/no general hero:

Tactic Charge => everybody charges

general tactic skill 20 unlocks:

Attacking or defending:
Tactic Full Scale Attack => approach enemy in organized fashion and engage in melee, cavalry flanks etc.

Only when attacking:
Tactic Ranged Harrassment => approach to the effective range of our ranged formation and pepper enemy with ranged weapons; utilized in case of missile superiority

Only when defending:
Tactic Defensive Engagement => Choose terrain with advantageous slope to enemy approach and hold defensive position
Tactic Defensive Line => Choose a suitable tactical line(among those marked in scene) such as edge of a forest, side of a hill etc. depending on enemy approach direction and hold defensive line

general tactic skill 50 unlocks:

Attacking or defending:
Tactic Frontal Cavalry Charge => Approach in organized fashion with cavalry in center front, charge with cavalry and engage disorganized enemy with infantry and ranged; utilized in case of cavalry superiority/cavalry based army

Only when attacking:
Tactic Coordinated Retreat => Try to retreat to mission border in organized fashion before running away instead of being routed in case of a battle went wrong

Only when defending:
Tactic Defensive Ring => Choose a suitable position(among regions marked in scene) that can impede enemy cavalry movement such as in woods or swamp or difficult terrain and form infantry ring around ranged and hold; utilized in case of suitable numbers of infantry, ranged and enemy cavalry superiority
Tactic Hold Choke Point => Choose a suitable choke point(among positions marked in scene) and try to keep enemy confined to one side of it, depending on terrain, allowing ranged to take higher positions such as cliffs and riverbanks(among such marked in scene) not directly behind infantry cover, expecting the infantry to bar enemy reaching them; utilized in case of numerical disadvantage.

Are there plans to include any additional tactical combinations unlocked at levels above 50? I know there are some lords with much higher levels and this could make them an interesting challenge/welcomed ally during battles.
 

vonbalt

Sergeant Knight
WBNWVCM&B
Are there plans to include any additional tactical combinations unlocked at levels above 50? I know there are some lords with much higher levels and this could make them an interesting challenge/welcomed ally during battles.
yeah that system is cool but it's too limited for now, there needs to be better strategies unlocked throughout the entire tactics skill tree instead of just the first few levels to make it more interesting.
 

loxley86

Refactors happen all the time and are a continuous part of most projects.
could you please setup some community outreach people who actually do their jobs - there's a 1000 MP players who have been ignored for 40 days now - are you folks losing money yet?
 

Calabanar

Sergeant
could you please setup some community outreach people who actually do their jobs - there's a 1000 MP players who have been ignored for 40 days now - are you folks losing money yet?
That was pointlessly rude and dumb, Duh is a nice guy that already does more than he should communicating with us.
 

Stromming

Sergeant at Arms
WBWF&SNWVC
You think TW has good communication?
No, but it's also not Duh's job to communicate with us. He could stop it whenever he wanted since he's not a community manager.
It is important that we blame the right people, and the devs and even community managers to some extent are not the right people.

The people we should blame for poor communication is the people we never see on the forum, TW management.
 
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